Noel

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/0102/495560-waterford-train/

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/railway-line-closed-after-landslide-29881267.html

The Waterford and Tramore was famous for only having doors on one side of its coaches as the platforms at Waterford and Tramore were both on the one side of the line. Curiously some of the UTA MPD units were built with drive on the RHS & some on the LHS.

 

Placing the driving controls in a cubicle on the RHS rather than in a full width cab would have followed in W&T tradition and importantly allowed passengers to board through the vestibule doors at either end without major structural alterations to the aluminium body framing.

 

Some of the 1904-1908 main line brake standards built in the early 50s were built with driving cabs for use on the AEC railcar worked Westland Row-Galway/Westport "Cu na Mara" express service to allow the train to split at Athlone. The use of the driving trailers was short lived as the train grew from a 4 to a 6 car set and Westport eventually got its own fast direct services.

I think I may have travelled on one of these during the 60s. I remember the train splitting and being able to see forward.

I designed our layout to accommodate 6 coach mainline trains for that very reason. Most full scale Dub-Cork trains were 8 coach rakes during 80s/90s. I remember having to be seated at one end of a train to get to the correct destination due to a train split on route at an intermediate stop. A waiting loco would take half the rake to a different destination.

Great tip, thanks.

...and a good one it is too!!

But when are the MkVII CAV 200mp intercity express models going to production. They've been running from Dublin City West central station to Cork since 2025 in under an hour and we have no sign of the models!!! Not to mention Celti-Tunnel trains from Rosslare Culchi Port to Fishguard.

Excellent. Your layout looks wonderful.

This is the thing 7 years ago there was fa rtr irish models, lima 201's had eventually sold out and were hitting big money on fleabay and elsewhere, now wehave decent top of the range models thanks to Mr Murphy, 141/181's rival ANY rtr model of its time, the cravens are superb, themk 2's , 071's & 201's complete the modern day diesel fleet, give the guy a chance to get the neccessary resources together for the 121's & beyond. With the economy recovering albeit slowly more and more people will start buying extra models this will clear excess stock and hopefully in the near future we can gave our 121's whizzing around our layouts while complaining about the lack of a modern a class. Till then get buying his current stock and it may come sooner rather than late, now im off too find the mrs's credit card to buy me another 201

Fair comment to a degree. As a "customer" one has choice to buy or not to buy a 201. Customers are not 'sponsors' nor supporters of a business, but may well be a fan of some of a businesses products or services. It doesn't really square that a customer should buy one product that they don't want or need in order to gain access to another product. Lets be positive, the model market is slowly recovering from the deep recession, and there should be greater supply and diversity in the coming years across the board from all vendors.

PS: BTW, its not that I don't like the model 201s, it's just that I was never a fan of the actual life size 201 boxy locos.

Million dollar question for me is will Murphy Models bring out an 001 Class model at any stage? I am purposefully not buying the Silver Fox model in the hope that Murphy Models or some other manufacturer releases a high spec detailed 001 Class model. Silver Fox model is ok, but looks totally out of place alongside Murphy Models locos. There is just no comparison really.

+1

If MM GMs didn't exist I would have jumped at SF 001 class, but they just don't compare to the MMs. MM have raised the bar so high its seems unfair really to compare with SF. The all wheel drive and all wheel pickup of the 141/181 chassis is simply in a league of its own and enables such realistic operation with no stalling whatsoever. The MM body detailing and paint work again is two gears higher. I too would buy a handful of 001s if MM ever produce them. Many folk may probably only buy a pair of 121s if they appear in MM product line (i.e. a pair nose to nose close coupled double heading), hence 001 may sell more but I could be wrong. The 001 in CIE black with the white stripe and lower orange band is the biz!!!

Enjoyed those. Thanks for posting.

It would seem to me that if there are shops with stock of 201's, 121's, or what ever, then the logical thing to do is reduce the price, it do'snt always have to be profit, profit, profit

Er, sorry but running a business is about profit. Without it there is no business and we all end up living back in caves. (apologies for tongue in cheek)

Troops

The 121 is a basic math problem

P Murphy has stumped up his own money for everything we now can buy under the Murphy Models flag

Before he can stump up any more money he has to get what he has paid out back

When he gets this money back he will go into production of the 121

The 201's in whatever livery have to sell before this happens

So you know what you have to do, simples

That's a logical and understandable obvservation. However I have in the past few months acquired quite a stable of 141, 181 and 071s, and MM coaching stock. Unfortunately and personally the 201s don't interest me so I won't be buying any. Again purely personal taste, but CIE black and orange super train coaches without the later double white lining don't interest me either, but I appreciate thats just my own personal idiosyncrasy. I have nothing but positive opinions about MM, especially as the awesome 141,181,071s reignited my dormant interest in this hobby. However, in business market research informs what products the customers want, and what volumes one can expect at different price points.

I'm sure MM is well on top of this, but anecdotally and without any evidence it does seem a significant portion of MMs existing customer base may be more interested in 001 and 121s than 201s. The real market research numbers will tell what the real demand is. I'm sure the customer base is a broad church, some customers preferring the older Irish railways era, others preferring contemporary trains, and everything in between. The 201 in IE Green/Grey and Enterprise liveries look superb, its just I find the life size prototypes boring looking locos and from the modern era, rather characterless locos compared to the older GMs with their walkways and travel memories, and the A class 001s.

Purely from my own self interest point of view, I am disappointed to see yet more 201s, instead of 001 or 121s. My own personal favourite is the MM 141 especially the CIE black livery, the most stunning looking and best running model locos I have ever owned and run. Hats off to PM, he is running a business and I hope he gets a good return from it. Putting money into a business is just business, the numbers either stack up or they don't. I wish MM well and hope now that the economy has weathered the worst recession since the 1920s, that demand will increase and production runs of past products become profitable, especially as the tooling costs have been absorbed. I am staggered how MM managed to release so many excellent locos since 2008 during such a harsh economic climate. Prices will have to go up for MM products as will Bachmann and any other company manufacturing in China, as labour costs are increasing significantly as the tide of economic activity is benefiting the wider Chinese population. Personally I'm very content with my existing models and very happy to stick with what I have for now, but if someday in the future 121s and 001s ever emerge, I will invest in a loco shed for a few of them.

Well done MM and thank you for stunning looking and sublime running Irish models

PS: I hope we don't see any MM railcar or DMUs anytime soon. Loco hauled stock means interesting operations, running around trains, shunting, mixed traffic freight trains, the essence of railways rather than mere soulless buses on rails that are boring railcars.

Respect! They are superb. Love the paint job you did on them also.

Noel

 

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, but .......

 

NIR Blue is great - it's like GNR Blue - the World's greatest ever livery (mind you the Milwaukee's Hiawathas had a pretty amazing colour scheme);

Supertrain orange and black was simple but very effective - it did look good on an A Class with a rake of uniform Mark 2s

 

BUT, have to agree with you, the Black and Tan livery had a certain je ne sais quoi and really looked good on certain locos and stock.

 

For me, a silver A Class, please (although i've got one of John Silverfox's) and a grey / yellow single-ended Yankee.

 

A final point, the 201s are a bit characterless, but they really do look good in the two tone grey / green livery. Thanks Mr Graham, who supplied mine.

 

Leslie

Hi Leslie, fair comment. However I always thought the original 1972 CIE supertrain livery was truly awful. The later IR/IE livery with the two white strips separating the black from the orange greatly improved it, and the later black roof finally put the icing on the cake. The enterprise livery is nice. Years ago I had some mk2b coaches in the old CIE super train livery, and they annoyed me so much I repainted them BR blue & grey.

Noel

Noel, that loco is noisy, much more so than mine.

 

My small GMs use Loksound V3.5 decoders, 2 with Mr Soundguy sounds. He used to do sound for DCC Supplies, but now does it for Belfast Model Shop on Zimo decoders. I used to have one loco fitted with a Zimo from BMS, but I could not get it to match with the Loksounds for multiple running, so I sold it on. I also have 2 locos fitted with V3.5 decoders with modified downloads from ESU. Although not correct in terms of original loco type, in my opinion, they capture the sound of small GMs brilliantly. Irishthump got the same loco sound blown for him on a V4 decoder some time ago, and posted a video of it on this site.

I also had an 071 and a 201 fitted with Zimo decoders from BMS, but, although the sounds were good, I just could not get the sounds to synchronise with the loco movement, unlike the Loksounds. They too were sold on and replaced with V4s.

After CV54 auto calibration. Speed much better but still noisy.

[video=youtube_share;2wQnYVfwYVM]

Will try it on DC later to see if its quieter at low speed.

A retaining wall needs to be built before passenger trains can use the main platforms once again.

Is this a case of H&S lunacy or are there actual serious problems with the cliff face (i.e. massive boulders falling down rather than mere 1ft rocks)? Should do what the swiss railways do, just clip the rock face in inexpensive chicken wire, instead of insanely expensive concrete structures that are totally over engineered.

End result

Bachmann 57xx Pannier tank split chassis after DCC conversion using TCS-T1 decoder.

[video=youtube_share;HLJQaGN6xOY]

I will replace this with a TCS T1-KA 2 (keep alive) decoder to help it over insulfrog points. In the other 57xx which is also bachmann but not split chassis I will try a DCC Concepts ZEN ZN68 which is much better value (if it works), and very compact but not suitable for very old motors requiring more than 1amp.

After these two conversions are complete I hope to be able to standardise on decoders for the rest of my 15-20yo steam collection. The older locos will be retired to static display (e.g. Hornby Dublo, Triang and older Hornby). Hopefully I won't need keep-alive modules in the tender locos that have longer wheel bases and more pickups.

Fitting 21pin decoders into MM GMs seems very easy compared to these older models.

I like the look of 230,not sure about 233,

Really like the NIR blue and will probably get 208 and 230,

There goes the wedding fund money!!!

Nothing to do with the model as it is a replica of the real thing, but I always thought the NIR blue loco liveries were rather plain (i.e. fischer price like). Two or three tone colouring always looks better, especially with a little bit of lining for detail. The NIR marketing department could perhaps modernise the branding.

Must be an NCE thing. My Lenz works fine on POM. I have just been checking one of my 071s against a 181. My 141/181s are fitted with Loksound V3.5 decoders, and at crawl speed, with sound off, the 181 produced a faint sound similar to the 071 like you described. The 071 actually crawls slower than the 181, but is slightly noisier. Must just be the motor type, after all, the locos are made by different manufacturers for MM. Anyway, since all my locos are sound fitted, and I don't run my locos with the sound off, it is not such an issue for me.

Thanks DV, that was very helpful. As you say it could have been a LokSound/NCE thing re the need to use program track. Other CVs can be POM fine with the LokSound, just CV54 refused so far. I've never had an issue with the Lenz either. I am astonished how slow and utterly silent the 141s and 181s are with both Lenz Silver and Bachmann 36-557 decoders. I've never owned locos so smooth at crawl before and so smooth over peco code 100 insulfrog points.

Comparison BEFORE recalibration - the hum is coming from the 071, the 181 is silent

Both speed step 1 of 28

[video=youtube_share;Unu499Iy4d4]

I consider myself relatively new to DCC so I learn something new every time I try something different with it. Being an IT bod, I find the whole DCC decoder thing fascinating, with no real standards between decoder manufacturers other than the API and track DCC messaging standards despite NMRA.

Ideally it would be easier to standardise on one brand of decoder and learn their programming, BEMF, speed curves and motor tuning CVs. But not all decoders fit or suit all locos, especially older non-DCC steam locos where TCS and DCC Concepts Zen seem to have the edge for fit and driving older spec models with limited wheel pickups and compact keep-alive features for running slowly over points.

PS: What sound chips do you use in your MM 141/181s - Zimo or ESU or other?

Success! Thanks DV.

Auto calibration, CV54 needed to be set to 0 on the program track rather POM, then lift loco onto the main, press F1 and off she set like a march hare. It won't work if CF54 is set to 0 on the main track! Could be an NCE thing.

The auto tuning seemed to set CVs51-55 to similar values to yours. Minor adjustment to CV2 after as she was a little too slow, and now she is creeping as slowly the as the 141s and 181a. However the motor is still noisy at crawl speeds which is probably because ESU handle BEMF differently to the Lenz silver decoders in the 141/181s. When I get some spare time I will try a Lenz silver in the 071 to see if that makes a difference to the motor noise when crawling. I wonder of the ESU decoder is using aggressive PWM pulsing at low speed steps.

One other disapointing niggle with my new rake of cravens are the ultra reflective mirror like windows. None of my other coaches have plastic windows as reflective and you can clearly see inside the coaches from any viewing angle, but from some angles the craven's reflective windows really spoil the look of the coaches. Has anybody found a way to weather them or make them more satin in appearance (e.g. like Bachmann, Hornby and Dapol coaches which have clear plastic sheets behind the window frames rather than flush glazing plastic which obviously is not flat due to moulding).

Very strange Noel. It must be something to do with the NCE system. Although I have set up an NCE system for a friend, I am not familiar enough with it to make any suggestions.

 

I have just been checking my 071s, and found one that I had not calibrated. I have now just done it using the instructions mentioned, and it did exactly what it should have done.

 

Anyway, what I would suggest, is either try the calibration using someone else's equipment, not NCE, or put in manual entries. Having checked my locos, I found the calibrated CV values were very similar in all locos, so you could try those. Loco 1, CV51 0, CV52 18, CV53 89, CV54 50, CV55 18. Loco 2, CV51 0, CV52 18, CV53 94, CV54, 57, CV55 18.

Thanks DV. I will try those later. Having just re-read the "ESU LokSound v4.0 Murphy Models Class 071/111" manual, the CVs don't seem to match yours and they don't document CV51. The LokSound 4.0 manual on the ESU website coincides with your suggestions and setting.

I will post a video later showing a 181 and 071 running side by side one speed step 1 of 28. The 071 motor is noisy with hum and the loco moving at about three times the crawl speed of the 181 which is totally silent. I'm sure I am doing something wrong. I wonder if the MM LokSound chip has been programmed differently in some way. I might try another CV8=8 reset on the programming track. I've had not problems so far programming other aspects of this decoder (e.g. brightness of lights and sound volume).

Anyway video to follow as soon as I get to upload it at my jurassic Eircom broadband speeds.

Thanks. But after storing 0 in CV54, the sound starts immediately I press F1 and loco does not move.

It's the Murphy 071 sound decoder which I think is a LokSound 4.0.

Noel, have you calibrated the motor of the 071 using CV 54. The Loksound V4 decoder has an automatic calibration process which involves matching the characteristics of the motor with the decoder.

 

Place the loco on a piece of level track, at least 10ft long. Make sure the loco is going to run in the direction of the clear track. Switch off all functions, and set speed at 0. Enter 0 into CV 54, and go back to the throttle. Press F1, and the loco will take off like a scalded cat for a second or two and then stop. The engine noise starts, and your loco is calibrated.

Thank DV

When you say press F1 do you mean function 1 button. I tried that but it switches the loco sound on (i.e. engine startup). Also tried setting CV 54 to 0 and then speed step 1.

Thanks

Noel

I have one 071 but a number of 141/181s and have noticed a marked difference in speed range on DCC. The 071 has a higher top speed, but the 141/181s I have are far superior at ultra slow start and crawl speeds. They are also silent whereas the 071 starts at a higher speed with some motor hum. Has anybody else noticed this or could this just be the 071 sample I have. It is quite noisy at startup compared to the totally silent 141/181s.

The 071 has LokSound v4 decoder, and the 141/181 have a mix of Lenz Silver and Bachmann 36-557 decoders. All set to 28 step speed. I've tried a few different CV settings on the LokSound including setting CV2 to zero and one, but I cannot seem to get it to start anywhere near as slow as the 141/181s. It could be different gearing. Has anybody noticed similar difference between their 141/181 and 071 locos, or any words of wisdom?

Thanks.

Noel

Here's an interesting thread on the subject of 141 couplings....

 

http://www.irishrailwaymodeller.com/showthread.php/527-Improving-the-looks-for-MM-141-181

That is fantastic. Thanks for digging that thread out. I might try this with the other end of the loco and put the standard coupling back in. As the 141/181s are so short having the coupling fixed to the body rather than the bogie should be fine. Many thanks all for replies. Running in 183 as I type.

UPDATE: Skirt fitted ok after shaving 1/2mm off the front of the coupling socket.