Angus

Always good to answer your own question! I was just noodling through some bookmarked websites and came across this: https://athboy100.com/2016/05/17/the-athboy-railway-station/ Mid-way down there is a great photo of the turntable release at Athboy (if you open image in a new tab it opens up bigger), including what looks to me to be a ground signal, no sign of any trap though.

Very nice KMCE! The curve on those tanks are particularly satisfying, it would have been very easy to get one of them slightly out, and very obvious if it was!

Woke on Tuesday feeling grotty and tested positive for Covid, so I've spent the past few days in days bed. Feeling better now but using the time off (I'm too knackered to do anything!) to do some more planning for Larass. First up is the signalling. It is a fairly simple diagram, my only uncertainty is whether there should be anything protecting the platform road from the turntable release? There was no signal/trap protection in the Ballinrobe layout which had a turntable after the platform release albeit the turntable did not form the release, it does feel like there should be something though. I'm assuming the distant has been converted into a fixed signal (not modelled) so has released a lever to spare. All facing point locks on both crossovers are presumed to be economical so moved of the same lever as the points, again this seems to be the case at both Ballinrobe and Loughrea. This means I need seven levers so the small 11 lever box at Loughrea is ideal, the Ballinrobe box was bigger with 14 levers but that just meant more spares. As I've drawings for the Loughrea box the dimensions will be based of that, I am however going to turn the roof around so the ridge runs perpendicular to the track as at Ballinrobe. It just looks better to my eyes and doesn't look as toy-townish.

Hi Northroader and Mayner A while back I waded through all the back issues available in the Irish Lines archive https://newirishlines.org/archive/ Whilst doing so I made a note of the relevant drawings that maybe of some use. My computer crashed near the end when I was getting into the early editions and I had forgotten to revisit them. Whilst searching for the turntable article I realised I had missed a series of drawings of the buildings at Loughrea that includes the engine shed and the small signal cabin, both will get a place at Larass. The engine shed is that standard stone with brick reveals just like the Athboy photos. Coincidentally, it appears I'm not the first to go down the Cahirciveen route in 10.5mm 2mm finescale. There is an article in the March 1996 Irish Lines magazine: https://www.dropbox.com/s/2o1goyh98mmv2nd/Irish Lines - Issue 13 - 1996 March.pdf Does anyone know if Mr O'Sullivan ever built his model?

Ah! very true Northroader and it complete slipped my mind the timescales we were talking about. You make a very good point!

Thanks JHB re-reading my text I realise I may have come across a bit critical, which was not my intent. Since the last post I've done some nosing around t'interweb. Most searches brought me back to this site, which makes you realise what a fantastic resource it is. it seems the MGWR's later lines used the Railway Signalling Company's equipment. However this company didn't come into being until 1885. Prior to that it seems to be McKenzie and Holland signalling equipment that was favoured. Helpfully this fits my time line and an etch of McKenzie and Holland signal arms is available in 2mms scale from Wizard Models.

Hi Mayner, I think the justification for the two road shed will be to handle the expected excursion traffic without the need to travel up to to Sligo and back. I am going to try and keep to the MGWR house style as far as it exists with the excuse the SLNCR funded the intermediate station. As a wider appeal, I'm struggling to find much information on MGWR signalling. Ernie Shepherd's history is quiet on the subject and I can't find any reference in JHB's Achill or Clifden line histories. The Baronial Lines of the MGWR book for covering the Loughrea and Ballinrobe branches refers to the signalling equipment being supplied by the Railway Signalling Company, was this the MGWR standard does anyone know? The turntable etch looks fun! obviously the parts provided are just for the deck support but should be sufficient to allow a suitably detailed model. There a couple of successful builds. I've found some details of the MGWR's turntables in the November 2001 Irish lines: https://www.dropbox.com/s/i5fc04qa6q56fx0/New Irish Lines - Vol. 2 No. 6 - 2001 November.pdf It appears form the article that 50' turntables where relatively common.

Yep, fiddling the books, do a load of "maintenence" and it increases the operational costs. The branch then can shown to be making heavy losses. The other tactic was to change the times of trains so they didn't suit commuters and didn't meet onward connection thus reducing receipts.

Hi Colin, I can't remember who said it, but it is a truism that on a good model you should be able to tell the period and the operating company without any rolling stock present. It is easy to get this wrong, for example in my enthusiasm above I've noted the view of the Cahirciveen shed area stating I was just going to swap the corrugated shed for a stone MGWR one. The problem is that the majority of MGWR termini that had engine facilities had two road sheds. The exception being Ballaghaderreen and Kingscourt. The later looks to house two engines in a long single road shed rather use two roads; so if I want to create an MGWR atmosphere I should use a two road shed. As there is also a lovely drawing of the attractive corrugated station building at Cahirciveen in the Valcencia Harbour book. It is tempting to use that, however the MGWR seems to have been quite generous in bestowing stone station structures onto its branch lines. So an alternative will be needed. This has led me to ponder the buildings. For the small station I am thinking of using SLNCR structures for the station building and goods shed, partly because I've got a part built good shed for Dromahair and there is card kit that can be photo copied down for Florencecourt. For the larger I need to source some MGWR structures. I notice the is an MGWR architectural drawing set available from the IRRS. Does anyone know the contents? It is quite steep at £70 for the set (although does contain 80 drawings). I've sourced some etches for the turntable deck based on a 50' Cowans Sheldon unit as installed at Carstairs in Scotland. It is bit bigger than I wanted but scale turntables are hard to come by in 2mm scale, and far better than the commercial alternative (the smallest I can find at 150mm would be a 75' unit!). I'll need to build this first as without a reliable turntable the whole plan doesn't work. The engine release on the run round loop needs the turntable operational, so definitely not a nice to have!

Your a better man than me Andy, I need software to do it for me!

Hi Andy, I think most track plans suffer from that. It is easy to get a bit optimistic about what can fit with a pen and paper. Cyril Freezer's plans being a case in point! I always flesh my plans out first in planning software such as Anyrail. This allows a lot of quick adjustment. Once I've proven the concept and got the layout roughed out I move over to Templot. Once in Templot it is surprising what can achieved using bespoke geometry to ease curves and create a more sinuous line.

Presumably you are running the daily minimum service stipulated in the enabling act David?

I sometimes think that if you drew a line between any two Irish towns you could find a railway proposal that matched! I know they many were promoted for the greater good of what we would now consider economic stimulus to alleviate extreme poverty but most appeared to based on blind hope alone! Still rich pickings for us models and a fascinating history to investigate.

Hi David, I did consider that route but didn't like the reversal leaving Sligo to get back down the line the quayside, there isn't enough space to get a curve directly from the station onto the branch. I do appreciate exactly that reversing move was used by trains traveling to Clifton on departing Galway station, but always thought that would be something to be avoided! Indeed Stephen! That's tempting and the line has been done in 3mm scale (I think) but I really needed a terminus as the short leg of the L on the plan above ends at a chimney breast. There's no chance of a fiddle yard beyond.

Hi Northroader, Each to their own, what ever works for you. I've always preferred layouts with a backstory as it seems to generate a more credible scene. I do accept that this can be at the expense of the overall scene and effect. There are many dull but worthy layouts alongside wonderful fights of fancy. I also like the research that the grounding in reality brings, I just have to stay alert to letting it become too constraining and then spoiling the overall effect. I couldn't agree more, a cycle holiday to visit the Greenways is on the to do list. Whether this becomes a reality is another question!

Thanks Northroader, once the key visual cues of the RIC Barracks and approach viaduct are removed I am hopeful of a degree of anonymity. So that just leaves where to locate the plan..... It was the SLNCR that drew me into an interest in Irish railways so that line needs to be present along with my other main Irish interest the MGWR. This means the sweet spot stays around Sligo, especially as I can add in the WL&WR with a smattering the the GSWR post take over. Looking around the area on Google Earth I notice a couple of beaches near Sligo on Ballysadare Bay around what is now call Strandhill. A bit of nosing around Wikipedia (so what follows may be of questionable accuracy) it appears the Standhill area was developed in the 1890 to exploit the beachside location. No doubt the presence of Knocknarea hill crowned with Queen Medb's grave added to the attractions. So what would have happened if in a search for a locality to build one of their hotels to generate more traffic the MGWR got there first, in say the mid 1850s? Is it too implausible that the SLNCR, then desperate to increase receipts, also scraped a few coppers from the bottom of the piggy bank to contribute (no doubt another loan from their benefactor and main investor Mr Morrison, gallantly trying to get a return on his money). The period maps show no real villages of any note (but then when has that stopped Irish Railway promotors?) so I've chosen a 6 mile route that skirts around Knocknarea with a couple of intermediate stations and a junction onto the Sligo station approach mainline at Magheraboy. The name Strandhill doesn't really work for me, fortunately there appears to be an earlier name of Larass (An Leathros) which suites better. The first intermediate station heading from the terminus back to Sligo will be named after the local beach at Culleenamore. This station will also help generate traffic as a regular horse race was held on the beach from the 1850s (Wikipedia again so could be complete nonsense....). The area is also noted for its oyster beds which will give another traffic flow. Once the quay side is built there will be some trade in fish to. Dublin excursion traffic can reach directly with a reversal at Sligo, ordinary services would connect to the local branch train. The SLNCR can provide a through service to Enniskillen reversing at Sligo with the possibility of through GNR coaches from Derry and Belfast. I'm not planning to use any of the local geography or buildings apart from maybe Knocknarea on the backscene, the sea and quayside at Larass/Strandhill will be on the wrong side for a start! The above narrative is meant as a backstory to generate traffic and root into the train services of the area. The company ownership will define the infrastructure I just need to select and find appropriate buildings and plans. I may leave the carriage shed as is though as I can see a lightly doctored Peco kit for that. I can already visualise the engine shed area with an MGWR stone built shed and fortress water tower and coal stage.

Indeed and also well represented in Mr Rice's writings. The timber bridge on my airship base layout is based on the one on on the Kirkcudbright branch. Plenty of inspiration there!

Hi West Cork, Courtmacsherry is another iconic location, those photos of Sunday excursions shortly before closure with new shiny silver (not for long!) C classes hauling decrepit six wheeled carriage stock are what made me start my C class model. Again though, is it too iconic and recognisable to be moved elsewhere? I like the Cahirciveen plan because it is "busy" without being over complex.

Hi David, that is exactly the plan I was referring to earlier in the post above. I was contemplating it as drawn with the addition of the obligatory turntable for Irish operation. I realised whilst it fulfilled the scenic potential operationally there was a lot of "dead" layout. The extension through the the quays would only be used for occasional shunts meaning half the layout would used intermittently in operation with most trains coming on and going off scene without the benefit of the longer run. One of the things I like about 2mm scale is being able to give a sense of journey. shunting layouts and small terminus to fiddle yard layouts I feel are better suited to larger scales (as I've found to my cost).

Hi Ken, Funnily enough Newport was on the list originally, some of the scenes in JHB's Rails to Achill are very inspiring. I really want to avoid modelling a real location to slavishly, rather use it as a basis for overlaying the scene I want to model. My worry with Newport is that it would too identifiable and so look odd if not modelled accurately, that said I probably have the same issue using Cahirciveen!

No...I'm not planning on leaving...... apologies for the long ramble, I do get to the point eventually! I've been struggling a bit with motivation of late and even with a few days off on leave last week couldn't quite bring myself to sit down at the workbench, a fact that lead to a certain amount of introspection. Taking stock of what modelling I've got on the go at present: I've a 2mm finescale Callander and Oban (Scottish West Coast) based module, part of a long term plan, underway in the garage. This has stalled awaiting some building work to make said garage watertight and a more pleasant environment, the leak has already destroyed two layouts, I'm not letting it get a third! I've a semi-completed 2mm finescale "cameo layout" based on a WW1 Airship base that was built for the MRJ Cameo layout competition. This sits in the room that I use as my home office, library (it sits on top of the bookcase) and modelling room. Although this has been exhibited a couple of times it has several shortfalls. The original plan was drawn up for a 6'6" scenic section with a 1'6" fiddle yard. This was shortened to comply with the rules of the competition to 5' scenic section and 1' fiddle yard. Being lazy, to create the shortened layout I compressed the Templot plan by increasing the sharpness crossing angle on the points and reducing the run in from the fiddle yard over the stream. I also reduced the length of the loops to suit the shortened fiddle yard. Unfortunately the knock on effect of simply increasing the crossing angle created some unduly tight curves (I now have a better understanding of how Templot works and could have avoid this with some simple adjustments, this is user error rather than a criticism of the software). As a result anything longer then a short wheelbase wagon is derailed by the coupler loop on the DG couplings. The length of the fiddle yard severely restricts train lengths so I find the layout a bit unexciting to operate (combined with derailing issue due to the tight radii), I also made the mistake of using a MDF base, which has misshapen slightly with the application of water for ballasting while minor, given the small tolerances of 2mm finescale, does produce a bit of annoying roller coaster effect. The result is I seldom operate the layout, and frequently come away frustrated when I do. I also have my Dromahair module document elsewhere in the forum. This was started for another competition entry and generated my move into modelling Irish Railways (not a cause for regret!). I am struggling with enthusiasm to work on the module, being only 600mm long it is really being built for a one off show with limited operating potential. I am also conscious of shortfalls trying to model a real location without access to plans or a site visit to accurately capture dimensions. My recent ponderings have concluded I need to replace the airbase layout and direct ditch the Dromahair module as it is not really fulfilling any modelling goal, but with what? I've already got my long term dream Scottish based layout underway albeit stalled awaiting garage repairs so something Irish would fit the bill. The Sligo proposal detailed in this topic would need a substantial amount of stock to be viable, this will take a long time to construct so I need to start with a more bucolic branch line so I can slowly build up stock, however, whilst we're a bit spoilt for choice, none of the MGWR termini really lit any fires. That was until a recent post by David Holman reminded me of an Iain Rice plan based on Westport Quay. So out came the measuring the tape and a few ideas were sketched up. During the process I became aware of a couple of photos that have offered up some inspiration. The first was of Bantry station posted recently elsewhere on this forum (apologies, I can't find the topic to link to) The second was the view of Cahirciveen in The Farrenfore to Valencia Harbour Railway Vol 1 (P118) This particular photo is snipped form this online article: https://docplayer.net/122870130-Chapter-15-archaeology-architectural-and-cultural-heritage.html I like the juxtaposition of the harbour, the railway and the town and whilst examining the track plan at Cahirciveen it occurred to me that with some compression it could be converted into a terminus and if a turntable release was used at the end of the run-round loop could be squeezed in to the sort side of "L" shape I have available. This would allow a bit of a longer run in and also permit another small station to be modelled, this avoiding the "shuffle on - run around - shuffle off" on most terminus to fiddle yard layouts. I was a bit worried about the turntable release at first but was then reassured when I found this arrangement at Edenderry: and Athboy: (all track plans above are lifted from the Government of Ireland's Historic Environment Viewer 25" to the mile historic maps) Both are MGWR termini. I've developed some thinking about where this mythical branch line would be located and some history but will follow up with that in another post. Any thoughts so far? Is nicking a GSWR through station a step too far for an MGWR/SLNCR terminus ?

So I blew the considerable layer of gathered dust off the workbench this afternoon. My main task was to mount a small square of stainless steel on my lathe base to enable me to use a magnetic dial gauge holder, but as I had the lathe out I took the opportunity to turn some brass rod to form the C Class fan. After attacking it with a piercing saw and files I had something resembling the real thing, I feel I could do better but as the fan is virtually invisible behind the grill it probably wouldn't be worth the effort to remake. The fan itself is only 4.5mm in diameter so I'm taking David's advice not to sneeze........

I used the terracotta colour in the photo above because the local art store was having a closing down sale and that was all they had discounted. Yorkshire/Scottish genetics have a lot to answer for!

I've used air-dry clay on a cobbled goods area for a 7mm project. DAS is not the only show in town there are similar un-branded products around that can be found cheaper, most art supply stores carry them. It's not really relevant unless you've a large area to do as the saving is only a few quid. What I found works was (none of this is approach is unique to me): - Spread a layer of undiluted PVA onto the the surface to be covered by the clay - Break off a small blob of clay roll into a ballish shape (1-2cms in diameter) and push into the surface and flatten out. - add the next ball so it overlaps with the previously laid one and blend in. - use a drop of water (but only a drop!)to assist if the clay is getting a bit tough to blend. - Keep the layers thin - don't worry if you get a bit of cracking/crazing in the drying process, it looks disastrous but applying anther drop of water will enable you to blend out the cracks. You've then the fun of creating the surface texture. I hand scribbed mine which was tedious at first but quickly became quite therapeutic if done in small bouts. Hope that helps

I've finally got the roof on the C Class at the third attempt. For the first attempt I used superglue to attach the brass panel. This set too quickly and well before I could get the panel accurately positioned, so the panel was prised off and the residual glue sanded back and cleaned up. For the second attempt I used some 5 minute epoxy, this gave me chance to clamp the panel down, but try as I might I couldn't get the ends to sit flush. So once the glue was set the panel was prised off again, the glue sanded off and cleaned up again. After a bit of pondering I realised the problem was that plastic print was domed front to back and so raising the end of the brass roof panel at either end (I was trying to bend the panel along the length of the arch, no chance!). Whether this was a fault with the print or as a result of my sanding when I removed the roof detail I don't know, anyway, a few minute filing with a straight file result in a flat roof which the brass panel sat neatly on. With the roof on I've added the exhausts which are simply brass tube cut to size. I did use the lathe to drill out the centre of the tube to thin down the walls a bit more first. For the fan vent I turned down the outside of the tube a few thou to create the rim then soldered on some fine mesh. I still need to make and add the centre dome and fan to finish it. I've also got the buffers fitted. I always find that a transformational step in any build, the loco face suddenly appears. The front footplates and coupling stiffener are now fitted to one end, they still need a bit of tiding up though.