226 Abhann na Suire

I could be missing something but I always hear talk about how it’s not straightforward to run plonk down a platform at Adare and run passenger services to Limerick once in the morning and evening? And the same with why passenger services (temporarily until the M3 Parkway extension is eventually built) and even RPSI specials can’t use the Navan line…?
 

Freight trains are far more heavy than passenger trains so it can’t be a track weight issue… So what’s the problem with having to supposedly ‘upgrade’ a line to accommodate passenger traffic? Because the Foynes line when reopened would have some amazingly ideal locations for new purpose built TOD (transit oriented development) commuter towns for Limerick city… 

On 10/5/2024 at 11:56 AM, Broithe said:

Graffiti is a strange 'culture'. I know of a distributor road in a city on the Big Island, built in the 1970s with acres of concrete 'canvas' easily available on bridges, embankments, etc., and not a single spot of paint anywhere, in a city which is not 'unadorned' in general.

I only noticed this situation about a decade ago, but there is just nothing sprayed anywhere along the ten miles, and it is not due to any obstructed access.

I suspect that, if some ever does appear, there would be a rapid avalanche of other 'work' by 'competing artists'.

I am careful about who I mention this absence to, but nobody else has ever agreed that they had already noticed - you just don't spot what's not there, I suppose.

I did once spot a small paint mark at the base of a bridge parapet, but it turned out to be a road maintenance mark. I considered suggesting to the council that they might be careful, so as to not set off "tag wars".

I have to say I’m not completely opposed to graffiti (as long as it’s on a plain wall and not the side of a train…) as it can brighten up otherwise plain walls but I also concede that regularly that walls that they ‘brighten’ up are walls that the owner doesn’t want ‘brightened’ up and then has to pay to have it cleaned.

I do think however that an excellent way to stop potentially vulgar or unslightly graffiti-ing on large wall spaces where it’s not wanted is for the local council to commission artists to paint murals on those walls. A Waterford native myself, the Waterford Walls project has led to many many murals like these popping up (legally) on otherwise bland walls and has really brightened up the city and can actually act as a way for the graffiti-ists to do something constructive with their spray-paints!! 

It’s nearly a year at this stage since the draft came out, I wonder what’s taking the final report so long…

On 30/4/2024 at 5:38 AM, GSR 800 said:

The long ugly concrete brick 2 road structure directly adjacent to platform 1

 

Oh thank god hahaha I’ll be glad to see that go that’s for sure!

That’s brilliant!! Very exciting and they look very very well indeed! I was never mad about the orange triangle on the cabside of the artist’s impression images so I think this new livery looks much better without it.

A few queries though, does anyone know is there an immediate confirmed plan ready to go for the next phased order of trains…? I presume they’re waiting for the Maynooth depot to be built and line electrified before they order the next batch…? And where will this fleet be maintained between now and the Maynooth depot coming online? Does anyone know how the fast charging at Drogheda before the return journey will work…? The article says it’ll take ‘under an hour’ but with a proposed every-10-minute service, is this really doable?

They do look brilliant though and I have to say charging points at every seat is a huge plus too! And with their longer distance battery capabilities and wide scale operation, for once Ireland is out in front for public transport infrastructure!!

Surely a Jeep…?

7 hours ago, Mayner said:

The IE Signalling and Electrical Department demonstrated a degree of innovative and lateral thinking to allow the morning Limerick-Ballybrophy service to split mid-section in the Birdhill-Roscrea Block Section allowing the lead unit to continue to Ballybrophy and the trailing unit to return as the Nenagh-Limerick commuter train.

Nenagh was closed as a Block Post  with the signal cabin closed and crossing loop lifted in the cuts/rationalisation of the late 80s with the Block Section becoming Birdhill-Roscrea.

The S&E people got around the problem of a train splitting mid-section and the rear unit returning to Birdhill while the lead unit continued to Roscrea, by combining 19th Century signalling technology with 21st Century Industrial Safety Interlocking equipment.

The Lead Unit was classified as the Train and the Trailing Unit a 'Banker" assisting the 'The Train" to Nenagh in a similar manner to the way Steam Locos and sometimes Diesel railcars banked/assisted trains from Stranorlar to the summit of the Stranorlar-Donegal line in Barnesmore Gap before returning to Stranorlar.

The Birdhill-Nenagh 'Banking Staff' may have been an actual 'banking staff that survived from the steam era or possibly specially fabricated for the job, the S&E people managed to interface modern industrial 'safety interlocking" equipment with the existing electric staff instrument at Birdhill to allow the signaler at Birdhill to 'clear' the Birdhill-Roscrea section and release a staff when both the Lead Unit and the Banker had cleared the section.

Interestingly the Donegal apparently used to detach railcars from trains in the Barnesmore Gap area to allow staff to cut/harvest turf in the gap, the railcar returning the Stranorlar on the Banking Staff when the days work was done.

That’s intriguing, wow!! Just goes to show that what a bit of outside the (signal) box thinking can do!!

16 hours ago, Galteemore said:

Latest I heard is retrieval to Dublin by diesel. Shame - 131 is a cracking performer as that great video shows. Not the engine’s fault today apparently 

RPSI steam jaunts down the DSER seem to be cursed of late!! I know last years ‘Sea Breeze’ only made it beyond Greystones and the few the previous years also didn’t make it the whole way. I wonder what it is?? The ghost of Brunel…?

5 minutes ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Would still need an extra driver though right? And somone to detach the railcars 

Extra crew, yes, and that was possibly where the problem arose. Then again, a two car train arguably doesn’t need a conductor, now for the Nenagh branch where at the time, ticket machines were few and far between, a guard would be how lots of people got tickets, but today I don’t see why you couldn’t you could get away with two drivers, one for each set. All the uncoupling though as far as I’m aware was done from the cabs of the units so no staff needed there. Again though not 100% sure

I know that 2700 units used to be used in pairs on a Limerick to Nenagh service around the turn of the century where once reaching Nenagh, the set would split with one half continuing to Ballybrophy with the other half returning to Nenagh. Not sure why they stopped doing this kind of service, would be a great idea for these kinds of lines, ie Waterford to Clonmel and on to Limerick Jnct with one half returning to Waterford… 

And you’d wonder if with the year that’s in it will a retro 201 be to follow…?? A few more retro liveries would be great to brighten up the network!

Is there an official timed service…? Surely the RPSI would run a special you’d think? Awful shame that the 111’s are no longer passenger-stock-certified, would’ve been the perfect outing for them

1 hour ago, derek said:

Hi Oisin. Thanks for the reply, but I can't seem to download your videos. Thanks nonetheless  for taking time to upload them. From what you say in your reply, we seem to have similar set ups (and similar problems). I too use a pair of Hornby controllers. I have never had a problem before this with any of my locos. I have emailed IRM about it so we will see what develops. I wonder if anybody else is having this problem? (Although most probably use DCC) .Thanks again for the reply.

Derek

Not a bother Derek, happy to help if I can. Ohh ok that’s weird, I’m not sure  what happened there then, there’s not much to the videos though I was just demonstrating the sound it makes but looking at the video you have on the other thread, the sounds are similar.

Yes I’d say you’re dead right, it’s likely down to the controller. I’ve had a similar sounds off of other locos before so I presumed it was just the way certain locos sound on DC and didn’t see it as much of a problem, and to this day all of my stock runs perfectly. Do any of your other stock, MM or otherwise have similar issues? 

1 hour ago, Anders112 said:

Hi Derek and Oisin,my Irish rail 181 made a similar noise when I first ran it on my DC layout. Got worried like yourself thinking there was something wrong.

On the instructions it says you have to let the gear in the motor to bed in by running it for a hour in each direction without any load . Left it running for two hours and have noticed the noise has faded significantly

hope this helps

thanks 

Dave 

Ahh ok well that’s it then I’d say! Thanks a million for the help Dave, case closed!! 

Looks unbelievable Denis!! Congratulations that’s quite the achievement and quite the space! 

17 hours ago, derek said:

Happy belated birthday Oisin. Does your loco sound ok? Mine doesn't. (see elsewhere on here). How do power your layout?

Thank you! :)) I’ll attach a few videos but yes mine emits a low kind of buzzing/humming noise at around 40/50% speed however when you increase the speed from then on up the noise gets much quieter so it might just be a running-in thing. My MM 071 does a similar thing at low speeds so it could be my controllers too but the noise isn’t really audible over the noise of a train on the tracks.

It’s DC operation and I have two Hornby train set controllers, one for the ‘up’ and ‘down’ line. They’re connected to the track with those Hornby power feed joiner yokes because I’m using Code 75 rail which obviously isn’t compatible with the Hornby power track and I’m also no good at/too scared to try soldering! When the track is in good nick and clean they do provide pretty good reliability in fairness. 
 

Thank you so so much all of you for the really lovely messages and birthday wishes, and the kind comments about the layout, you’re all very good and it’s much appreciated! 

Oisín :))

The problem is that if they wanted to they could absolutely add at least 3 passing loops between Greystones and Dublin. Bray is an ideal place for Rosslare services to pass DART services with the third track down the middle so I think that DARTs and Intercities should pass there and commuters for the south of the city can change at Greystones for a DART northbound. Intercities then shouldn’t make any other stops on the way to Connolly, aside maybe from either Pearse or Dun Laoighre at the very most but preferably not even.

Passing loops can be very easily installed at Grand Canal Dock (just continue the line though Platform 2 out to far side of the station) and one could be added at Salthill and Monkstown. This would involve needing to build out onto the promenade coastal walk and involve a track being directly beside the Irish Sea. However the walk can be easily rerouted and that part of Irish Sea tends to be very calm anyway. If needs be another loop section of track could be added dug into the cliffside between Dalkey Tunnel and Killiney…?

These are my no means ideal solutions and probably not at all doable but better than the current proposal, and the kind of thing the NTA should at least be suggesting instead of seemingly giving up completely. Greystones to Connolly is just over 30 kilometres and yet takes Rosslare trains over an hour to traverse it, on top of the over two hours it already takes to travel the mere 130 or so kilometres between Rosslare and Greystones. Even if adding passing loops between Bray and Dublin isn’t viable, track, passing loop and linespeed improvements can definitely be made between Rosslare and Greystones to compensate. Over 3 hours to do what the car can do in 1hr 50? Not good enough

5 hours ago, eeiknh said:

I travel To Stockholm Arlanda regularly and they have both commuter train and dedicated "fast" airport train for airport passengers...the latter being optimized to get to central station and a very different carriage layout (and a price premium)

I personally see this as being the argument for the Clongriffin link ALONGSIDE the metro for the airport. Manchester, London, Stockholm, Paris, Berlin, and Copenhagen all have both a metro/light rail link (which serves other populated locations on the way) to the city centre AS WELL AS a heavy rail link for fast tracking to the main rail stations.

I think this should be the case for Dublin. Metro was clearly designed as a metro which links the city centre and some currently unserved populated suburbs with a link to some non-central rail stations and by happenstance, the airport. But it won’t have the capacity in the peak hours with all the commuters coming from north Dublin to handle all the airport traffic and the associated baggage. We also need a separate dedicated fast route to the airport (even more important when you think we’re an island nation compared with all the mainland European cities that have it!)

Ideally DART trains (and slightly modified ones at that - more baggage space etc…) would leave the airport - be it an elevated or underground station - to travel on a double track corridor to Clongriffin where a stop would be made to interchange to DART and Intercity services south for Connolly and north for… well, the north. It would then join the fast lines south and travel non-stop to Spencer Dock where it would join the DART Underground tunnels under Dublin to Heuston and terminate at Hazelhatch. This provides the most connectivity (Clongriffin for Drogheda and Belfast, Spencer Dock for Maynooth and Sligo, Pearse for south Dublin and Rosslare, and then Heuston for everywhere else) but I really feel that the airport DART could not be done without Project FourNorth and DART+ Tunnel. 

That’s just my spake on it but I feel that the argument of ‘sure we’ll have the metro’ really doesn’t stand up properly as an argument against an airport DART as well. And while the airport DART is not a priority with the metro already being there, and projects like FourNorth, and line enhancements, reopenings, and new stations outside of Dublin, I do think we will  eventually need both metro and a heavy rail connection to properly cater for capacity. 

48 minutes ago, NIRCLASS80 said:

Correct

The plan is a 6am departure from both ends so arrival should be well before 9am

Thanks @NIRCLASS80, that’s brillaint to hear, and about time too! Hopefully they bring it in as planned in conjunction with the opening of Grand Central

On 9/4/2024 at 10:10 AM, airfixfan said:

Enterprise going hourly from October 7th using CAFs and ICRs for about 5 years

Just curious, but do those in the know have any idea about the proposed timetable…? Or at least will they be a pre-9am arrival to both cities…? 

2 hours ago, airfixfan said:

Going through the details the plans are for 5 new Enterpride trains to replace the DD sets by 2029

I think the plan was to have 8 sets…? Not 100% sure though but that would make more sense for an hourly service with a few contingencies in cases of a failure…

On 9/4/2024 at 5:03 PM, leslie10646 said:

You poor souls - @Galteemore is almost certainly right - you're going to get the AWFUL Intercity Express Trains (IETs) which we suffer here on the "Other" (Unimportant) Island.

Even worse than Vomiters (sorry, mistype, Voyagers).

Emigrate before it happens! I'm too old, or I would have done it already.

Oh good lord above, it can’t surely be true…! I sincerely hope not… or if they do, I only pray that they upgrade the seating offering from the UK version…

In fairness I do think it’s quite unlikely they’ll be UK-outline units though, as they wouldn’t be constructed in the UK - ie outside the EU (and a standalone factory in Ireland to build 8 units makes no sense) so if being constructed in Europe it’s far more likely they’d be built to a European train base design.

I’d heard murmurings that they were hallmarked to be Stadler ‘Flirts’, and this to me makes a lot of sense as they are European built with many existing factories in Europe, are tried and tested all over the world and are a very flexible base, with many different power supplies possible as well as the potential for very easy decarbonisation on the future. Alstom is another option as they are already producing the new DARTs…

Just as long as they’re comfortable, efficient, fast and reliable (not much to ask in todays world you’d think but…) I’m happy! Looking cool and a potentially slick new livery would be an added bonus! Just not an IET… please…

6 hours ago, airfixfan said:

Did hint at this a few days ago but sworn to secrecy then. Enterprise going hourly from October 7th using CAFs and ICRs for about 5 years

This is revolutionary! I’m surprised at how under the radar this has gone too. Is this to coincide with the opening of Grand Central? Also I presume a pre-9am arrival to each city is also on the cards for this new timetable? 

A lot of connectivity problems with the metro could have been very easily solved by a direct link with the Red Line at O’Connell Street, the Red Line bring the direct connection between the country’s 2 (and 3 when the new Spencer Dock opens) rail termini and it was in my opinion the biggest missed opportunity and waste of resources to not connect the two. I understand @DoctorPan’s points above about curve radii and TBM width but even still, the route already plans to run directly under Sackville Pl which with 3 exits could have provided an amazing transport interchange hub in the city centre.

On a side note, I also think that not building the Luas Cross City Extension as a double track line up Westmorland O’Connell Streets was a huge mistake. O’Connell Street should have been pedestrianised a long time ago and could have been done very effectively here (buses and taxis only on the western lane and double tram tracks on the eastern lane with more pedestrian space either side as a result) but the government was as always too scared to hurt the private car… Abbey Street Station could have been moved to Middle Abbey Street in front of the Oval and a cross platform right angle corner interchange station between the cities two tram lines could have been achieved, which combined with Metrolink would have been an unbelievable City Centre Transport hub.

Tara Station could have been relocated to Pearse instead if the stations were to be ‘too close’, and this would in fact have been a much getter interchange as it would connect with DART Underground and is a much larger station for high capacity interchange than Tara Street. The line from here could still have very easily continued to Stephen’s Green too and overall would have very little impact on the route. However I do feel that a Red Line connection was the biggest missed opportunity of the Metro.

I am very much for Metrolink and I do believe that it will be citywide-and nationwide-transformative when complete. I just feel that for Dublin’s first ever metro project and the nations largest rail  infrastructure ever, all the stops should have been pulled out.