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Hi there over the last few years I have been collecting OOn3 Irish Narrow Gauge stock built up a large ish collection so would like to a build a layout so any ideas for a 4x2 shunting type layout must of the stock is Cavan @ Leitrim but some of it is Tralee and Dingle I have looked up the C&L but cannot find anything any ideas ??

Thanks in advance

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The Ulster and Connaught has always been an idea worth considering. Never happened of course, but a trans Ireland narrow gauge link from Newry to Clifden offers you a wealth of 'might have beens.' The U&C would have used the C&L as part of its route, so setting your layout somewhere nearby, or just inventing a name would be a decent option.

 As for track plans, there are plenty to choose from, though Iain Rice has done lots with his latest Cameo Layouts book a good start.

 A personal favourite is having a 'terminus junction' with the fork just off scene, or a second line trailing in from the fiddle yard that can serve anything from a harbour branch to a standard gauge exchange siding.

 

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Posted (edited)

I have often thought (and once built, longer ago than I care to consider) that a harbour branch makes a good small 'shunting plank' type of set-up, it can be rural or among quayside buildings, and waterfront is always atmospheric' Having water wholly or partly behind it on the backscene (as with Arun Quay or Shell Island) can really open out a small layout.

I did think that the Ulster and Connaught might give a base for a fairly freelance such set-up - maybe a branch from near the Western end to a small port (looking especially at Roundstone, a photogenic place I think, though I've never had the pleasure of going there - but it reminds me of Cornwall so it must be good).

 

Edited by johnminnitt

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Most Irish narrow gauge lines carried smallish amounts of traffic, so a shunting layout wouldn't prototypically allow much action. There were exceptions - I always thought Letterkenny (CDR) might be suitable.

The beauty about the CIE lines is that if based in the later part of the 1950s, stock from a number of lines can run together as on the C & L and West Clare. Depending on space, maybe an Arigna / Drumshanbo set-up with coal trains being shunted? Something based on Ennis, Dromod or Belturbet allows the added interest of a broad gauge interchange. 

Dingle allows busy periods with cattle trains shunting, while Castlegregory was a very compact terminus. While it closed long before CIE days, a little poetic licence might see it survive later, receiving stock from other closed lines too. The same could be said of Schull.

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Good to see that I am not alone in my 3' gauge interests and the C&L at that!.

A TT or OOn3 layout takes up roughly 3/4 the space of a OO gauge layout so 4' is a bit tight length wise for a station yard or an Inglenook https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inglenook_Sidings or Timesave shunting puzzles https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timesaver.

A quay side Timesaver based on the planned C&L extension to Rooskey & the Shannon shipping services would make an interesting shunting layout

My own layout Keadue is an L shape terminus to fiddle yard layout with the station on a pair of 4X1 baseboards. The original plan was to model Drumshanbo but I did not have the space, the layout is intended to operate as a through terminus like Fivemiletown on the Clogher Valley with trains from Sligo/Boyle & Ballinamore terminating at Keadue (except for the coal specials)

Keadue track layout.jpg

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Thanks for the advice Gents I will look into the Ulster & Connaught railway has it sounds like they is some scope for a bit of freelancing the layout would be based in the 50’s more scope for mixing stock 

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If the U & C had been built, and survived into the 1950s, you've joint CIE and UTA ownership. Ballycastle 2.4.2T tanks mingling with C & L, Dingle and West Clare types?  It couldn't have functioned without the type of large tender engines the Lough Swilly had....

Food indeed for thought.

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Indeed, JB - I can easily start salivating at the thought! Not enough space to do it justice though.

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Would there have been joint ownership? Wouldn't it have been like the Donegal or Swilly - cross-border and so staying separate?

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3 hours ago, johnminnitt said:

Would there have been joint ownership? Wouldn't it have been like the Donegal or Swilly - cross-border and so staying separate?

Its an interesting question, it depends really on whether the Ulster & Connaught managed to merge or simply work the Clogher Valley & Cavan & Leitrim

The situation in Northern Ireland would have been fairly simple with the Ulster and Connaught continuing to work the lines in the Province until 1948 or when it became too unprofitable to continue in operation or decided to become a cross-border bus company. The Clogher Valley closed in 1941 when Stormont bought out the 5% dividend guaranteed in perpetuity (by the local ratepayers & government) on the original company shares. The Bessbrook & Newry survived until 1948. It difficulty to see how Bawnboy Road-Maguiresbridge & Tynan-Bessbrook would have been built survived for very long without some form of Government guarantee on capital or operating subsidy

If the U&C simply worked the C&L the GSR would have absorbed the line and collected its 5% dividend until 1934 before making a decision on the future of the line.

The Baronial Guarantees were a bit like current day public private partnerships to finance infrastructure projects the Government & Councils provided a 5% guaranteed dividend in perpetuity on the issued capital and was also responsible for making good any operating losses on the undertaking, if things got really bad and the company goes broke the Council took over responsibility for managing and operating the undertaking, but was still required to pay the 5% dividend to the original shareholders.

This happened with several companies including Clogher Valley, Schull & Skibbereen & Tralee and Dingle, the C&L managed just about to stay outside this category, though the 5% dividends to the shareholders (Local gentry) were a sore point in Leitrim.

 

 

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Thanks for the info gents I cannot find much about the U&C so is there anymore info on it just want a ideas for the line route and see if I can fit my layout in to it 

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Nice loco, although I think you mean Branchlines rather than Backwoods? To the best of my knowledge, Backwoods never produced a T&D loco kit...

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On 4/10/2018 at 4:22 PM, NarrowGauge said:

Thanks for the info gents I cannot find much about the U&C so is there anymore info on it just want a ideas for the line route and see if I can fit my layout in to it 

I copied this from some book years ago, don't recall which. I'm sure someone here could tell you.

UCLR.doc

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Yes my bad it is branchlines 

9 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

An absolute beauty!  Looks well made.

Yes it is what kick started my 00n3 addiction 

 

9 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

An absolute beauty!  Looks well made.

 

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That book was Fayle's "Narrow Gauge Railways of Ireland", published in 1947. A very rare beast indeed, with many rare photos. I have a much-prized copy in my catacomb-like archive......

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That book was Fayle's "Narrow Gauge Railways of Ireland", published in 1947. A very rare beast indeed, with many rare photos. I have a much-prized copy in my catacomb-like archive......

I think I have found it ?? Could you please comfirm

A375ED62-A74B-4CEA-B887-6B75E1F6C37D.png

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 That's the one! And a mighty good condition one too, by the look of it. Snap it up, it's a rare gem!

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On 4/11/2018 at 3:35 AM, NarrowGauge said:

92A12037-6302-468D-B812-DFE1F3155BB0.thumb.jpeg.916b16f618a99edb57e812262b477aa9.jpegimageproxy.php?img=&key=ac96cff20d889157Thought I would show a picture of my backwoods T&D no 3 for my proposed 00n3 layout imageproxy.php?img=&key=ac96cff20d889157

5ad1550ecac34_4mmRollingStock052.thumb.jpg.2d51c65052083523468f56f6eb258fa3.jpg

Snap. Very nice model as running on the Tralee & Dingle in GSR days.  Same loco as running on the C&L in the late 1950s I need to do something with the front buffer beam pushed out by the Micro-Trains coupler pocket

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OK, let's have a gallery of them.

No 3 in her early years on the C&L, while she still had the cast numberplate. (ie still looking as in her later T&D days)

image.jpeg.f423f28b762167ba6e6b7fd2f9e628c2.jpeg

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Sounds like a plan I wish there was more Narrow Gauge on here some nice models they Gents nice to see other OOn3 models coming out of the cupboards

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For a smallish shunting layout Castlederg has a lot going for it,plenty of operational interest,all the coaches brakes and most of the wagonry available as kits as well as the railcar (a nice beginners  kit with a ready to run chassis available)No6 available as a complete kit nb not the Branchlines kit which advertises itself as such but the GEM one for IOM11-13.Its one of the few Irish lines which the PECO 12mm points look right with(bit too tight a radius for most).Whats more 4 and 5 are pretty easy to scratchbuild.Incidently it looks like i'm bringing Castlederg over for the Cultra model railway show  on the 10th of november(Land Rover willing) Andy.

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21 minutes ago, Andy Cundick said:

For a smallish shunting layout Castlederg has a lot going for it,plenty of operational interest,all the coaches brakes and most of the wagonry available as kits as well as the railcar (a nice beginners  kit with a ready to run chassis available)No6 available as a complete kit nb not the Branchlines kit which advertises itself as such but the GEM one for IOM11-13.Its one of the few Irish lines which the PECO 12mm points look right with(bit too tight a radius for most).Whats more 4 and 5 are pretty easy to scratchbuild.Incidently it looks like i'm bringing Castlederg over for the Cultra model railway show  on the 10th of november(Land Rover willing) Andy.

Right ok thanks for the info good luck getting there in the Landy

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Here's a couple for the gallery, a chap is modelling OOn3 and I had them in the shop for repairs;-

A lovely Class 5 Tank requiring attention to dropped valve gear

1005153369_C5T-01IMAG3362.jpg.5f805b469180928c484ec93ec3fd7ea4.jpg

344731236_C5T-02IMAG3356.jpg.b77c4518c3c2597aec055bc9eb4d8528.jpg

186178193_C5T-02IMAG3357.jpg.5b4a614d5a70d13f2d0ba331c175dc42.jpg

and a 2-4-0 chassis requiring a new motor and full restoration, not sure what goes on top of this! but this might spur him on to post up pictures of other stuff?

50584974_2-4-0OOn3-02IMAG3843.jpg.4f6cc202a99f7461b1195a1309d19438.jpg

1799674680_2-4-0OOn3-01IMAG3844.jpg.919c7c5a290818d26899425af1565242.jpg

Eoin

 

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4 minutes ago, murrayec said:

1799674680_2-4-0OOn3-01IMAG3844.jpg.919c7c5a290818d26899425af1565242.jpg

Eoin

 

Space for a flywheel?

What make is that track?

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Just now, Broithe said:

Space for a flywheel?

What make is that track?

Hi Broithe

Not sure about a flywheel, have to wait till he has a look- the blown motor had the shaft completely cut back!

and not sure about the make of track he gave it to me for testing, it's nicely made with the metal shoes and slim sleepers but the rails are a bit chunky to my eye, though I will ask on make and report back...

Eoin

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Looks like a well-built loco; the prototypes were elegant machines. Love the jacks stowed either side of the smokebox!

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