DoctorPan

On 19/7/2025 at 1:57 PM, Louth said:

A few points in relation to Metrolink. It will be built to a 1435 mm gauge rather than Irish Rail's 1600 mm so it cannot be integrated into the national rail system. The Elisabeth Line is full integrated into the mainline system and was designed to provide cross-city interconnectivity of existing lines. That said, Metrolink will have a big advantage as it will be driverless. As with any project it is a matter of weighing the balance between it and the alternatives. For Dublin Airport the alternative is a heavy rail line running from the Northern line in the Donabate or Rush/Lusk area skirting Swords, through Dublin Airport and in to Dublin ideally linking to a DART Underground line (connecting the Northern Line to Heuston). This would be made practical by four-tracking the relevant section of the Northern Line (currently being reviewed under the "Four North" study). There is nothing new in this alternative as it was first mooted by CIE in the 1970s. Unfortunately our land-use planning (or lack of) has allowed developments along the route, particularly in Dublin Airport. If Metrolink is given the go ahead, it is likely that neither four-tracking or DART Underground (cancelled in 2016 by the government at the point it was about to start) will proceed. There are pros and cons to all options. The main question is whether spending €9.5-21 billion on Metrolink is the best use of resources. Also keep in mind that a heavy rail line to Dublin Airport is required by the EU under TEN-T policy by 2040.

Lot there to unpack but the main point that I wish to rebuke is the assertion that quad tracking the northern line will not proceed if Metrolink goes ahead. They are entirely separate projects and 4North has its separate pressures to push the project through. 

Also it will be integrated into the national rail system through ticketing and service connections, just because there isn't a physical connection does not mean it cannot and won't be.

Should point out that TII has a good track record regarding infrastructure projects, Luas Cross City was delivered on budget and ahead of schedule. It is a complex project with tunnelling but that is why good project management and goverence is vital for these big projects. NCH is the classic example of what happens when you rush initial works to get a decision due to political reasons. NCH was not fully designed before the contracts signed so any changes that have occured as different designs are being harmonised to each other, coupled with a client that keeps changing the scope, it is no wonder that BAM are making out with the change orders as what is currently built is not what they bid to build at the start.

Comparison to Grand Central is apples to orange comparison as the scale and civil engineering complexity between a new terminus station and gubbins and a brand new underground metro is absurd 

Metro will be a game changer but should also reviewed alongside the other projects that have been progressed at the same time.

DART+ will provide transformative connections to the metro, Heuston side of the network, the option of changing at Hazelhatch/Heuston for a DART to Glasnevin to connect with the metro, or luas/bus on to the city center to connect with the metro. On the Sligo line, changing at Maynooth for a DART to Glasnevin will bring you into the metro system. Northern and South Eastern line has connections at Tara Street. Also would not be surprised to see an extension to connect to the Northern line and unlock land development north of Swords announced around the time construction is nearing completion. 

Also it should not be viewed as a city center to airport connection, the town of Swords suffers from terrible public transport connectivity and a reliable consistent journey time will be transformative. NTA has found that there can be up to over 60 mins of a journey time variance of buses from Swords into town due to traffic congestion. 

It is one of the most congested corridors at the moment, its not surprising looking at the trip generators served by the alignment. The capacity the metro can bring is amazing, its around 20,000 people per hour per direction, the luas is roughly around ~8,000 in comparison while a bus on a bus corridor on a 15 min frequency tops out at around 3,000 people per hour per direction.

Likewise, a yes for me.

Clearly it's going to be a model of Pat and Sambo as a collectors pack...

35 minutes ago, Flying Snail said:

There's a nice anecdotal source here of the latter days of the line here from A community project in Abbeyleix: https://abbeyleixbog.wordpress.com/2016/05/13/a-railway-ran-through-it-2/ 

Oops - post crossed with Broithe - he has the same link to Abbeyleix above

There's a great interview Ronnie gave on youtube as well. A true genleman.

50 minutes ago, hurricanemk1c said:

About the fifth loco I've heard to be converted!

Ultimately new locos should be bought rather than messing around like this

Is there anything to be said about doing another scheme to prevent the question of electrification of the rail freight corridors?

17 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

IE announced it….

Do you have any idea where? Haven't come across such a press release anywhere in the usual and unusual places.

22 minutes ago, Darrman said:

https://www.irishrail.ie/en-ie/news/project-development-for-navan-rail-line-to-begin

Irish Rail press release today: RPS appointed as consultants, two years spent planning with a public consultation at some point in that, railway order application for 2027. Stations at Dunshaughlin and Kilmessan explicitly mentioned.

Just speaking for myself, what's stopping them from reusing the pre-crash plans as opposed to going through planning again?

Updated requirements and the information being out dated. 

31 minutes ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Will this mean platform 10 and maybe even a new platform 11 at heuston will come to be used? 

Platform 10 will become part of the new Heuston West station. 

57 minutes ago, DoctorPan said:

Word on the grapevine is that ABP has granted DART+SouthWest it's Railway Order and should be made public today.

https://www.pleanala.ie/en-ie/case/316119

And the grapevine has borne fruit. South West has it's Railway Order!

Word on the grapevine is that ABP has granted DART+SouthWest it's Railway Order and should be made public today.

Speaking to Paddy, these aren't a solo project, Alstrom have asked him and provided CAD and the sort to help him produce this, hence why a 3D sample model of a full set appeared before real thing!

Tender award for the project and announcement for the winners is due to be made public shortly. 

Winners of the recent Navan Line tender are due to be officially announced in the short term future, two main options to be invesitgated, the old D&M alignment or a diverision to bring it closer to Dunshaughlin. 

10 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

The issue seems to be the NTA, who in conjunction with the government hold all the cards. If and when there is enthusiasm within that body (e.g. re a new proposed cycle lane) it tends to get done, with or without local council funding. As far as rail is concerned, local authorities will doubtlessly be deterred by the colossal bill that the NTA would wave at them if they offered to fund something like this.

This should not be, but it certainly would appear to be the case. Yes, Brexitstan and other countries are ahead of us on that point in some cases, but the NTA is often referred to as the "No Trains Authority"; their fascination with roads and motorways and buses is reminiscent of the UTA in the 1950s.

In fairness to the NTA, it's not for lack of interest in building railways. Indeed Marcello the head of rail is very eager to push projects through and get shovels in the ground. Indeed he has butted heads with IÉ over they wanting to run services to suit the infrastructure while he wants IÉ to be looking to put the infrastructure in to support the desired services. The NTA of old was more interested in buses but since the change in personal there's a big change coming from their side of the field.

It is the departments of finance and public expenditure that are pumping the breaks on projects and requesting increasing levels of reports to show financial benefits as the OPW debacale has spooked the civil service into being afraid of signing off on infrastructure. Cycle lanes are smaller and nimble projects that don't have to go through the same level of regulatorly financial red tape. It's also should be noted that rail infrastructure investment is new again to the island and the industry has taken time to get to grips with delivering these projects but there's been a lot of background enabling works going on that are starting to come on stream which will speed up other projects. 

Mine arrived and paid for, including the BnT van. Very much looking forward to this order.

11 hours ago, Branchline121 said:

You’d really think they’d just convert the 1.5 V DC on the DART to 25 kV AC instead of extending the redundant DC system when it could be AC from Greystones to Belfast.

The talk addressed that. Currently 3% of the network is electrified. They could spend the money retrofitting the existing DART network to 25kV AC or use it to expand the electrification corridor. Makes sense to decarbonise more of the network. They do plan to retrofit 25kV AC along the DART corridor eventually and indeed, I can easily see the next gen of DART units being designed to be dual voltage to allow a phased switch over. 

39 minutes ago, Wexford70 said:

Does the fact there is an election coming influence the timing of the release of this aspirational plan?

Without significant EU grants, I cannot see these coming to fruition given the level of national debt. (Statistics | NTMA)

 

The timing of this report has nothing to do with an election. It's been held up for nearly two years because Stormont had no sitting government. 

As someone who works in the industry and indeed in a former life worked for Arup, the writers of the report, this is a change in policy from the Department of Transport, Finance and Public Expenditure. Ryan has pushed hard for a lot of behind the scenes changes in the departments and civil service and this is the result of it. All proposals in this report apparently have a benefits to cost ratio of 1:1 so they believe they will break even at minimum. A second factor that pushes the cost of these down is that it may be cheaper to build these then pay the fines to Europe for the breach of carbon emission limits. Thirdly, the European Investment Bank is involved to make monies available for this and indeed reviewing the plan to see which aspects can be deliveried quickly and most bang for buck. And finally another factor is this is being approached as how the motorway network was built in the 2000s and the investment that got. There's a load of movement and growth within the rail industry, hell Irish Rail and private consultants are constantly hiring engineering staff for rail projects.

1 hour ago, 226 Abhann na Suire said:

You’d wonder would somewhere beyond Hazelhatch be viable…? Between there and Naas? Or even just north of Rush and Lusk? Although that latter location may face the same flooding risks of the Maynooth depot… 

Hazelhatch had two options considered and both were rejected for flood risk as well plus requiring removal of housing. There's not many locations within the existing study areas that fit the bill. Interesting times ahead.

15 minutes ago, 226 Abhann na Suire said:

When you say the depot will not happen, does that mean at all…??? Are they looking into relocating it…? Surely the depot is a must for the whole project…

A new depot location will have to be found. Considering its less than 24 hours since the announcment and ruling, I'm sure a review for a suitable site will occur. And yes a dedicated depot is required. Maynooth was intended to be the EMU version of Laois Train Care with Fairview becoming a stabling point and Drogheda acting as depot outpost. The question now is where can they find a 2km long site for their requirements. 

8 hours ago, Branchline121 said:

I’m excited that Meath will finally get electric trains, even if it’s only Dunboyne and not as far as Navan like in the Strategic Railway Review, I wonder when that will happen, if it happens at all?

Navan is currently out to tender for Phases 1 & 2, which does include OHLE design.

2 hours ago, Mike 84C said:

Dr Pan, looks like Nicky Cox used the Hornby James ?  Its very good and a much better starting point than the Bachmann one.

461,one of my favourite engines, I'm hoping Accurascale  release a model of it for their Irish steam loco.  Lots of selling points going for it but I wont hold my breath!

 DJ Dangerous thank you for your comments very kind of you.  So many people on this site and on other site's have freely helped me over the years, so the right thing is to help others if you can.

 As an aside, I worked with a guy whose nickname was Dangerous Dave, Health & Safety what's that ? But he  kept our mill running well past its sell by date!  Your avtar? reminds me of him and I like that.  

Yeah it's a Hornby James chassis and tender as its starting point.

Nicky Cox of Erritt Lodge Works on FB did a model of 461 using a James chassis and tender as a foundation.

On 21/5/2024 at 11:22 AM, 226 Abhann na Suire said:

Good location by the looks of it! Pretty close to a lot of amenities and also while I’m a pretty populated area, there’s space to the immediate sound and north of the line and beyond for transit oriented developments! Great to see more investment in the Limerick commuter system!

Stations at Adare and the specially Dooradoyle on the newly built Foynes line seem to me like a huge missed opportunity, Dooradoyle being a highly populated area currently underserved by public transport.

A park and ride station out by the N24/M7 junction by Castleroy was being floated a while ago too, is that still on the cards…? Moyross is definitely progress so hopefully we see more similar projects pop up around Limerick, in conjunction with doubling to Ennis and Limerick Junction!

https://www.atkinsrealis.com/en/media/trade-releases/2024/2024-01-22#:~:text=AtkinsRéalis will develop station location,the Limerick to Ennis Line.

Few projects on the go mentioned there along with the Limerick Double Track project aslo.