leslie10646

Charlie Petty, whose trade name I have forgotten, sells these at lots of shows. He's always at Bangor, for example. If memory serves - both 20ft and 40ft - the 20ft ones cost me about £7.50 sterling.

Hmm n real life the door ended up above the rail height when open ??

Not sure what you mean by this. If you mean "did it?" I have no idea, as I don't think I have an open door photo to hand.

In making some wagons like this, our intention was to make it possible for diarama with an open door - that is at a loading bank for some kind. Why would you want to run the wagon with the door open?

This really should be on someone's "Workbench" string, but as he did it for me .....

Now you see it -

Now you don't!

This one complete with the Modeller's finger!

It'll be On Old Blarney at Cupar on 25th being loaded with Lord White's possessions!

To quote the Lego Movie (Yep, I've seen it a dozen times - I HAVE a six year old grandson!) - it's just "Aaaah-sum"!

Leslie

Think there may be another variation, before they started double-stacking bodies for beet traffic, I've seen pics of these opens with an enormous, crudely painted letter "B" on the sides.

Just to try and get a bit of decorum back onto this string -

Yes, Minister (oops, sorry!) you are quite right - there are loads of photos around of these wagons with a "B" showing that they were used to carry a well-known agricultural product.

The double deckers (of which, more later) had crude numbers slapped on their ends!

All of that was a CRAFTy way to get your attention.

I know that an esteemed member of the Parish is about to let us see his "go" at painting this wagon, so here's FIVE liveries, all correct at some point in the wagons' long history - and we're still working on it!

First, in sunlight!

Now, under my layout lighting - needless to say they look different!

If any of you are old enough to remember them in the early days (I was eleven when they were introduced and had never even heard of CIE) give me an opinion! Nothing rude, mind!!!!!

Regards

Leslie

Apologies, David, a CRAFT moment - you told me perfectly clearly!

CRAFT? - the new term for a senior moment

( teenagers not to read this!!!!!)

Can't Remember A Fxxxxxxg Thing

Now you all know what the numbers in my name mean!!!!!

Oops, sorry - LENTILS - not Barley - The King of Fife says he has some over from his Scotch Broth!

Leslie

Its possible that some wagons had wooden and others steel floors.

 

The wagons dumped at Liffey Junction in the early 80s all seem to have had wooden floors, in somewhat poor condition after being used as spoil wagons for the DART.

 

There was a piece in Irish Railfans News of the floors of wagons in fertiliser traffic being painted in epoxy paint to resist corrosion, which would make sense with a steel floor.

 

In the early 60s there were rail linked fertiliser plants in Dublin (Gouldings), but also plants in Foynes and in Wicklow. NET seems to have supplied raw fertiliser in bulk to Gouldings and the Wicklow plant when the Shelton Ammonia plant first came on line.

 

Wagons in fertiliser traffic would have run sheeted as you did not want to risk a train load of ammonium nitrate getting wet.

John

Thanks for this - I'm not changing the floor and you've vindicated our choice!

On the business of nitrate traffic, I have a photo by Joe Cassells of No.186 at Kilkenny, but the reason I have the photo is the line of corrugateds with plastic sheeting over their loads - now I know why! Useful to know when recommending what LOADS to put in the wagons!

Lord White, King of Fife, Chair of Perth etc, gave me a good line for you guys who want to use the wagons for BEET Traffic - BARLEY grain. I assume he'll turn up at Coupar with a bag of it to fill his new wagons?

Greetings from a wet Surrey - you can tell it's Men's Singles Finals day at Wimbledon!

Leslie

Well done Kieran with the North Atlantics - especially as the train actually has passengers!!!!!

My grandson, an over-wise 6 year old, admonished me for having trains with no passengers in the coaches!

His uncle is a dab hand at painting Warhammer figures, but can I get my son to paint people for me ???????

"Also model shops in Belfast tend not to last very long for whatever reason".

Just being pedantic, but ......

I wouldn't agree with this statement, as "The Model Shop" was in business when I was at school and continued until Gareth shut up shop recently (mind you after a move out of the city centre) - so that's fifty years - most businesses don't last that long!

Your point about the English Box Shifters is, of course, the crux of the problem. We all use them, but if we're wise, we buy stuff from the local man too - you never know when you need some little part and if he's gone out of business ..........

I think another issue is down to the character of the person who runs the shop. Some are uncommunicative and you feel you're intruding by even being there, others are chatty and helpful. The latter get my business any day.

In fairness to Blaine's comments, I agree that there are things to keep under your hat until you're established and in the end, actions speak louder than words!

Leslie

"The floor of the Bullied Wagons. Were these wooden planks or all metal? I ask as I believe I have seen a photograph somewhere of the floor of one of these wagons".

Thanks, David, now you've given me a heart attack about the floor.

We based the floor on photographic evidence from a gent in Norway, who had photographed the "preserved" one. That clearly shows the floor as we have modelled it.

HOWEVER, when I look at one of the drawings which I have, the suggestion is of a planked floor (latitudenly - hmm - that seems to be a new word, but you know what I mean)!!! However, no photograph to prove that they were ever built like this. That said, the recent photo could easily be sheet steel placed over wood!

Feel free to insert a piece of cardboard, suitably scored? I ain't doin' it again!!!!! (Now that's what I call customer service ......)

Assuming you're right and I am suspicious that you may be, just when the floors were strengthened (or was it just protecting the wood underneath) is lost in the mists of the 1960s, 70s, 80s .......

Leslie

I thought this might be in the WTT, but no.

Possibly the Working Timetable "Appendix" if someone has got one?

They're sure to have one in the IRRS Archive.

Yes, good job Alan, for an easy win.

I bought a WRENN 08 years ago for similar treatment, but then turned my back on these diesel things when I got my SSM steam locos built - so I sold it for a minor fortune on eBay - over sixty quid, when I'd paid a fiver or so in a Beatties sale. Who needs the Stock Market?

Leslie

The Hornby / Wrenn Banana van was / is very close to the GNR 1954 Bagged Cement vans, even in the brake gear, I would submit - not a lot of use to 21mm men, I accept. I used the Dapol one for my Cement Van, which I sold to the tune of 450 pieces, in three guises - by far the best selling wagon I have produced. It was a very unusual Irish van, being of much higher capacity than the normal 7, 9, or 10 ton jobs, which invariably were squatter than the British counterparts.

Assuming that by an "H" Van, you mean the CIE-built 17222 - 19754 series of 12 ton vans, on Bulleid's triangulated chassis; then be patient - my kit will appear later in the year - it has essentially the same chassis as my recent corrugated sided open wagon.

Leslie

(Provincial wagons)

For the 21mm men, I will happily sell it (as I do with the open) without the chassis, so that you can fit your own W irons, OR you can split the chassis and move it out a bit?

Whatever you think, privatisation was the best thing to happen to BR. UK railways are busier now then anytime in their history.

You've got to be joking!

The railways cost us over TWICE as much in subsidy in real terms as they did in BR days. Are you a UK taxpayer?

They can't renationalise the railways a day too soon!

Passenger numbers are up not due to privatisation, it is natural growth spurred on by an ever more gridlocked road system. Your railfreight figures puzzle me, in the 1950s, surely there were many times the number of freight trains that there are today?

I've just looked it up: see -

http://www.metadyne.co.uk/D_ml_freight_km.html

it's HALF what it was in the 1950s.

I'm not certain what the absolute fastest was, GSR; but on test they just exceeded 100 mph on a few occasions.

 

Come on, John .....

 

Maybe early nineties?

 

There are a lot of stories but they seem to be of the same nature as most American world speed record claims with nineteenth century 4-4-0s! (However, I do believe the 4-6-4s on the Hiawatha did get up around 120mph on occasion - oh for a time machine!).

 

In "Decade of Steam", although one observer thought the 800s were achieving a lengthy average at 90mph, in reality, the trains seldom exceeded 80mph! The highest speed Drew Donaldson recorded (in 1940) was 88mph.

 

It's a bit academic, the war ensured that they would never be allowed to show what they really could do, which is a great pity.

The GSR were keen to have "flagship" train, hence not only the 800 class

 

The issue of building the 800s is well covered in "Locomotives of the GSR" by Michael McMahon and Jeremy Clements. Worth a read if you can get your hands on one. The pride the 800s engendered amongst the staff probably made them worth every penny.

oh dear. Dont tell the wife.

 

it is excellent . can i pre-order now ?

I ALWAYS send my stuff in plain envelopes, so wives don't know!

Rich, when you're ready, order through the website or by e-mailing me -

lesliemcallister@aol.com

Regards and thanks for the comments which I'll pass to the magic modeller.

Leslie

Peco all the way, we've had no problems what so ever with it. Code 100 will allow absolutely everything to be run, especially those old triang engines, code 75 for the more newer stuff.

Just for the record, I have used a mix of Peco 100, Peco Setrack (I'm lazy and it saves cutting rail!) and even Hornby straights for some sidings (you can pick up secondhand ones cheaply at exhibitions here in England and it's cheaper than yards of Peco), all without obvious problems.

Peco Setrack Special curves (33" or so radius) was particularly useful to lay a fairly inaccesible curve on the layout.

I agree with others - buy it from your local shop - if you're buying a lot, they usually offer something off - maybe not to Rails or Hattons level. Better to support them, so that they're still there the day you need something quickly!!!!

Leslie

Take a bow, Leslie, it looks fantastic. It's the first time I've seen the correct corrugation pattern on any model of this wagon.

Garfield

Thanks for this, but it's my modeller Michael Rayner you should applaud - I just "make it happen"!!!!

Leslie

The photo is of our prototype wagon which clearly shows the unusual triangulated chassis, patented by Oliver Bulleid and his chief draughtsman at the Southern Railway - Lionel Lynes.

The wagon was introduced in 1956 in this form and was built to the tune of over two thousand wagons, of which 1,000 were still in use by the end of the 1970s. They were used on all manner of traffic initially and were seen all over Ireland, so you can have one (or more!) on your train North of the Border as well.

They were extensively used in the annual Beet Campaign, even in steam days and in this form, right up to 1980 or so.

Number series was 11817 to 14672.

Our model has the signature corrugations inside and out, plus a plated floor as in the real thing. Count the bolts! Note the Builder's Plate and the representation of a consignment clip. The brake gear is a close representation of the real thing.

Apart from the brake gear, this should be a very easy kit to build as body and triangulated chassis will be a single casting! About fifteen parts in all.

NO transfers are supplied as the original wagons merely had a stencilled number on the left hand triangulation and it would be so small as to be unreadable. In any event, in real life it quickly disappeared under a coating of muck, oil etc!!

Pretty well everything you need, bar adhesive and paint are included. You’ll need a few tools, which should be found in any modeller’s tool kit.

I have received the first delivery of kits, with more on the way.

If you want yours quickly, I shall be on the RPSI tour on 9 - 11 May, but

please pre-order. Theoretically, I can deliver in Dublin, Cork, Killarney and Tralee!

£21.50 or €29 post paid.

Think there is only about three books that deal specifically with MGWR. Ernies Shepherds book is an excellent starting point. MGWR in pictures by the IRRS is another one. Des Coakham's Irish Broad Gauge Carriages might have some stuff in it. Only other MGWR book that I can think of is Rails to Achill.

Just to say the Irish Railways in Pictures No.2 - The Midland Great Western is available from me for £2.95 sterling, plus postage (which looks like £2.45).

If someone wants one and is travelling on the RPSI South Munster railtour then I'll hand it over for €5.

Just e-mail me at

lesliemcallister@aol.com

I need to know how many before I travel on 7 May!!!!

Leslie

My Giddy Aunt - a STIRLING SINGLE!!!!

If you've seen the model of the Ivatt (Inchicore man, remember) Atlantic, you'll be saving for this one too!!

George, what's wrong with your geography - NORTH WEST???? EAST Coast and usually not North of York!

But thanks for sharing this with us!

Leslie

I hope to see a lot of you at the exhibition, so come to my stand (Provincial Wagons) and say hallo!

For you guys modelling CIE, I may have something to interest you!

I'm also having a loft sale with a couple of boxfuls of unwanted BR wagons and some continental stuff - so if you're modelling in those areas, come and pick up a bargain!

Next door to me, you'll find Richard McLachlan who is a bit good at finescale stuff - just don't ask him a question or you'll be there all afternoon!

Hope to see you on Saturday or Sunday.

Leslie

PS I'll be at the IRRS meeting in Dublin on Thursday evening, so if you aren't heading North, say hallo and maybe I'll let you have a peep at the stock!

Most of the coaches built from the Mid-1950s to Bulleid's departure including some MK2 Bredins, all the Park Royals & Laminates had triangulated underframes,

 

The idea seems to have been dropped after Bulleid's departure wagons/coaches built from the 60s onwards had conventional underframes.

-----------

The 26001 series vans, introduced in 1964 would seem to have been the last built on the triangulated chassis.

 

Did the Blessed Oliver really dictate that wagons should be built on his patented chassis design and then, presumably, collect the royalties?