irishthump

Has anyone used neodymium magnets for uncoupling kadees and do they work well. Last layout I did I used the Kadee magnet, but I'm interested in using the neodymium magnets.

I think Boskonay has used them on his layout.....

I don't have a capacitor built into the circuit for the lights.

I have used the circuitry before and found it woks fine using the Hattons 8 PIN with Harness chips.

I just thought a capacitor might be a good idea as the Lima 201 has such poor pickup you might get some flickering, especially over pointwork.

Another issue is that I installed tail lights on a brake van which I controlled with a Hornby decoder. The lights were linked to F0 but every time there was a break in the pickup the lights would go out rather than flicker and you would have to turn them back on with F0. Apparently, some decoders "remember" function settings after a power interuption but some don't.

I got around the problem by wiring the Leds to the motor outputs on the decoder instead and using the throttle to turn them on and off!

I am doing something similar.

 

I am fitting a LIMA 201 with DCC directional lights.

Having ripped the motor and gears out, it will be towed/pushed on the end of my Push/Pull rake with motorised MK4 DVT.

The newer motor in the DVT, from a Bachmann Voyager, has no problem moving 6 coaches and the dummy 201.

 

It does look quite nice on the end of a rake.

I like that idea! Are you going to use some form of "stay alive" for the decoder?

Yep, it was a hornby hst , just re-read your thread, i did work on CV2 no noticable difference.

 

I'll see how it goes and revert to dc and sell if not happy.

 

Thanks for the feedback.

 

Bill

Have you tried different speed step settings? I have found that with certain decoders CV2 changes only work when the loco was set for 128 speed steps as opposed to 28.

I remember a thread on here where somebody had fitted a motor belonging to a CD-Rom unit to Lima BR HST and that made a massive difference to the Loco.

That was me, here's the link - http://irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/77-Graham-s-Workbench/page12#120

It's actually the Hornby HST. The running is vastly improved but it still suffers from poor pickup (although it has slightly better pickup then a Lima).

Its converted now and running fair to OK, I checked on the cap and its recommended to remove it which I did. The pickups, yes definately need more.

 

The 201 running in DC was pretty good but DC seems to be more forgiving than DCC, I now see why people say the old Lima motors weren't the best. I'll fit the lights in a week or two as the wife wants her table back. I ended up stripping the engine down to it component parts and doing a rebuild...cleaning and adding a small drop of oil where necessary. That helped . Its very poor on slow speeds and only when the notch hits 1.5 to 2 on the controller does it move. But once going it tears along and runs extremely well.

 

I remember a thread on here where somebody had fitted a motor belonging to a CD-Rom unit to Lima BR HST and that made a massive difference to the Loco.

Compared to the other three engines I've converted so far its actually a pretty poor runner . At this point its either rebuild the motor, static display or ebay and I save up for a MM Class 201 , 141 or 081.

 

I also converted an Athearn F7A unit and that runs like a fecking sports car and to me it seems to run better than it did on DC. I even fitted the led as the MARS light, I bought that unit 14 years ago in Canada along with a B unit , an SD40 and some freight cars. Far different motor though.

 

 

Worse comes to worse I'll jsut convert it back to DC running and sell it. I'll fit the chip to another loco.

 

Been fun though.

 

Bill

Have you tried adjusting the starting voltage for the decoder? This is CV2 but I'm not sure if it's supported on the decoder you used.

Personally I would'nt bother with this loco on DCC, it's just too much hard work to get it running well and even then the results won't be great.

You could also consider using the body on a different chassis. I think the Athearn SD45 is the closest fit and requires some work but as you know the Athearn chassis are reliable even with the stock motor.

Hi guys,

 

I'm going to be starting the switch-over of my Lima 201 to digital running, using a Digitax DH126. I'm going to fitting leds to replace the existing bulbs and also fitting red leds for the reverse lights.

 

Any thing I need to watch for? Is the capacitor fitted to the engine requried?

 

 

Bill

If you're talking about the capacitor that is installed across the motor contacts (the white square in the photo below) then yes, it should be removed before fitting a decoder as it will cause running problems.

Also make sure the loco runs as well as possible on DC before installing the decoder. If it's runs poorly on DC it will ten times as bad on DCC!

Power pickup is a problem on Lima locos, there is only pickup form one side on the motor bogie and the opposite side on the rear bogie. It may be worthwhile installing extra pickups on the rear bogie.

IT, I like the idea of drop-in and play rather than having to shave bits off speakers or the loco body. I wonder how it compares to the bass reflex speakers that members seem to speak highly of? Anyone happen to have compared these two speakers?

I plan to soon, I haven't had a chance to install a Loksound into this loco yet. But the speaker is the same one in the 071 which always sound fine to me. I'm sure you would get a bit more "low end" from a bass reflex speaker but I doubt it would make a huge difference.

I used the bass reflex in my other 141's but I refused to cut up the loco so I simply removed the back from the speaker. Did'nt seem to effect the sound.

You may get US chips at a slightly lower rate but you'd still be talking 90 euro plus. There are some for 40-50 quid mark with generic sounds but they (well to me, anyway) sound dreadful.

 

Hornby and Bachmann US are doing locos with cheap sounds but the former dont do any EMD sounds and the latter use tsunami sound boards which might not be transplantable. Irish Thump has an F Unit with tsunami sounds so he may be able to help there. They're limited in functions but the engine note is spot on for something like a 141 or 121.

Like Warbonnet says the Bachmann F units I have use a budget version of the Tsunami. I posted this video before, but here it is again....

The sound quality is the same as the high end Tsunamis, but there are very few other features. No start-up or shutdown sequence, and only horn and bell. The horn has 3 different sounds to choose from but none of them would pass for an Irish loco! However the decoder is fully adjustable for motor control and the engine sound can be adjusted for manual notching.

To be honest I wouldn't bother with trying to use US decoders for Irish diesels. The engine sounds are bang on for 121/141/071 and 201's but the lack of correct horns is a big problem. Another factor is that design of the Tsunami means you would have to remove the existing circuit board from a MM loco and wire in the Tsunami. Not a huge or difficult job but why bother when you can plug a 21 pin Loksound or Zimo straight into the existing circuit board?

The Zimo MX644D decoder can be bought for about €82 from German sites (i.e. £60), but you would need a Zimo programmer and sound files to burn onto it. Speaker for a 141/181 is about €6. No speaker needed for 071/201 as chassis include them.

That's where I find the ESU Loksound comes out ahead. The Lokprogrammer is around €140 and all the sound files are free to download from ESU. They have a large collection of European and American sound files (as well as miscellaneous sounds) which can be mixed and matched to any degree. The decoders are a bit more expensive, around €99 from some suppliers and come with a speaker (although the speaker is too large for 141/181 locos.

Maplins sell a speaker for €4.50 which is suitable.

It's a drop-in fit for the speaker cradle on the 141/181.

the feedback from rmweb, is that he hasn't bothered upgrading the UK sound files to V4 of the Zimo and hence requires V3,5, which is disappearing, maybe he has V4 versions of the irish sound files. have you an email for him ?

 

Mind you I dont think v4 is actually shipping as Zimo keep delaying it.

You're actually talking about ESU Loksound V3.5 and V4.

Mr Soundguy did the first 141/181 sound decoder which was available from DCC supplies and was loaded onto a Loksound V3.5. For whatever reason, Mr Soundguy stopped working with DCC supplies and started supplying the 141 sound file for Model Shop Belfast on Zimo decoders.

You're right though in that the Loksound V3.5 file was never modified to be loaded on to the V4 which was only becoming available at the time. The V3.5 is no longer produced but can sometimes pick them up second hand. I believe DCC Supplies still has the 141 sound file and can "re blow" a V3.5 if you can get your hands on one.

I posted many many times,video of my A class with

sound on this site.

Apologies, Enniscorthyman!

Yes I've seen your videos, I was just surprised no one had posted that particular video here.

@Noel: Sound does seem a little distorted. Maybe he just had the volume turned up for the benefit of the video.

Where can these now be purchased ?

I checked Mr Soundguy's website but he hasn't got these available yet. But he's obviously planning on releasing them soon.

I just saw this video over on RMWeb and I was surprised I hadn't seen it here. Sounds excellent IMHO.

It is also not recommended (per that manufacturer) to chip the loco until it has been run in. I suspect it doesn't do anything good for the decoder (although it may not damage it) and any CVs that you set such as momentum, top speed etc may all change as the running characteristics of the motor it controls changes.

 

It doesn't really matter if you run in a loco on DC or DCC. As Dave said, the motor receives DC current from the decoder anyway. Running in a loco on DCC won't effect the decoder. (Unless the loco drive binds right from the start and stalls the motor, but newer motors don't draw enough amps to burn out a decoder even when stalled.)

The reason manufacturers recommend running in before installing a decoder is to make sure it's the mechanism is in order before opening up the loco for the DCC install. If you install a decoder and it doesn't run well you have no way of knowing if it's the decoder or motor at fault!

Also when opening the loco you run the risk of damaging it and invalidating the warrantee.

I've used "blade-switching" successfully without much of a problem. It's worth checking each point for clean operation before installation, some tweaking of the wiper contacts is sometimes necessary.

It's best to modify any point (insulfrog or electrofrog) by wiring jumpers between the stock and closure rails. This way you no longer rely on the blades making an electrical connection. You can then paint the sides of the rails to your hearts content and not have to worry about poor conductivity.

You should get away with it, if it's not connected to the rails.

You would have to be very careful, there is no gap between the metal and the plastic. And with Peco points the frog is much smaller.

Not to mention the fact that the paint will wear of quite quickly and be spread all over the layout and the wheels of your rolling stock.

 

If your points are in gauge and working for you, and your wagons are square, just put some silver paint on the top of the frog, some track colour on the side, and carry on.

 

 

Alan

Don't use metallic paint on a plastic frog, the whole point is that it is insulated. Some metallic paints are conductive.

Nice! I have a proto 2000 F7 A-B-B-A set in SP black widow with factory sound (QSI) and the sound is so poor compared to yours. I thought the tsunami was the best but the loksound sounds superb! Are the 8 pin or board replacements?

Thanks, Fran.

I'll be honest, I have an F7 A&B fitted with Tsunamis and while they sound great the Loksound is just as good and has much better control.

It's an 8 pin decoder and I hardwired an 8 pin socket into the A unit as well as a bass enhanced speaker. I made the B unit into a dummy and installed a second speaker in the shell. Both are wired in series to the decoder, you can see the speaker wires going between the units. I also used a drawbar between the units rather than couplers.

Just finished installing sound in this loco. Proto 1000 A&B units fitted with a Loksound decoder.

[video=youtube;7YEf3-L_khA]

Would love to see a video if you get the chance, Rich!

How many different engine sounds are on the decoder?

I used 10mm MDF for my the baseboards on my new layout. It's bog-standard grade from my local building suppliers but I find it fine so far. I used 18mm ply for the last layout

but it was normal "B&Q" grade so it was less than satisfactory for many of the reasons already mentioned. I looked into birch ply but, as was said, it was too expensive. I also had a few issues with the ply warping because of the temperature changes in my attic. It wasn't too severe but it caused some problems where baseboards butted against each other.

Another thing is that you will seldom get any plywood sheets from a supplier that don't have some distortion, usually from poor storage. The likes of Woodies and B&Q are even worse!

The new baseboards are supported on a frame of 2X1 softwood. Sounds a bit lightweight, but this frame is itself supported by the rafters in my attic so it is more than rigid enough. Track pins aren't an issue for my as I glue my track. I use clear "No More Nails" for fixing the track to the foam underlay which is itself fixed to the MDF board with the same adhesive.

One more issue which hasn't been mentioned; if you are planning to use point motors you need to give some thought to the thickness of the board. Using a "sandwich" of foam and other materials will make it very difficult to install point motors under the baseboards.

The book "First steps in railway modelling" by CJ Freezer has a detailed discussion on building baseboards. Marks Models and other outlets should have it available.

That book is nearly 30 years old. I hope it has been revised to take into account the advances in building materials....

Thanks IT, so is it a sound chip, sound decoder, or sound card that go's into the loco, or are they all the same thing, just different names for the same thing, & yes I haven't got a clue about these things, thanks

Paul

Yes there are several names for it, decoder chip, sound card. They're all valid!

Sorry about that it, should have said what's the difference in the decoders in the MM as compared to ESU, etc. is the quality better or what, thanks,

Paul

No problem!

The MM sound decoders are regular ESU Loksound V4's.

As Dhu Varren said the files are freely available on the ESU website for the 071's and 201's. These can be programmed to the decoders if you have the ESU lokprogrammer.

All of my 201, 071 and 141/181 decoders have been programmed this way.