mfjoc

Almost another year has gone by since my last post. We finished doing up the new house in June but it took another few months to clear out all the “stuff” that was stored in the railway room. I finally got possession in September, installed lighting and sockets and then got started on the benchwork. This is a rough sketch of the track plan. After a lot of thought I had a pretty clear idea of what I wanted to achieve. The new layout is similar operationally to the old layout but in twice the space. The available space is approximately 15’ X 11’. The baseboard is built around the walls with a peninsula up the middle. There is a lift out section in front of the door. Trains will leave north staging (Dublin) and arrive first at the junction (Ross Junction) where there is a trailing connection to the branch terminus (Drinagh). The junction has two through platforms and a bay platform with run around for the branch passenger. There will also be a siding for sundries, cement and fertilizer. I also hope to fit in a siding or two in for a bulk cement silo. Drinagh will have a siding for sundries, cement and fertilizer and a private set of sidings with runaround for dolomite, magnesite and oil. In the future I will probably operate this with a private owner shunting loco. The position of the magnesite plant( in practice a Walthers grain silo), is designed to distract from where the main line comes out from behind the backscene. Heading south the main line leaves the junction and goes into a tunnel and around a curve. Emerging from the tunnel there is a trailing connection to a dolomite ore quarry cut into the hillside with two sidings. The line then crosses over a wide slow flowing river and around a curve into the yard of the main terminus station (Belview standing in for Waterford). From here to the main passenger station the line is double track with a crossover halfway along. On the up side is a three track container or marshalling yard with a headshunt and a short siding for palletized traffic. On the down side is an oil siding and connection to the two track loco shed and turntable. Also on the up side the line to Belview quay branches off curving around to go under a bridge and into south staging. At the passenger station the main arrival and departure tracks go through the backscene to the far corner. And will be long enough for full length passenger trains. A bay platform is for shorter trains and also doubles up as a continuous run. There will be nine tracks in the staging yard, three for south staging, four for north staging and two tracks in the middle that can be used for either. As these tracks form a reversing loop they will be isolated for reversal of polarity. There will also be a programming track in the yard. The main baseboard is all one level apart from one short dipped section for the bridge. The main track baseboard is 12mm ply. Baseboard height is 1400mm and the 2 x 2 supports finish 300 mm above this to which 300mm x 6mm MDF is fixed for the backscene. Much of the plywood and 2 x 1 PAO has been recycled from the old layout. Baseboard construction is now almost complete and I am now starting on tracklaying.

RIP Paddy Very sad news. Its an understatement to say has left the Irish railway modelling community an enormus legacy. I was modelling american HO because of the quality of UK and "irish" outline models available at the time. Then Paddy brought out the 141/181s and the rest is history. Condolences to his family.

@Mayner You didn't mention that the GNR AEC railcars were almost identical to the CIE ones and some of these were painted in UTA and NIR liveries. Also many of the park royals were wired to run as intermediate coaches, The main missing coach would be a 26xx buffet car which ran on most railcar or loco hauled services from the 50's to the 80's but I'd say there's very little chance of one of them being produced. On balance I think you are right about the more popular appeal of the 80 Class over the AEC railcars as a lot more people are still around who remember them. I still think a C class or a GSV or both would outsell an 80 class. All of Murphy Models effort seems to be concentrated on the DART+ at the moment so it would be interesting if IRM were to leapfrog them and produce their own range which would have the advantage of crossover with the much larger UK market.

It's good to hear that IRM are not going to give up on the Irish market. Yes prices have gone up but I don't see that as the most important issue. I really don't want to be negative and am possibly straying into the area of business decision making but I think IRM may have chosen to produce models of the wrong prototypes and that this could be a factor in the current fall off in sales. The Hunslets are very nice but only three were built, they didn't last long and as far as I know never went south or west of Dublin, but at least there are matching coaches and wagons for them to haul. The 800's never left the Cork line (maybe one got to Limerick once?) were out of service by the early fifties apart from hauling a few Bullied open wagons around Thurles. There's nothing else RTR available that they ever hauled, certainly no matching coaches. The ICR's are iconic, if you want to model the current tramway that is Iarnrod Eireann they're perfect. All three are beautiful models and are for sale at very reasonable prices, so if you want a model to leave in the box, put on a shelf or run occasionally on a layout they are perfect. I do hope they sell well, but is an individual likely to buy more than one or two unless they are a collector? The A Class sold out very quickly and I would imagine thay very few customers bought only one. It looks like all the wagon and coaching stock produced so far have sold well, apart from the magnesite wagons which had to be heavily discounted to shift. Obviously an individual will buy more than one coach or wagon and the discount for multiple purchases is an incentive. On a more positive note the following are prototypes that I think would sell in multiple quantities that would provide a return on investment. The C class were long lived, went everywhere, were owned by both CIE and NIR and there's lots of matching rolling stock for all eras. AEC railcars were owned by CIE, GNR, UTA,and NIR and lasted from the fifties to the eighties (as push-pulls). The Park Royals can be used as intermediates. After 1972 no train of laminates, park royals or cravens would be complete without a GSV. A re-run of the A Class might also be considered. I am keeping my fingers crossed.

Further to Fran's post with regard to the production of new Irish models going forward I completly see where he is coming from. I am in a similar situation to Georgeconna in that my shelves are full with multiple copies of almost everything that has come out so far form both IRM and Saint Patrick. I do hope to get the new layout operational in the next few months and actually use them for the purpose for which they were intended. I never in my wildest dreams though that I would be able to aquire the collection of such beautiful models that I have. I am pretty sure I am probably your typical customer. In my sixties, empty nester either retired or close to retirement, with some spare cash to spend on a hobby. I was given a train set as a kid and grew up travelling on a railway that ran an enormous variety of rolling stock. BUT Even I am close to saturation point. I still have the Park Royals, Hunslet and Palvans to come but I will be taking a pass on the ICRs, Dart and 800's. I'd love a few C classes, Mk3's and GSV's and I do think that these would be financially viable. So I live in hope but perfectly understand if they don't appear anytime soon or at all. I am so happy with what I have. The other thing to consider is that our generation is dying off and a large quantity of high quality boxed second hand models are likely to become available over the next few years. It is hard to see where new customers are going to come from as none of my kids generation have any interest in model trains. I am working on the next generation through Thomas the Tank Engine and my own layout which might give some hope for the future.

Bear in mind that by 1973 the transplant program was almost if not fully complete and A and C class reliability had gone through the roof. One of the main reasons for so many pilot workings was to cover for A and C class breakdowns.

I have great memories of north wall transfer freights heading up the bank passing the then IRRS premises in Dromcondra in the early 70's. On Wednesday Library nights you knew by sound if a 101 class was either in the lead or banking. The sound of the Sulzer engine working hard was so different to anything else running at the time. Also I heard them more than saw them as there were no windows looking out on the track. If you wanted to look out you had to open the emergency exit. So yes I am well into my sixties!

Sorry Fran I feel exactly the same. I have ordered one Hunslet with sound but I can't justify either an 800 class or ICR as I want my models to operate on my 1980's layout, not sit on a shelf. I too will order at least four C class locos when they eventually appear.

Could it have been a special train to the Irish college in Ring? The bogie van would have been used for carrying bicycles? The genset in the 3200 van would have supplied power for train lighting. I travelled on a similar type but longer Irish College special from Westland Row to Galway in the summer of 1972 and my bicycle travelled with me on the same train in a bogie van.

Wow This is a new one on me. Never heard this before. Were they used anywhere else? You would need a decent sized genset to heat a carriage. I always thought that the first electrically heated coaches were the mk2s, apart from the Laminates fitted with storage heaters for the Loughrea branch. In the 1970's the bogie steam heating vans, the 3200 brake standards and the push pull railcar conversions were all fitted with either a lister or italian genset but only for trainlighting. Heating was always by steam from oil fired boilers. The Italian ones fitted to the push pulls had a tendency to self combust and extensive fire proofing was added in the 80's just to keep a few sets running. Also in the 1980s there was a discussion about converting the Cravens to electric heating but it didn't proceed.

If my memory serves me right in the 1980's, the standard CIE cast iron chair had 4 holes but was usually only held in place with two bolts, one either side of the rail. Sleepers used to rot where the bolt went through the sleeper and at the triangular nut underneath. The linesman would see the loose chair and could drill the sleeper through one of the spare holes, insert a new bolt and nut underneath the sleeper and resecure the chair to the sleeper.

Wow! I worked there in the 1980's and it brought it all back.

Speaking to Fran yesterday in Wexford he did hint that both a break van and a mk1 GSV were in the pipeline but neither were imminent.

When did they start painting them brown? I think that I remember a lot of gray wagons still around the the 1970's

Planning for the new layout has been based on the following seven principles espoused by an American track planner called Bill Beranek. Walk Along Mainlines Narrow Shelves Long Mainline or Branch-line Runs Trains Traveling Through Scenes Once View Blocking Peninsulas Staging Yards (both hidden & open) Prototypical Operations It’s worth watching him on YouTube, you will learn a lot. On this layout the emphasis will be on operations more than scenery but I do hope to gradually add scenery over time. The basic shape of the new layout will be around the walls with a peninsula up the middle, similar to the old layout but in a space twice the size. This gives five straight sections for stations or scenes. The new layout would have space for a helix or a turnaround at the end of the peninsula if I want to incorporate one. I didn’t have the space for this on the last layout. My first idea was to put a helix at end of peninsula to get the track down to staging around the walls under layout. It would even have been possible to both go up and down with the helix and add a complete upper deck to the layout and making it double the size. Advantages All five sections can be used as senic areas, maximum possible mainline run, trains can be reversed when staged, very easy to add extra staging tracks, possible to build a double deck layout. Disadvantages Complicated benchwork, lot of hidden trackwork , time taken to travel up and down the helix during operating sessions. I decided early on that a double deck layout is not for me as neither deck is at the optimum height and that the disadvantages of the helix outweigh the advantages. My next thought was no helix but putting staging around the outside of the layout behind a view block backscene. Advantages Almost as much senic area and mainline run as option 1 Easy to incorporate a junction with a branch through the backscene Disadvantages Access to staging, viewing stock in staging, height of backscene, no reverse without shunting in staging. Again I think the disadvantages outweigh the advantages so the next option would be to use one of the straight areas as double ended open staging Advantages Simple benchwork, easy access to staging Disadvantages Shorter mainline, no reverse loop, tight radius on turnaround at end of peninsula, difficult to incorporate a branch line. This is closer to what I would like but my next idea was to do away with the turnaround at the end of the peninsula and put open staging on one side of the peninsula with the branch terminus on the other side. The main line would run out of staging go around the room and back into staging Advantages Simple benchwork, easy access to staging, possible to interconnect north and south staging and run trains in one direction around the layout, possible to have a triangular junction, branch line included, possible to have a continuous run. Disadvantages Shorter mainline, only four scenic areas This is actually very similar to the concept of the old layout. It is the way I plan to proceed and am working on a track plan, so more to follow.

Photography was never my strongpoint. Even now I am terrible at composing a subject. At the time I had a cheap AGFA camera and took awful photographs in black and white which I developed myself. I much preferred to wander around, observe and store memories. The photos in the IIRS archive or in Rails in Kerry are way better that any I took. But on the subject of memories there was plenty of time to wander around and no restrictions on going anywhere. The loco was a 141 class, and after we arrived in Fenit the driver uncoupled from the train and drove it up the line and parked it in the cutting outside the station. He left it idling there unoccupied all afternoon. There was a very sad end to the day in that on the way back to Cork that evening the train crashed into a vanload of travellers at an accomidation crossing and several were killed.

I was on that tour in 1972 and if I remember rightly the turntable was still working. I also visited the branch a year or two later on a local when the Cork- Tralee train was extended to Fenit on summer Sundays.

Its hard to believe that its over a year since my last post. What a year it has been. I got the layout to the stage where all the track was laid and fully operational. I did spent a lot of time running trains for the grandkids and am hopeful the the hobby might not be lost on future generations. I had a dress rehersal for a full operating session and then life intervened. The two of us were rattling around a large house that was impossible to heat, using perhaps a third of the living space so we made the momentus decision to downsize and sell the house after 32 happy years there. I had to dismantle the railway, pack it all up and put it into storage in my daughters attic. We were very lucky, we got a good price for the house and found another close by that meets our needs, a key one being space in the garden for a timber room for my model railway version 2.1. The selling and buying took six months and then after moving in in December we made the decision to completly refurbish the new house and so are currently homeless but actually are lucky to be able to stay in any of our three kids houses, the one condition being that we help look after the grandkids. While I haven't posted very often this site has been a constant in my life keeping me in touch with the hobby over the last year. I really appreciate what everyone contributes and IRM for running an add free service. I have a great team of Romanians working on the house but have assumed for myself the role of clients representative, resident engineer , assistant plumber, assistant electrian, assistant dogsbody. The result being no time for modelling. We hope to move back in around Easter. Below is a picture of the timber room that I was allowed purchase. Its nominally 16 x 12 in old money, about 15'8" a 11'8" internally, fuly lined and insulated. It is currently being used for storing our furniture so I hope to have vacent possession in a couple of months. I am currently designing version 2.1 of the layout so more to follow.

I think if you were to analyse the market, the vast majority of your customers are aged from 50 to 80 who are able to remember what a railway looked like. Loco hauled passenger and freight trains have now almost dissappeared, track has been rationalised and we are left with silver green tubes which transport a lot more passengers a lot more efficiently but don't generate any interest from the younger demographic. The only model train that kids are exposed to nowadays is Thomas the tank engine. I am smack in the middle of the above age bracket and growing up was able to observe much of what was still a victorian steam railway albeit with diesel locos and 1950's and 1960's rolling stock. I worked in CIE during the 1980's so have chosen this era to model. I am extremly grateful to both Paddy Murphy and IRM for producing incredible scale models at very reasonable prices. I have bought full price examples of almost all the models that been produced so far that could have run somewhere in Ireland in the 1980's plus or minus a decade. The magnasite wagons seem to have been a commercial disaster which is a real pity as they are such beautiful models. I will buy Park Royals, H vans GSVs, C Class, Jeeps, 20 ton Brake vans etc etc as soon as these are produced. I am sorry to say that the ICRs just don't row my boat which why I didn't order any.

Be careful what you wish for as your wallet may not be able to stand the pressure. Chatting to Fran at Wexford he hinted that both a break van and a GSV were needed to go with all the wagons and coaches they were producing. He also mentioned that not one but two loco announcements would be made this year.

My priority wish list if anybody from IRM reads this: GSVs to go with the Cravens and Park Royals, BR vans perferably but would accept an unrebuilt DEW van as an alternative Either a 20 ton or 30 ton brake van to go with all the Bulleid stock now on order. A re-engined C class The footbridge that we were already promised My origonal intention was to only buy what ran in the 1980's but the recent offerings have reset this to 1970's and 1980's I know I will probably buy whatever is produced but the layout is filling up. 10 years ago I did not think I could ever be in this situation

Really interesting video. It brough back many memories as I travelled on that RPSI tour behind 186 in 1972. The dedication that this group of people have shown over the last 40 years really is amazing. It also shows just how powerful the farming/ landowner lobby is and how negligent CIE have been in preserving the right of way for the state. I am probably in the minority here but I am a great beliver in the economic and social benifits of greenways. I see no justification for rebuilding the line to Foynes. Ireland is just too small for rail freight other that a few specific freight flows which are completly dependent on the location of a small number of factories. At the moment we have concentrates in containers from Ballina to Waterford, timber from Mayo to Waterford, Botox from Castlebar? Tara Mines? CIE had a network of container gantries all over the Island but transhipment costs killed the market. Why are we fixated in investing in a form of transport that is 200 years old. Why not think outside the box? At the moment most freight in an out of Ireland travels to and from Europe in standard articulated trailers which are rolled on and off ferries by special tractors. A road tractor delivers the trailers to and from the port. They are currely building a huge number of storage bays in Rosslare for holding the trailers before pickup or after drop off. Why not move the ports inland? My sugestion would be dedicated carriagways for transporting standard articulated trailers from ports to an inland hubs. Instead of diesel trucks the tractors would be unmanned electrical vehicles, powered by low voltage electricity (not batteries) similar to luas trams. The trailers could be transferred direct from the boat to the system. The carriageway could be single width with passing places to minimise construction costs. The whole lot would be controlled by AI to maximise efficiency and reduce energy consumption. While it would not be quite as efficient as steel on steel for that part of the journey, the benifits of a single mode of transport from factory to port and vise versa would far outweigh the extra energy costs which would still be green electricity so no additional carbon. Perhaps the line from Rosslare to Waterford could be converted to trial out the system? There is no reason why the network could not be extended to include city suburb to city suburb carriagways.

Latest update! I bought the 12mm plywood and 2 x 1 softwood in B&Q in Liffey Valley about 10 or more years ago. At the time their standard plywood was very good quality and they would also cut it accurately for customers. Their 2x1 softwood was straight with very few knots or other defects. I screwed 400mm high hardboard directly to the wall for the backscene. The upper part of this will be covered in a cloudy sky wallpaper but I am not yet sure what I will use for the lower part. I have never got this far on a layout before so scenery is going to be something new to me. The track is now laid. For the scenic part of the layout I first laid out the points and track roughly until I had the track layout finalised. I drew a centre line on the plywood and glued Midwest Products cork trackbed down using a spray adhesive. I then screwed the track to the cork using 5mm x 1.2mm screws that I sourced on line. This means that if I change anything in the short term all the track will be recoverable. I will only consider ballasting the track when I am 100% happy with the track layout and operations. In both staging yards I laid the track on two layers of a rubber packing material. Control is a Roco Multimaus DCC master and slave controller. A ring main of 2 x 1.5² solid wire runs under the whole layout. Droppers are soldered to spade connectors and up through the plywood to the rails. The spade connectors are then inserted into crimp connectors clamped to the 1.5² wire. I tested all the trackwork as I went along with my Kato GP35 which runs jewel like. Ferrybank Yard On the left is the carriage siding, double track main line in the middle, three track yard with headshunt and pallet unloading siding on the right, and oil siding in the corner. Peninsula. Showing the four track north staging yard (Dublin). The kickback siding is electrically isolated so I can use it as a programming track. Junction The main line comes around the corner through the tunnel which will be replaced by a hill and a dolomite quarry in that corner of the layout. There will be up, down and bay platforms, the bay has a run around track. I plan to put a cement silo close to where 142 is in the photograph. The track on the front right may possibly be extended over a disused turntable to a loco shed. Junction and branch The main line curves around passing a beet siding and through the backscene into North staging. The branch line also curves around passing what will be the magnesite factory into the branch station. I have a Walthers ADM grain silo kit which I will install in this area mainly as a view blocker to hide both the tight radius curve on the branch and also the main line exiting to staging. South Staging This is a four track yard behind the backsene shown in the previous photo. The double track main line comes from Ferrybank over the lift out section and into the yard. On the left is the continuous run connection, The centre track has a run around and the right hand track has a kickback siding behind the door. The lifting flap was designed so that it can be installed with the door either open or closed. Main line For the main line between the two stations I lowered the baseboard so I could install a bridge. The next stage is to unbox all my Murphy Models and IRM stock accumulated over the years, fit chips to all ten Irish locomotives, and start to play trains. I am in the process of drawing up a timetable based on the traffic flows that would have been standard back in the 1980’s when I worked in CIE. Typical passenger operations envisaged are: 3 x Dublin Waterford return trains per day – 2 sets will be needed – Mk 2 or Mk 3 or Craven / park royal gen van 3 or 4 x Wexford – Junction return – 1 or 2 may be extended to Waterford 1 set needed craven park royal gen van 1 x Friday only Down train and 1 x Sunday evening or Monday morning only up train Craven Park royal gen van 1 x NIR special – Mk 2Bs Freight Flows Up and Down Scheduled liners – sundries / containers Dublin Junction Ferrybank Waterford Fertiliser paths Dublin Junction Ferrybank Waterford Cement path Dublin Junction Oil/ magnesite train Waterford - Ferrybank - Drinagh Dolomite train Junction - Drinagh Beet pick up Drinagh Junction - Waterford- South Staging Through Trains - Dublin direction to Waterford direction Tara ore Lisheen ore (Dicky Taras’) Up and down ballast Up and down Gypsum Other freight flows will depend on models that become available in the future Traffic generators at each location: Ferrybank: Oil siding Fertilizer or pallet cement siding Container and marshalling yard Junction: Dolomite quarry sidings Pallet unloading siding with cement silo Old goods siding with shed and bank 1 spare siding (possibly Beet?) Drinagh Magnesite factory sidings for oil dolomite and magnesite Goods siding for beet loading

I suspect I know where this rumour came from. Due to a work connection I became friendly with someone who worked in engineering for a company in that area. His family home was built on the trackbed of the old Tullow branch. When he heard I was interested in trains he brought me home to show me the "Loco" that he had built in his garden. It's very hard to describe but it was basically a full size "locomotive" built out of scrap parts that he was given by his company. He had the whole thing set up as an outdoor kitchen and barbeque. It wasn't based on any prototype and owed a lot to his imagination but it looked great and was a real showpiece and talking point.

These carriages really look amazing. I received mine on Tuesday and I immediately set up a test train with my first chipped loco Murphy Models 142. Everything worked fine until I put the driving trailer coach on the track and I then immediately got a short. If I take the carriage off the short goes away. all the other carriages are fine and look really well with the lights on. The instructions say a decoder may be fitted to control the directional lighting. I am already in communication with IRM and they say that if the blanking plug is removed, the directional lighting will be disabled but the interior lighting will still work. Has anyone else tried to use them on a layout with DCC control and got the same problem?