450 Class Scrapping

[UP6936]

School was getting out early today, so i headed down to adelaide yard to take pictures of the 450s getting scrapped. Quite sad to see them cut in half and on trucks.

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[Kirley]

Thanks for the pictures, sad sight indeed.

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

are any of the 450 class or 80 class still in service or are they all gone?

[Hunslet 102]

The 450s were never very popular as they replaced the popular 70 class railcars and were not as comfortable.That said,they remained in service for nearly 30 years,not bad for a make do and mend type railcar.Yet another NIR railcar not considered worthy for preservation,only the possibility of an 80 class being preserved will break the mould of bias towards railcars being preserved.Thanks for posting the photo's.

[kevrail]

The 450s were never very popular as they replaced the popular 70 class railcars and were not as comfortable.That said,they remained in service for nearly 30 years,not bad for a make do and mend type railcar.Yet another NIR railcar not considered worthy for preservation,only the possibility of an 80 class being preserved will break the mould of bias towards railcars being preserved.Thanks for posting the photo's.

Why would they want to preserve anything re railways. It is NIR we are talking about. -- Not Interested in Railways (NIR)

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

I'm no fan of railcars (bar the class 80) I'd love to see them all sitting on the back of a lorry like that one in the picture.

[jhb171achill]

The thing about railcar preservation is that two factors have to be taken into account; the emotional and the practical. The "emotional" relates to the natural attachment we all, as enthusiasts, have towards certain vehicles. In truth, railcars are much less popular among the majority of enthusiasts than steam or diesel locomotives - that said, they are of equal historic interest. However, preservationists are volunteers, free to go to the ITG / DCDR / RPSI or not, as they see fit. Bein volunteers, they work on what they want to work on themselv es, and excellent results ensue. The fact that among even railcars, 450s were about the least popular (along with the awful MEDs and MPDs). Personally, I detested tht things. They were ugly, severely uncomfortable to travel in, with two speeds: "stop" and "go". In winter they were draughty and freezing, in summer stuffy. The seats were so much lower than the windows that a decent view out involved sitting upright. Ghastly things. Fair enough, that's just my view: others may differe and I respect that. But the reality is that among my own contacts in the RPSI, DCDR and ITG (and I am a member of all three), I am unaware of one person who would have any real interest in preserving one.

 

Now - the other reason is more important; the practical. Nobody, but nobody, among the general public would be interested in a DCDR or RPSI day out in one, thus preservation of one as a revenue-earning train is unrealistic. That said, should someone stump up sufficient money and space, there's no reason why one could not have been saved as a static exhibit somewhere.

 

Overall, I would personally take the view that an 80 class is historically of much greater worthiness for preservation - as indeed is the last remaining AEC car, 6111 in inchicore, still in posession of its original steam heating boiler.

 

The length of time it has been there, and the extent to which it is well known among enthusiasts, and the attendant lack of interest by anyone in putting down money and time to preserve it, tells its own story.

 

A pity, but there ye go. I suppose the bottom line is that we can hardly preserve everything; the lack of any MGWR or CBSCR loco surviving the pogrom of the early 1960s is also a shame, but nobody's died as a result.....

[Hunslet 102]

In winter they were draughty and freezing, in summer stuffy.

 

That is what railcars were all about back in the day.Would certainly agree with most of your points,although awful MEDs would not be one of them! Railcars have always been the 'poor relations' in railway terms and I can see why there would be little interest in preserving them.I have heard rumours that an 80 class could be preserved,but I would have my doubts that that will ever happen,your own post would virtually back that up.

 

Ah well,I will just need to keep modelling them on my layout for them to live on!

[jhb171achill]

That's the good thing about model railways - we can preserve and operate what we like, even if nobody else is interested! Notwithstanding what I said, the unique ex- SLNCR railcar is at Downpatrick and the plan is to restore it (albeit a very long term project), and watch this space re an 80 class.....................!!

[Sentinel281]

A great issue in preserving historical vehicles, be it railcars or buses or trams or sth the like is to overcome the stage when they are regarded as rubbish. When their livetime ends, normally everybody (ie every normal passenger) regards them as "the old ones" but not as something historical. At that stage the vehicles often have not had much attention as the workshops previously knew about the nearing end of service. Thus the old generation of railcars at the end of its live nearly always is a rather bad state. As mentioned above by another member, they are generally of the same historical interrest as locos or carriages. I presume riding in a Great Northern railbus (of the converted bus ones) might also not have been quite comfortable. Today it would be fun riding in one. Or riding on wooden seats with steep backs where you can sit on upright or not at all is not a question of comfort, but people love it as it somehow feels and smells like good old time, despite the fact these times might not have been really good. Think about all the "mk1 railcars" that existed in Ireland. These early examples would be great for any historical railway today. I think today the 450s are regarded as crap and thus demolished. Looking forward 50 years they will be good old time and nobody would bother if they are cold in winter and hot in summer. I also know about the difficulties described above, when every vehicle is wired individually and no proper plans are available, this is really a problem if you want to run it for a long time. One final thougt: A 450 is probably much more suitable to get a historical vehicle than a 22k ever will be as it has by far not as much electronics as modern vehicles do what, in my eyes, will convict most modern railcars to a fate as standing objects in Museums some 70 years in the future (if they will ever survive that long).

[Hunslet 102]

A great issue in preserving historical vehicles, I think today the 450s are regarded as crap and thus demolished. Looking forward 50 years they will be good old time and nobody would bother if they are cold in winter and hot in summer. One final thougt: A 450 is probably much more suitable to get a historical vehicle than a 22k ever will be as it has by far not as much electronics as modern vehicles do what, in my eyes, will convict most modern railcars to a fate as standing objects in Museums some 70 years in the future (if they will ever survive that long).

 

I think with preservation,most of us would like to see as much railway history as possible preserved,which of course will never be the case.When I talk of preservation,I am not just meaning something being restored to its former glories,I would be quite happy to see them as static exhibits in museums.Take the 3 NIR Hunslet loco's,103 Merlin was scrapped early in its life,101 Eagle was at the RPSI at Whitehead for years before also having to be scrapped and 102 Falcon would have probably had a similar fate before being moved to the transport museum at Cultra.None of the railcars even had a chance of becoming a static display,although I am sure the vast majority of the viewing public would not spend much time viewing a railcar anyway.

If there is something in the pipeline for an 80 class to be preserved then that is good news and to be welcomed.