irishthump

19 hours ago, Sean said:

Taken from ESU manual but also applicable to double heads. if a speaker is wired backwards it moves in the opposite direction and a positive sound wave becomes a negative one. audibly it will sound the same to us as humans however a speaker wired the other way around will be producing a positive sound wave and if both operate together then there is potential for destructive interference to the sound wave before it hits our ears and a good proportion of the sound will be cancelled out. it wont be perfect cancellation either and the sound and level of interference will change greatly as the loco moves around the room. (see recording studio example below for a more controlled scientific breakdown)

Most people tend to run double headers one with sound and one without due to the current cost of decoders which makes this a non issue.

 

In a recording studio, when recording drums, a microphone will be placed on the top and the bottom of the snare. the distance between the microphones and the drum must be the exact same on both sides so that the sound of the strike reaches both micrphones at the same time or you will hear 2 strikes milliseconds apart. the same phenomena occurs here. as the microphones are facing one another they will move in opposite directions and although a loud strike has been recorded it will barely be audible at all on the recording and all that will be heard is the sound of the room i.e. the decay and reverb from the strike.  To fix this we have a button to flip the polarity on each of the inputs. and if we forget to press that, we can always do it  afterwards during editing.

I am not sure how much all of this actually applies to us with model trains but I do know of at least one member on here who was reporting phase issues when attempting to double head with 2 sound decoders.

 

 

 

 

 

When double heading locos that are each fitted with their own decoder the speaker the phasing issue only arises when running identical sound files in both locos. You can easily get around this with Loksound decoders by varying the playback speed function on each sound file.

On 19/7/2022 at 3:38 PM, Sean said:

Polarity becomes important if double heading 2 or more sound units.

 

In what way is the polarity important?

1 hour ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Would it be a big job to remove the decoder altogether?

No. The hardest part is removing the body on the 141.

First remove the cab at the opposite end to the roof grill. this should just pull straight up with a little force. Remember to detach the ends of the handrails from the sides of the cab first, or they may well break. Many will tell you to remove the handrails completely before doing this but it can difficult (it's fiddley and sometimes they can be glued in place) and the body can be removed while leaving the handrails in place.

Working from the removed cab end  the rest of the body can then be levered up with some gentle pressure. Again, remember to unclip the handrails from the opposite end cab as that cab is attached to the body. Once the rest of the body is off removing the decoder and replacing the blanking plate is simple. Then simply replace the body and cab.

Here's and excellent tutorial that shows the process for installing sound which shows how to remove the body shell.

22 hours ago, Westcorkrailway said:

If I had a DCC 141, would it run ok on DC layout or would it be benifical to remove the decoder? 

You can, but you need a DCC controller capable of reprogramming decoder CV's. Many decoders have this feature disabled as having it enabled when running DCC can cause erratic running.

On 13/7/2022 at 11:32 AM, murphaph said:

They are pretty cool but in reality once warmed up most diesels don't produce these huge plumes of smoke at high revs. The water vapour generation would need more complex control to be realistic, fading out as the revs increased, back in at medium revs then out again at idle. Only a cold engine would typically belch smoke throughout the rev range. Simply coupling the sound frequency to the generation rate may not work that well. The water also has to land back on the layout so that's something to bear in mind.

At around 4:55 that 141 starts belching out smoke like there's no tomorrow! I've seen similar videos of US EMD diesels doing the same thing.

On 13/7/2022 at 2:17 PM, Georgeconna said:

But it lands back down on the model for sure, happens to my Boats.

 

On 13/7/2022 at 2:17 PM, Georgeconna said:

But it lands back down on the model for sure, happens to my Boats.

 

Yeah, fu*k that! It's hard enough to keep the track and layout clean without that going on.

2 minutes ago, DJ Dangerous said:

Was looking for this on your YT channel last night as the forum video wouldn't load for me.

Thanks!

Ah sorry, I only uploaded to YouTube today. I had a feeling the video wasn’t working….

We Ok here’s a quick video, please excuse the crappy quality!

I haven’t had the chance to do any programming except for lowering the overall volume, which was deafening! A testament to excellent speaker set up in this model.

Here’s a YouTube link….

Ok here’s a quick video, please excuse the crappy quality!

I haven’t had the chance to do any programming except for lowering the overall volume, which was deafening! A testament to excellent speaker set up in this model.

8 hours ago, Bob229 said:

Please do, superb loco, one of my first loco was a Lima Deltic

Ha! My first WAS a Lima Deltic. The freight set with the cargo crane. Bought in Easons with my communion money!

2 hours ago, Bob229 said:

Looking forward to seeing it run

Gave it a quick run-in when I got home from work, very impressive. Only got to play with it for an hour or so, damn attic is WAY too hot right now!

I’ll try and get a video up in the next day or too for anyone who’s interested.

Got a parcel today….

Yeah that's a major feat of engineering there! I wonder did he use some of the empty space behind the see-through grill...

On 4/7/2022 at 11:40 PM, Georgeconna said:

Sounds pretty awesome, Must get my one sounded up soon!

It's an easy job with the Dapol Western, just bang in the decoder and speaker. There's room for a full size bass reflex speaker. Unlike the Heljan version which needs major surgery!

Oh this is tempting....

What formations did these wagons run in? How many in a rake and did they run mixed with other stock?

This was a present from  Christmas 2020! 
Thought I’d give some BR a run in anticipation of the Deltic’s impending arrival.

Soundfile is by Legomanbiffo.

Ok, I watched part of the review and all I'll say is:

1) The slow speed performance. I don't think an hour is long enough of a run-in time to hang your conclusions on. I find it takes quite a bit longer to get optimum performance from a brand new motor and he's also using DC!

2) The couplers. He says there at the "wrong height". Does he realise there is no standard height for tension locks? We have a standard NEM pocket height but half the time it's not adhered to by manufactures and you often come across cranked couplers which can have them at any height! Not to mention the fact that every coupling he shows on his own stock seems to be drooping! 

Sorry for the rant.....

24 minutes ago, Patrick Davey said:

His 'layout' kills me 

Laid out on the floor! 

17 minutes ago, GSR 800 said:

 

I've seen worse, saw a video of a lad reviewing an A class which had a handrail that came off. Now fair is fair, I expect everything to be in place when it comes out of the box, paid good money after all but his whinging about it being completely unacceptable was beyond me.

 

Oh I must find that one!

Well I see Sam's Trains has a review up um Youtube. But you guys will have to tell me how it goes, 'coz I will not watch it!

20 hours ago, BEANO3005 said:

The standard 21 pin chips can be used 121, 141/181/071 classes.

The sound fitted chips for the 121s can be used in 141/181 class but as far as I know, the 141s are not fitted with speakers so a speaker will also have to be wired to the sound decoder for use in 141/181. 

Actually the speaker can be wired to either the decoder or the circuit board in the loco. Wiring to the board is far more preferable, as wiring to the decoder itself takes some very delicate soldering.

On 14/6/2022 at 3:50 PM, Broithe said:

When the through tracks were reballasted at Ballybrophy, it was fairly chunky stuff, in real world terms, but still probably smaller than N Gauge ballast against 00 track, I think.

However, ballast that is actually to scale may well appear to be too fine - looking right matters more than being technically accurate in this situation.

This is exactly the point I was going to make myself.

1 hour ago, Fowler4f said:

On further investigation, Woodlands Scenics HL 656 Moly (Molybdenum) grease is recommended for model railway locos, where as the white grease is for RC Boats/Cars. BACHMANN do a grease but I can’t find any recommendations.

Regular silicone or teflon spray grease is probably thin enough to use on model gear trains. You can buy it in Halfords and Woodies. I wouldn't spray it directly into the gears though, just spray some onto a piece of card and apply it to the gears with a cocktail stick.

4 hours ago, Sean said:

One of the 141's i picked up over the past few weeks is the only one im pretty sure had never been run, however once i got it onto the track there was a slight rubbing noise from the mechanism, more like dryness than anything else and it runs as good as any of the other ones, mostly went away running in but its still there a little bit so ive put it to one side until i can pop the bonnet off for a better look.

Pretty sure the mechanism and possibly the gears may be somewhat dry from storage and the thing needs a bit of a service, which got me to thinking the others probabaly could do  with it as well.

Are there any threads already detailing this? as i have done a search and couldnt find much on it(im sure there are though).

What sort of oil should i use? my gut says sillicone but my brain says to double check on here.

Should i pop the bogies open to see if they need greasing too? if soo what kinda grease would be best?

Also going to need to clean a decent amount of loco wheels soon, what is the best type of thing to use for this? are there any guides?

 

Sean

I would open up the bogies to see if any of the grease has gone hard, which is a common problem. Luckily the bogies can be open easily enough and the wheelsets can be removed.

I would clean the gears inside with a soft toothbrush and a little isopropyl alcohol, the same for the wheelsets. Then, after reinserting the wheels you can add a couple of drops of oil. If you can't find an oil specifically for model trains then you can also use sewing machine oil.

8 hours ago, Georgeconna said:

6 is Extremely Low number.  daft Stuff to have it set at 2,  The Roster is 40 on the Dynamis.

 

 

 

Yeah the Prodigy has 16, but only remembers 5 if the unit is powered off. That doesn't really matter though.

To be honest when I was upgrading my DCC system I had narrowed it down to either the Powercab or the Prodigy and after some research the Prodigy won hands down. The recall stack was a big factor, back then you could only expand it to 6 locos if you sent it back for a firmware update, glad to see you can now increase it yourself even if it is only to 6! The Prodigy also has considerably more power than the NCE which only has 1.5A compared to 3A for the Prodigy.

4 hours ago, Noel said:

When switching locos using the 'recall' button this has never happened to me on NCE. I'll have to go into the train room now and try switching using the select loco button and see if this happens.

That's weird quirk to be honest. I can use the recall button or key in the loco address on my Gaugemaster Prodigy and won't reset any functions.

Does the Powercab still have the 2 loco recall stack?