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IRM Stocking Murphy Models 121 Locomotives!

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5 hours ago, enniscorthyman said:

While I did not buy any Grey 121s(yet)A friend arrived at my house from north Wexford with 121 and a sound chip installed.So we wasted no time and Bog Road Level Crossing got its first 121 running.A very impressive  machine and the sound is superb.The layout is undergoing scenery  work at the moment.

Hi Eamonn. Layout looking fab, shows off the 121 really well. Do you mind me asking which sound chip was that, the MM LokSound, or Mr SoundGuy Zimo? Sounds, great.

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3 hours ago, enniscorthyman said:

Hi Noel,that's the new Murphy 645 later sound chip.

Sounds great. Happy Days, B134 arrived this morning from Accurascale's UK base, but the sound decoder must be a day or two behind. Will try run a Lenz 21pin for now.  Had a look inside the decoder bay, it is tight in there alright. Love the see through side grills on this loco.

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Took B135 out for a test drive. Beautiful gearing and smooth motor, even better than the mythical 141/181 drive systems. 

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The best yet from Murphy Models. Sublime. I put the valance cover on the cab end and kadee no 20 coupling on the bonnet end. Needed a simple plastic shim fitted in the NEM pocket to avoid the kadee drooping. All good with the height gauge and coupling tests. Super smooth runner with an even better motor drive than the legendary 141/181s. Tried it on DC first before DCC. Gorgeous model.  Will give B134 a run in the next few days, might even try the paid bonnet2bonnet in consist even though the grey 121s never double headed in reality. Nice detailing pack but handle with extreme care.

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I do like B135 with its original 196l layout as per delivery and early years of operation until walkway grab rails were added near the end of the black'n'tan era. An exquisite result, worth the wait, thanks to Murphy Models. The best yet from that stable, and it runs as well as it looks. Superb. 

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Congrats to MM for the "crème de la crème" of their loco portfolio. It looks and runs so well you could lick it. Love the see through ventilation grills on the bonnet sides, that's a first for any Irish model loco.

Edited by Noel
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22 hours ago, connollystn said:

It's a brilliant model. Didn't think I'd bother with the grey version until I saw it in the flesh. I'm in awe of how great it looks, took my breath away. Hope it's detailed enough to keep the Irish railway modeller extremists happy. 

Personally I have always liked the grey/yellow version and got great reactions over the time I ran my MIR version on "Ballybeg" at exhibitions! Crude compared with MM but this was completed back in 2008.

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Oh great joy. Just ran B135 and B134 in consist hauling 1960s goods train. Took only seconds to pop Lenz Silver+ 21pin non-sound decoders in the pair. Perfectly matched. Oh Yummie, these 121s were worth the wait. I'll probably fall off my perch when the Black'n'Tan livery versions arrive.

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6 hours ago, Noel said:

Oh great joy. Just ran B135 and B134 in consist hauling 1960s goods train. Took only seconds to pop Lenz Silver+ 21pin non-sound decoders in the pair. Perfectly matched. Oh Yummie, these 121s were worth the wait. I'll probably fall off my perch when the Black'n'Tan livery versions arrive.

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Wait 'till you hear the sound project it is really impressive!

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19 hours ago, Irishrailwayman said:

Personally I have always liked the grey/yellow version and got great reactions over the time I ran my MIR version on "Ballybeg" at exhibitions! Crude compared with MM but this was completed back in 2008.

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Gerry, having seen your lovely grey livery B121 in the flesh on Ballybeg, I can attest that it turned out a super model, especially for a MIR kit. It really looked the part and greatly surpassed the 2ft rule. You can run it proudly alongside B135 or B134 and it will not look out of place. Your colouring was spot on.

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On 9/17/2020 at 11:20 PM, DiveController said:

Oh that's class, Eamonn @enniscorthyman.

Surprised by how many people are impressed with a somewhat 'discounted' livery.

Exposure to this fine machine begets its own set of admirers (and buyers).

 I'm betting that there are gonna be a lot of people buying green and black, & BnT liveried A classes when they're seen too

Green? :) Now I'm sure somebody at some stage may respray one in current intercity green'n'grey livery just because the can. Personally I'm really looking forward to the B&T version.

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Hi everyone,

Latest news from Murphy Models is that the  CIE  black’n’tan (MM0125, MM0131) and IR 121s (MM0127, MM0130, MM0133) will ship at the end of Sept.

The CIE Supertrain (MM0126, MM0132) and IE (MM0124, MM0129, MM0134) will ship at the end of Oct.

We are still awaiting to receive our stock of chips from Murphy Models and will ship them out as soon as they come in.

order here: https://irishrailwaymodels.com/collections/murphy-models-class-121-locomotive

Cheers!

Fran

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6 hours ago, murphaph said:

The prime mover in the sound file sounds very similar to the 8-645E available on the ESU website:

http://projects.esu.eu/projectoverviews/search?q=8-645

(ESU bizarrely have no SSL)

OK. I picked up one of the 567 decoders from Mark's Models yesterday and have spent the morning tinkering with it. Now let me say right off the bat, it sounds excellent! But the soundfile is not bespoke, apart from the horn it basically uses this file: 

http://projects.esu.eu/projectoverviews/search?q=8-567

A more prototypical horn has replaced the US one, but it's the same file. I suspect the EMD 645 is the file that Murphaph has linked to above.

By the way I installed the MM decoder into one of my 141's to test it out. These work fine with the 141/181's without the need for any adjustments. F0 controls the lights as expected so these decoders are perfect if you also want sound in your other locos.

One other thing, if you're used to running Loksound decoders using the Full Throttle features be warned that these decoders do not support those features out of the box. They also don't take full advantage of the new features unique to the V5.  Reprogramming them is simple enough but you really need the Lokprogrammer to do it. Trying this process by just adjusting CV's is not easy!

BTW this is not meant to bash MM in any way, the decoders work fine and sound great which is what is important. (I have 2 more on order anyway!) Just putting the info out for anyone who is interested!

Edited by irishthump
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It's fine like that IMO. Better to use a high quality ESU recording of the same prime mover in a very similar body (the recordings are from little US road switchers, which is basically what the 121 is), rather than use a less than optimal 121 recording.

@irishthump can you clarify if the full throttle features are not or are enabled by default? I think there's a small typo in your post which makes it unclear.

 

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Just now, murphaph said:

It's fine like that IMO. Better to use a high quality ESU recording of the same prime mover in a very similar body (the recordings are from little US road switchers, which is basically what the 121 is), rather than use a less than optimal 121 recording.

@irishthump can you clarify if the full throttle features are not or are enabled by default? I think there's a small typo in your post which makes it unclear.

 

Yes, the sounds on the ESU website are very recent, high quality recordings and the engines in both those switchers are identical to what's in the 141/121/181's

 

Sorry I corrected the typo! No, Full Throttle features are NOT activated in these decoders as delivered. But like I said, it's an easy task to turn them on with a Lokprogrammer. I just did it with my own decoder.

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On 9/14/2020 at 9:03 PM, WRENNEIRE said:

From a conversation some time back with PM, I seem to recall that the cylindrical thingy is a speedometer that fits to the rotational part of the axel on the left hand side of the loco, cab forward, you will need to prise out the cover off the axel . The speedo does not rotate , the bag of extras is a generic bag that will have some bits for the various models being issued, not all the bits will go on every loco

Thank, was wondering what that was for. Dave do you know if there are any plans for instructions or a PDF on the MM website for servicing and maintenance, fitting of detail parts, etc. Small slip of paper comes with the loco with basic info but no diagrams like the 141/181/071s. Thanks. Noel

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PS: Purely for info today out of curiosity I took a LokSound V5 21pin 141 decoder out of B165 and popped it into a MM 121 and it worked ok including the ESU full throttle drive features (ie throttle hold, braking, etc). I could not drive a loco anymore that was not able to coast nor brake on command and be driven prototypically. Might pop short video clip up over next few days. It's a total feast of options available to Irish modellers. Going to layout now for a while to play and shunt wagons using B134 with kadee automatic uncoupling magnets to marshall a goods train in the yard.

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26 minutes ago, Noel said:

PS: Purely for info today out of curiosity I took a LokSound V5 21pin 141 decoder out of B165 and popped it into a MM 121 and it worked ok including the ESU full throttle drive features (ie throttle hold, braking, etc). I could not drive a loco anymore that was not able to coast nor brake on command and be driven prototypically. Might pop short video clip up over next few days. It's a total feast of options available to Irish modellers. Going to layout now for a while to play and shunt wagons using B134 with kadee automatic uncoupling magnets to marshall a goods train in the yard.

There's no reason the decoder would'nt work as normal in an 121 as opposed to a 141....

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Another thing to note about the MM121 decoder I bought yesterday....

The Loksound V5 is available in 2 versions - The V5 and the V5 DCC. There are some important differences between the two decoders...

The V5 is designed for the European market. It addition to DCC it works with other control protocols such as Marklin and Motorola which are more popular with European modellers - not really relevant to us! It also uses a multiplier of .25 for momentum settings similar to the V4. The vast majority of other brands of decoders use a multiplier of .896 and no one knows why ESU deviated from this when developing the V4.

What that means is that when you program acceleration or deceleration whatever value you enter into CV3 or CV4  if you multiply this value by .25 the result is the amount of seconds it takes for the loco to go from full speed to a dead stop. So a value of 100 in CV4 means the loco will take 25 seconds to come to a stop.

The V5 DCC is made primarily for the US market. It uses a momentum multiplier of .896 which is preferable on large layouts common in the US. 

Now, when I looked at the decoder I bought in my Lokprogrammer software it identified it as a V5 DCC. If the rest of the decoders supplied are all DCC5 it will mean that if you try to double head them with Loksound V4's your momentum settings will not match up.

It's a simple enough fix, simply take the value you have entered into your V4 and divide it by 3.6 and enter this value into the V5. This should result in the two different decoders being matched.

 

27 minutes ago, patrick said:

https://www.iascaled.com/protothrottle/        Have you seen this Noel. There are also some demo videos on You Tube.

Bloody stunning piece of engineering. Unfortunately, not available outside the US.

(I looked into it, believe me!!!)

Edited by irishthump
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33 minutes ago, irishthump said:

Another thing to note about the MM121 decoder I bought yesterday....

The Loksound V5 is available in 2 versions - The V5 and the V5 DCC. There are some important differences between the two decoders...

The V5 is designed for the European market. It addition to DCC it works with other control protocols such as Marklin and Motorola which are more popular with European modellers - not really relevant to us! It also uses a multiplier of .25 for momentum settings similar to the V4. The vast majority of other brands of decoders use a multiplier of .896 and no one knows why ESU deviated from this when developing the V4.

What that means is that when you program acceleration or deceleration whatever value you enter into CV3 or CV4  if you multiply this value by .25 the result is the amount of seconds it takes for the loco to go from full speed to a dead stop. So a value of 100 in CV4 means the loco will take 25 seconds to come to a stop.

The V5 DCC is made primarily for the US market. It uses a momentum multiplier of .896 which is preferable on large layouts common in the US. 

Now, when I looked at the decoder I bought in my Lokprogrammer software it identified it as a V5 DCC. If the rest of the decoders supplied are all DCC5 it will mean that if you try to double head them with Loksound V4's your momentum settings will not match up.

It's a simple enough fix, simply take the value you have entered into your V4 and divide it by 3.6 and enter this value into the V5. This should result in the two different decoders being matched.

 

Bloody stunning piece of engineering. Unfortunately, not available outside the US.

(I looked into it, believe me!!!)

Yummie. Outside USA should not be problem with AddressPal to get around that.

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  • 3 weeks later...
On 20/8/2020 at 4:16 PM, Noel said:

Not on DCC surely? I treat my 121s as if the cab end is the front end, its the first  bit on CV29 that controls direction. Few seconds to configure on most DCC controllers on the main or test track. When I press FWD on my cab my 121s start off cab first direction

What should the setting on cv29 be to reverse direction as when I went to change mine it was saying cv29=062

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18 minutes ago, PJR said:

What should the setting on cv29 be to reverse direction as when I went to change mine it was saying cv29=062

Try CV29=63 (ie to toggle the first CV29 bit, direction

If your DCC system doesn't have a setup menu for a loco that automates setting the various binary bits in CV29, try setting it to 63 (ie turn the first bit on). Swapping between 62 and 63 should change the direction bit.

62 = 0111110 = Direction bit is off but the next 5 bits 1-5 are all ON (see translation below)

 

Bit 0 Direction of operation is reversed 
        Direction of operation is normal

Bit 1 ON [1] = 28 Speed Step Mode
Bit 2 ON [1] = Analog mode operation enabled
Bit 3 is  Railcom and is usually ignored by the DCC system firmware.
Bit 4 ON [1] = Alternate Speed Curve Active 
Bit 5 ON [1] = Use long loco address

Edited by Noel
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18 minutes ago, Noel said:

Try CV29=63 (ie to toggle the first CV29 bit, direction

If your DCC system doesn't have a setup menu for a loco that automates setting the various binary bits in CV29, try setting it to 63 (ie turn the first bit on). Swapping between 62 and 63 should change the direction bit.

62 = 0111110 = Direction bit is off but the next 5 bits 1-5 are all ON (see translation below)

 

Bit 0 Direction of operation is reversed 
        Direction of operation is normal

Bit 1 ON [1] = 28 Speed Step Mode
Bit 2 ON [1] = Analog mode operation enabled
Bit 3 is  Railcom and is usually ignored by the DCC system firmware.
Bit 4 ON [1] = Alternate Speed Curve Active 
Bit 5 ON [1] = Use long loco address

Many thanks Noel and Dart 8118

It worked a dream and  did it on the programming track, again many thanks 

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