C.I.E. 32XX Conversions

[iarnrod]

In 1978, CIE converted the following Brake/GSV coaches from earlier built coaches :

 

3213

3214

3215

3216

3217

3218

 

Can anyone confirm the original coach numbers of these coaches? CIE frequently put the original coach numbers on their drawings of carriage conversions around this time, so if anyone has a drawing for these coaches, chances are it has the original numbers on it.

 

I have a list of unconfirmed numbers for these coaches, but trying to get a confirmation. IRRS Journal, or any other publication where one would normally look, does not list original numbers for these coaches.

 

Any help greatly appreciated.

[josefstadt]

The full list of conversions for the 32xx vans is:

 

Brake Standard GSV

3201 converted from 1339

3202 converted from 1350

3203 converted from 1347

3204 converted from 1340

3205 converted from 1341

3206 converted from 1348

3207 converted from 1349

3208 converted from 1354

3209 converted from 1355

3210 converted from 1351

3211 converted from 1352

3212 converted from 1353

 

GSV

3213 converted from 2580

3214 converted from 2587

3215 converted from 2588

3216 converted from 2589

3217 converted from 2590

3218 converted from 2592

 

Brake Standard GSV

3219 converted from 2578

3220 converted from 2577

3221 converted from 2586

3222 converted from 2584

3223 converted from 2572

3224 converted from 2582

Edited April 28, 2015 by josefstadt

[iarnrod]

Many thanks for that, Josefstadt. Much appreciated

 

Can I ask what your source of information is for the 3213-3218 coaches please, as all the other numbers tally with the numbers that I have for those coaches, but the 3213-3218 ones differ to what I have?

 

Crude copy of the C.I.E. drawing that I have for 3201-3212 lists 3202 as ex-1347 and 3203 as ex-1350, so just wondering if you confirm source for those ones aswell please.

 

Thanks once again.

Edited April 28, 2015 by iarnrod

[josefstadt]

The source was the CIÉ Coaching stock register which I obtained a copy of from the Technical Office in Inchicore during the 1980s. The data above came from the pages detailing the 32xx vans. However, when I checked the pages showing the 13xx Standards the conversions you have, i.e. 1347 to 3202 and 1350 to 3203, are listed. So someone made a transcription error when making the notes on the original register. Unfortunately I have no way of knowing for certain which is the error, but as your info comes from a drawing it is likely that that is the correct sequence.

[jhb171achill]

3223 is preserved and in traffic at Downpatrick, and may be photographed and measured there.

[josefstadt]

Iarnrod, a bit more info on the history of the 32xx vans. The first series, 3201-12 was straight forward with the donor vehicle being as built originally - e.g. 1339 remained as built (apart from cosmetic changes) until conversion to 3201. However, the other two series, 3213-18 and 3219-24 were more complicated with the donor vehicles going through a number of changes before conversion into a 32xx type van. In the list below the the progression is from right to left. Note that the change from a 21xx Composite to a 16xx Standard did not involve structural alterations and was really just a reclassification of the first class accommodation to standard class. The dates given are probably when the work was signed off rather than the entry of the vehicle into traffic.

 

Brake Standard GSV

 

3201 (24/06/77) ← 1339 (1951)

3202 (24/06/77) ← 1347 (1951)

3203 (01/07/77) ← 1350 (1951)

3204 (08/07/77) ← 1340 (1951)

3205 (15/07/77) ← 1341 (1951)

3206 (25/08/77) ← 1348 (1951)

3207 (08/09/77) ← 1349 (1951)

3208 (15/09/77) ← 1354 (1952)

3209 (11/10/77) ← 1355 (1952)

3210 (27/10/77) ← 1351 (1952)

3211 (24/11/77) ← 1352 (1952)

3212 (21/12/77) ← 1353 (1952)

 

GSV

 

3213 (10/02/78) ← 2580 (07/03/74) ← 1620 (00/11/72) ← 2128 (1951)

3214 (23/03/78) ← 2587 (21/05/74) ← 1345 (1951)

3215 (12/05/78) ← 2588 (27/05/74) ← 1346 (1951)

3216 (07/07/78) ← 2589 (16/08/74) ← 1342 (1951)

3217 (25/08/78) ← 2590 (16/08/74) ← 1343 (1951)

3218 (15/09/78) ← 2592 (16/08/74) ← 1344 (1951)

 

Brake Standard GSV

 

3219 (16/07/80) ← 2578 (16/02/74) ← 1622 (00/11/72) ← 2125 (1950)

3220 (23/07/80) ← 2577 (01/02/74) ← 1614 (00/11/72) ← 2152 (1954)

3221 (22/08/80) ← 2586 (03/05/74) ← 1625 (00/11/72) ← 2155 (1954)

3222 (12/09/80) ← 2584 (09/05/74) ← 1615 (00/09/72) ← 2134 (1952)

3223 (17/09/80) ← 2572 (00/12/73) ← 1611 (30/06/72) ← 2144 (1954)

3224 (21/10/80) ← 2582 (12/04/74) ← 1623 (00/11/72) ← 2132 (1952)

[iarnrod]

Excellent stuff Josefstadt. Many thanks.

[Jawfin]

Very helpful info

[BSGSV]

3213 (10/02/78) ← 2580 (07/03/74) ← 1620 (00/11/72) ← 2128 (1951)

 

2128 was a 60' coach, and so was shorter than the other conversions, which were 61' 6". Is there anything indicating this difference in drawings or lists?

[jhb171achill]

That's interesting re 2128. Almost certainly built originally on an earlier GSR (Bredin era) chassis.

[BSGSV]

That's interesting re 2128. Almost certainly built originally on an earlier GSR (Bredin era) chassis.

I think CIE just followed the "standard" length for the first batch of compos in 1951. The change to 61' 6" was to allow the compos from then on to have four 1st and three 3rd class compartments, rather than three and four respectively.

[StevieB]

I think we've been here before - CIE Compartment Cars - What type of coaches?

 

StevieB

[josefstadt]

2128 was a 60' coach, and so was shorter than the other conversions, which were 61' 6". Is there anything indicating this difference in drawings or lists?

 

As indeed was 2125 [3219 (16/07/80) ← 2578 (16/02/74) ← 1622 (00/11/72) ← 2125 (1950)].

[josefstadt]

BSGSV has pointed out an error in the post #6. The sequence for 3219 should read:

 

3219 (16/07/80) ← 2578 (16/02/74) ← 1622 (00/11/72) ← 2131 (1952).

 

So ignore post #13 as this was a 61' 6" coach, not a 60' one.