DC wiring

[Chevron]

I know most if not all of you have moved to DCC, so you must of started off with DC first.

 

How many locos have you had running on your layout?

Did you have a separately wired shunting area off your main running line?

Did you have multiple tracks ?

[Hunslet 102]

My layout is still DC controlled,with 2 controllers that allows 4 individual loco's to be controlled individually at any one time.

 

With simple wiring of the 2 main running lines,the goods yard and the carriage sidings and careful isolation of certain track sections,like in the main station,it is possible to get good prototypical running.

 

I have a double track main line,a goods yard,a main line station with carriage sidings and hidden sidings to represent the rest of the network,all in an area no longer than 12ft.The layout can be viewed in the layout section thread under GVS and Adelaide.

[Chevron]

Thanks huntslet . checking it out now.

[Mayner]

I have an end to end layout with a station with a small yard and loco depot.

 

Two locos can run at a time one on the main line the other in the yard.

 

Two hand end controllers (one Gaugemaster one home made) one to control the main line, the other to control the yard and loco depot.

 

Blue Point Switch Machines http://www.micromark.com/blue-point-switch-machine-turnout-controller-10-pack,8537.html to control points. I use the Blue Point toggle switch rather than section switches to switch control from the yard to the main line controller. This allows trains to run from the main line to or from the yard on the one controller.

 

The loco yard is divided into sections controlled by toggle switches mounted on the layout fascia, this allows a loco to be parked in the engine shed or the turntable track while the yard controller is in use.

[Noel]

I know most if not all of you have moved to DCC, so you must of started off with DC first.

 

How many locos have you had running on your layout?

Did you have a separately wired shunting area off your main running line?

Did you have multiple tracks ?

 

Each layout continuous loop is split into 4 switchable block sections with a split in the middle of stations so two locos can be isolated on the same track. Most sidings have a switchable isolation block at one end, and engine shed, service roads have isolation blocks ever 12inches. All wired up to a switch panel with switches located over a schematic track diagram.

 

Terminus switch panel

 

Level 1 switch panel (2 x continuous loops)

 

Electric schematic of Level 2 (2 x continuous loops)

Edited April 5, 2015 by Noel

[Alan564017]

Mayner, I;ve never seen the Blue Point Switches before. They look interesting, whats their longevity like, is the throw adjustable?

[patrick]

I have used twin cab control on three layouts over the last twenty odd years. Nothing against DCC, I hope to upgrade at some point but for now I choose to use my limited hobby budget to complete the layout. The photo below from "Modelling The Clinchfield in N Scale" illustrates how it works better than I can describe it.

 

 

My layout is divided into seventeen blocks and designed for walk around control where the operator follows the train as it progresses along the layout. When the SPDT switch is in the right hand position the wireless Aristo Craft controller is engaged, the left engages the theathered walk around hand held unit. The center position is off.

 

 

Two trains can be operated simultaenously as long as they stay out of each others block which is perfectly adequete considering the size and design of the layout and allows for flexibality during operating sesions. When a train leaves a block the operator or acting signal man returns the switch to the center off position.

 

 

Control panel for Glen More showing the SPDT switches at the entrance of the Waterford fiddle yard.There are two control panels, the second is located between Grange and the Cork fiddle yard and controls both of these areas.The Glenmore passing loop is shown in the schematic but the sidings have been ommited.

Edited April 6, 2015 by patrick

[Chevron]

so basiclly we are talking break up the track into isolated blocks. Use on-off-on switchs for each block and controller one would have controll of all up switched track and controller 2 has control of all diwn switchex track?

[Noel]

Just On-off switches on our set up. Only need isolation breaks on one rail side. It means only single wire needed for each block section. For quick conversion to DCC just flick every switch to on and connect DCC in parrallel to former DC controller output pairs (ie after disconnecting DC controller physically or via switches).

[patrick]

so basiclly we are talking break up the track into isolated blocks. Use on-off-on switchs for each block and controller one would have controll of all up switched track and controller 2 has control of all diwn switchex track?

 

Thats it in a nutshell!

[Chevron]

Thats it in a nutshell!

 

Thanks patrick and your hand drawn diagram explains a lot . cheers for that.

[Dhu Varren]

Creating sections of track and using switches to change controllers in those sections, known as cab control, means that by simply switching controllers in sections, a train can travel to any part of a layout using only one controller. The down side of this is that the operator has to remember to set all the appropriate switches before the move, and then set them all back once the movement is complete.

 

Another way of carrying out such a move is to get the points to do the switching for you. A switch is fitted to the point motor, Peco do a switch that fits on to their standard motor which is perfect for the job. Some other makes of point motor come with a switch already built in.

The switch is used to turn on and off a relay, which in turn changes controllers for a given section of track.

 

The following diagram is for ‘Craigellachie’, a layout some of you may have seen at the recent Modelrail exhibition in Glasgow. This layout can have up to four trains running at any one time. One travelling in the Up direction, one in the Down direction, one on the branch line, and one loco shunting in the yard.

 

The real station platform roads were only signalled for one direction running through the station, so a train will always take the left hand road between platforms 1 & 2. The branch platform, platform 3, is bi-directional.

 

The main line is basically split in two. The right hand end is controller by controller 1. The left hand end is controlled by controller 2. Each driver only drives the train on his end of the layout.

 

An Up train, which is using controller 1, will take point D into platform 1. A down train, which is using controller 2, will take points B & C into platform 2. Once both trains are in, and have stopped, point D is thrown. This switches on a relay which changes the feed to platform 2 from controller 2 to controller 1, ready for the right hand end driver to take the Down train to the fiddle yard. Likewise, when point B is thrown, a relay switches on and feeds platform 1 with controller 2 instead of controller 1, ready for the left hand end driver to now take the Up train to the fiddle yard. Once both trains have left, the points are reset, ready for the next trains, which switches off the relays, thus changing the controller feeds back to controller 1 for platform 1, and controller 2 for platform 2.

 

The branch line uses controller 3, so as long as point C is set for the main line, a branch train will arrive in platform 3 on controller 3. If the train is a DMU or a Railbus, and is going back along the branch, nothing needs to happen, and the train can return to the fiddle yard on controller 3. If, however, the train in platform 3 is to continue it’s journey via the main line, when points B & C are set for platform 3, a relay switches on, and changes platform 3 to feed from controller 2 instead of controller 3. The left hand end driver can then drive the train in platform 3 to the fiddle yard via the main line. Likewise, a train travelling in the opposite direction from the main line to the branch line will use controller 2 until it arrives in platform 3, when, once point C is reset for platform 2, platform 3 will then revert to the control of controller 3.

 

The goods yard uses controller 4 within the goods yard. When a Down goods train arrives, or an Up goods train is leaving, setting point A into the goods yard, will, via a relay, change control of the goods yard from controller 4 to controller 2, so the left had end driver has control of the goods yard. If, however, a goods train is arriving from, or leaving for the branch line, when point E is set into the goods yard, the goods yard then comes under the control of controller 3, providing point A is set for the main line. Point A always has priority over point E regarding controller feed to the goods yard.

 

Arrivals and departures in the fiddle yard follow similar routing processes, with roads being fed by power from wherever the points are set to/from. A bit more complicated to try and explain.

 

On the whole layout there is only one manual switch for changing controllers, and that relates to the main line at the left hand end.

The track layout is exactly the same as the real station, but the real station had a fairly sparse train service, so the main line could be used for shunting goods trains. This means there is very little space at the left hand end of the goods yard for shunting. To overcome this in model form, due to the high level of main line traffic, the main line beyond point A to the entrance to the fiddle yard can be switched manually from controller 2 to controller 4, to enable goods yard shunting moves to be carried out. This switch can also be used to enable the loco on branch line loco hauled trains to run round their train via the goods loop, exactly as per the prototype.

 

Hope all this makes sense. I figured ‘Craigellachie’ would be simple enough to explain, rather trying to describe a much bigger layout loosely based on Belfast York Road, which uses the same routing technology, plus fully working, and interlocked, colour light signalling.

 

[Chevron]

Amazing....had to re-read most lines over and over and to compare to the image to figure it all out but wow. That is an impressive example.

 

Due to the in depth nature of this post i assume this is like a Drivers instructions plan for the layout? or something to that nature that you had most already done.

 

If that is the case id love to hear about

a much bigger layout loosely based on Belfast York Road, which uses the same routing technology, plus fully working, and interlocked, colour light signalling.

 

But only if you already have it written As im hoping to do automatic lighting system to show which track a wagon is going down on my hump yard project.

Does it use the 3 light system as in green on top with 2 reds below as default for an all clear ?

do you have any images of the lighting system or layout either electrical or track?

 

I am even more curious now.

Edited April 6, 2015 by Chevron

[Mayner]

Mayner, I;ve never seen the Blue Point Switches before. They look interesting, whats their longevity like, is the throw adjustable?

 

 

 

 

I have used them 3-4 years without any problems, the throw is adjustable the overall design is similar to the Tortoise switch machine without an electric motor.

 

The wiring is similar in principal to that described by DuVaren with the one pole of the Blue Point DPDT rather than a relay used to switch power from the main line to the yard controller.

[Dhu Varren]

 

one pole of the Blue Point DPDT rather than a relay used to switch power from the main line to the yard controller.

 

I have never been keen on common return track power feeds, and for as long as I can remember, have always used double power feeds to each track section. Since the Peco switch is only single pole, and I require at least triple pole switching, a relay has to be used. For improved electrical conductivity that does not rely on the point blades alone, each point frog also has it's polarity changed by the relay. In total, on this layout, each relay requires three SPDT switches. The other layout I mentioned required even more, as signalling is also involved in the switching process.