Mayner

Having read the works of Ian Rice and explored the countryside (light railway remains) of Essex and Suffolk, I was tempted by the Accurascale "Buck" for a OO shelf layout inspired by the Kelvedon & Tollesbury or the "East Suffolk yes I visited Orford about 25 years ago and checked out the station site from Iain's Light Railway book. Then I remembered I have an EM gauge Ivatt 2-6-0, a Dean Goods and a small collection of Industrial steam and diesel locos, so perhaps something from the Welsh Marches instead. I have a stash of EM flexi track, chairs, rail and suitable buildings somewhere, but what to do with several stalled projects. Still mighty tempting!

I admire your ability to keep moving on to new projects and make the best uses of the available time and space. I have a pattern of planning sometime starting then loosing interest/never finishing layouts. Looking forward to seeing your next project, a home for both the GN & SLNCR perhaps

Interesting story from last week about the recovery of a steam loco buried following the construction of a break water (South Mole) at Whangaunui ( city and port in the lower North Island). https://www.rnz.co.nz/news/national/575595/150-year-old-train-found-after-being-buried-on-whanganui-beach-for-75-years The loco believed to be "Skunk" one of a trio of locomotives built by a Wellington foundry in 1873 for use on the "Foxton Section" a line which linked the port of Foxton with the town of Palmerston North in the Wairapa region. Opening as an isolated section the Foxton section was originally laid with wooden rails when opened in 1873 and re-laid with steel rails and re-opened in 1876. A local group appears to be planning to carry out a cosmetic restoration, interestingly the cylinders on the recovered loco appears to drive a lay shaft mounted amid-ship under the boiler similar to a climax rather than the trailing "driving" axle on sister locomotive the restored "Opussum" at Shantytown on the South Island. https://nzrailphotos.co.nz/photos/shantytown?view=latest#lg=1&slide=11 Looks like a good excuse for visiting Whanganui and Shantytown to try and figure out how 'Skunks' transmission actually works!

Very sorry to hear about Davids passing condolences to his family and friends. I got to know David during visits to the Cavan and Leitrim Railway at Dromod during the early 90s, where I was always made welcome usually invited to drive their diesel loco on the main line and have the caric over a few beers and a meal at one of the local pubs. David was a significant figure in the Irish rail scene in the 80s and 90s, publishing an enthusiast newsletter/magazine in the early 80s, becoming deeply involved (a founding figure?) in the preservation movement in the Republic through the GSRPS in establishing a base at Mallow Shed, carriage restoration at Mallow and Tralee and attempts to re-open the Fenit Branch. David apparrently was also involved in returning 5T to Ireland and sourcing stock for use on the Tralee & Blennerville tourist line David later focused on the Irish 3' Gauge, along with Michael Kennedy a founder of the Irish Narrow Gauge Trust.The Trust established a museum in Cahir before moving to Dromod during the early 90s to establish the Cavan & Leitrim heritage railway. David ceased to be actively involved in the Cavan and Leitrim and the preservation movement during the mid-90s

Interesting the swaping of GSR and Commonwealth bogies with 1954-built composites possibly rostered to less demanding (suburban) links. Along with the underframes sold to NIR, I have a sneaking suspicion that CIE may have retained some for PW use (carrying rail) Hoping to use IRM Commonwealth bogies (if they become available) under a pair of Worsley Works Laminates and a Park Royal I built several years ago

Back in the day (late 1950s) the UTA used exhaust gas (heat exchangers) to heat the interiors of its MPD diesel trains. Great in theory but the combination of water vapor and sulphur in the exhaust gases contributed to both problems with the train heating system and engine failure (Patrick Flannigan "Diesel Dawn" Interestingly wheel slip on wet/damp rails is a problem with my Large Scale (1:20.3 ) battery powered locos, usually overcome by repeatedly opening and closing the throttle in a similar manner to full sized (steam/diesel/and electric) locos. These days many railways use computerised wheel slip control to do essentially the same thing! https://shield.kiwirail.co.nz/content/latest/CS4.8 for DX Class Locomotives.pdf

Although Waterford West- Abbey Junction one of Irelands longest/largest railway station and yard, at one stage I considered an Iain Rice "Bitsa-Station" approach to Waterford focusing on the area around the Central Signal Cabin or Abbey Junction for potential portable layouts/modules. I basically looked at modelling the area around the signal cabin and platform ends, with Mount Misary as a backdrop and the road overbridge and the late 1960s era station building/office block as view blockers at each end. Although visually attractive with the signal cabin and station building as signature structures, potentially a good train watching layout if hooked up to a continuous run particularly late 60s to late 90s era with goods/freight trains running through the station between Waterford Yard, the Port/Bellferry. South Wexford and New Ross. Very simple from a track layout perspective 3 through lines 2 Bay Platform lines all pointwork off scene. Abbey Junction modelled from road.filling station side large IAWS? grain elevator as backdrop road road overbridge (North Wharf access road) view block station end, less defined New Ross/South Wexford end possibly CIE Bus Garage or former loco-shed. Working level crossing as a potential feature. More shunting (trains moving to & fro) than continuous running. IAWS elevator shunted from Wharf Cabin off scene, Grain traffic resumed during 1990s, Fuel Oil Traffic to Bus Garage and Container Traffic to Bell Ferry terminal (several daily mid 70s to mid 90s relocation of terminal). Basically need a Sports Hall or Industrial Unit to model the area between the road bridge at the western end of the Station and West Cabin/junction with Ballinacourty/Mallow line in 4mm, but just about dooable in a loft/singe car garage in N. I the end I decided on Kiltimagh in 4mm several years ago, but although I have the space during the past 10 years I just haven't been able to find/make the time.

Informative RM Thread on BR rules related to the use of Brake Van lights. https://www.rmweb.co.uk/forums/topic/144841-brake-van-lamps/ . T Basically on BR. (a) A singe taillamp was used on fully-fitted (braked)trains to indicate that the train was complete. (b) On loose coupled unfitted or semi fitted trains both side lights were used to display a white light going forward and at some stage a requirement for the sidelights to display a red light towards the end of the train (using a red slide in the lamp housing was introduced. I don't know if CIE continued to use the side lights (to indicate to the loco crew that a train was complete) following dieselisation and the switch to driver only operation. There was an early 70s newspaper article (with photos) about an incident where a goods train broke apart while leaving Ballyhaunis on the Mayo Line and the driver arrived in Claremorris unaware of the incident. The Claremorris signalman apparrently asked the driver 'what happened to the rest of your train?" Apparrently the train divided after an axle broke on a wagon, the wagons towards the end of the train piled up on the de-railed wagon as a result of their momentum and the driver apparrently did not notice/feel a thing. Possible the requirement to have illuminated tail/side lights may only have applied during hours of darkness or poor visibility. Before the Cherryville Junction collision a single white taillamp appears to have been considered sufficient to indicate that a train was complete. The twin battery powered flashing taillamps were introduced in response to the collision

Apart from Castlerackrent and possibly Dave Walkers Killaney layouts, I am not aware of other modular Irish outline layouts. Locally the "One Track Minds" group on the South Island built a number of single tracked modular layouts with realistically modelled & distinctive New Zealand scenery, buildings and structures. The "15 Inch Group" featured in a series of articles in Model Railways magazine applied a similar approach to Great Western branchline modelling based on a 15" wide baseboard with a standardised baseboard endprofile, rail and electrical interface, as far as I recall the group exhibited a layout which featured 3 single track country stations Richard Chown working for BR had the advantage of a 100'? covered footbridge as a home for Castlerackrent, before re-locating to the large basement of his purpose built home. Killanney was apparrently intended to connect to Castlerackrent at exhibitions. Castlerackrent featured its origonal self contained branch line terminus layout and several through stations, (based on ex-WLWR prototypes) and a self contained almost cameo port layout https://highlandmiscellany.com/tag/castle-rackrent/. I was luckly enough to see the (orignal) Castlerackrent at a small exhibition near Perth while living in Stirling in 93. Yes I think modular layouts have an advantage for people who do not have the space or time to be involved in the construction and operation of a larger layout. I am almost in the opposition position to Patrick, for several years I have had the space to build my ideal Irish Broad gauge layout, even installing baseboards over 10 years ago!, but not the time (work/family committments). Now in my late 60s with failing eyesight and shaky hands I will probabably need to take a more pragmatic approach if I am ever to get anything running.

Conventional timber framed coaches built 1954 onwards including. CIE began a coach building problem in 1951 initial coaches were on conventional welded steel underframes with GSR pattern bogies, changing to Bulleid Triangulated underframe with Commonwealth Bogies from 1954 onwards, examples of the Side Corridor & Buffet Cars appeared with both types of underframe and bogies, B4 replaced GSR bogies on Buffet Cars during the 60s. (a) Side Corridor Second Class Coaches (b) Buffet Car/Kitchen and Dining Cars (C) TPOs (Travelling Post Office. (C) Bogie Luggage/Brake Vans The Silver Fox CIE 1951-53 Stock are based on coaches with conventional underframes and GSR bogies. Apart from a Bogie Heating Van the Buffet Car is probably the biggest gap in terms of modelling a 70-80s Intercity set made up of conventional coaches

The ore from the Lisheen Mine going by road to Cork seems to have been a tipping point in the Irish Governments approach towards railfreight. The ore was originally proposed to be transported from Lisduff by rail. but IEs funding application (infrastructure & stock?) was rejected by the Government. Government (& EU?) had funded (grants & loansto IE) major freight infrastructure improvements during the 90s, new yards Dundalk & Bellview Port, increasing loading gauge to clear larger ISO containers and high capacity container handling equipment at all major terminals (new gantries, forklifts/reach stackers. A Government report in early 2000s was extremly critical of the profitability of IEs railfreight services and basically lead to the run down and closure of most services. A lot of money wasted, but I suppose a lot was EU funds that had to be spent

There was talk of ore from the Pallas Green ore-body being exported through Foynes or Waterford after the discovery was announced in the early 2000s, but remains un-developed possibly as a result of geological challenges which may effect the viability of developing the mine. In the mean time the expoloration/mining rights have changed hands several times since the initial discovery. I am beginning to believe that the Foynes Branch was refurbished because like the Northern Ireland Renewable Energy Scheme 'cash for ash" money was available to improve access to Foynes Port under the EU TEN-T scheme rather than to fulfill an actual need. Difficult to see Boliden Mining paying to have their ore Tara ore shipped over 150 miles to Foynes & funding a new discharge facility, when they can ship the ore 36 miles by road or approx 50 miles by rail to their existing unloading facility at Dublin Port (assuming Dublin Port restores rail link in 2-3 years time. Back in the day Tara shipped its initial output (severak weeks?) through Foynes (possibly using Mogul wagons) as a result of an industrial dispute involving redundant Goulding workers at Dublin Port. Going back to Galtemores point about the poor state of the roads and viability of rail during the 70s-80s, Gortdrum and Tynagh two of the largest ore bodies developed during the 60s shipped their ore by road possibly because its was not viable to provide infrastructure to ship by rail due to the relatively short life of the mines. Gortdrum a large copper mine located beside the Cork Line at Limerick Junction (just North of the Junction with the Direct Curve) had a working life before closure of 10 years, Tynagh a large Lead and Zinc mine located approx 10 miles east of Loughrea had a working life of approx 20 years shipped its ore by road direct to Galway port although it appears to have receeived supply by rail to Loughrea. Tynagh was estimated to have reserved of 9.2m tonnes with 7.2mt extracted during the life of the mine sending out approx 140,000 tonne of concentrates or 7,000 wagon loads/350 train loads or approx 1 train a week during the life of the mine. (based on 20T 20 wagon ore trains of the era). By comparison Mogul mine (zinc) at Silvermines appears to have had a working live of 14 years and shipped a daily trainload of ore through Foynes port (the Foynes Tippler was apparrently re-used for unloading shale wagons at the Munget Cement factory), Macobar shipped barytes ore from Silvermines to Foynes two trainloads daily for almost 30 years.

I think some of the recent posters are loosing sight of the fact that: 1. Rail is not a practicable option for shipping the ore from Tara mines during the next 2-3 years. 2. The mines closed temporarily in July 2023 because it was uneconomic to continue mining as a result of low ore prices. 3. Ore reserves are expected to be exhausted at some stage between 2029 and 2033. 4. The more direct route by the M5,M50,Dublin Port Tunnel is likely to have undermined any potential economic/environmental advantage of shipping the ore by rail. At the end of the day Boliden is likely to select the lowest cost option for shipping the ore from Tara. IEs Tara Mines freight operation are inefficient compared to the standards of the past 20 odd years! Although the Tara Mines are Ireland's heaviest trains they are light by international standards (Tara 594 Tonnes -12 wagon Kiwirail 1500 Tonnes-25 wagon (coal) Port of Tauranga-Rotowaro (Huntly Power Station) (2-3 daily) since 2004. The discharge operation at Dublin Port is inefficient (involving shunting/uncoupling of indiviudal wagons) compared to similar operations where the entire train is unloaded without the need to shunt/uncouple/re-couple individual wagons. The discharge operation at Dublin Port is constrained by restricted space, no room to install a loop to accomodate longer trains. Existing wagon fleet (owned by Tara Mines?) is largely life expired, could Boliden justify buying a fleet of new wagons for a mine thats projected to close within the next 4-8 years? Tom. I have used the Irish Road system in recent years including the Port Tunnel, M1, M50, N11 at peak times during visits to Ireland in recent years, congestion on the M50 and Dublin approach roads is little different to that I experienced in the UK or Auckland, though driving between the outskirts of the city and Dublin Port is now a picnic to 20 or so years ago before the opening of the Port Tunnel. Before I left Ireland in 2004 I spent several years working on construction projects around the M50, and in the Port and well remember the level of traffic congestion and impact on productivity.

Hi Wheelslip. I just about remember seeing wagons (all vans) at North City Mills as a kid during the late 60s, usually in my fathers car at Cross Guns bridge on our way to visit my Grandfathers (an engine driver) grave at Glasinevin Cemetery. My grandather bought a plot where the Midland passed over the GSWR line so he could whistle to his wife as he drove past on a loco, needless to say I was more interested in the railways than my grandparents. The North City Mills was abandoned and lifted when I explored the area as a teenager in the mid 70s North City Mill would make an excellent model in a compact space with its combination of stone mill buildings, retaining walls canal, bridges and abandoned canal boats. The 1960s era probabably best option for modelling the Mill with RTR locos and stock (IRM Bulleid H Vans, MM B141 & B121 Black and Tan diesels (possibly a grey B121, railtraffic seems to have ceased by the early 70s, possibly some of Leslies Provincial Wagons GN Vans (an "Irish Standard' design) also used by the Midland and GSR some of which lasted into the late 60s. The small B121,B141 GMs potentially a better option than the larger A /Ar Class for shunting the Mill, unfortunately no suitable rtr CIE shunting locos are available, though Silver Fox do a G601-3 Class not strictly correct as CIE used the slightly more modern G613 Class (vaccum brakes and different style of cab windows) as LiffeyJunction Pilot loco at one stage during the 1960s, the Silver Fox G uses a Tenshodo motor bogie which is not great at low speeds needed for a shunting loco. Possibly a Hornby Ruston Diesel or Peckett steam loco based on the scenario of Ranks/North City Mills providing its own shunting loco. The GSR/Steam would be more challenging and would involve an element of modifying rtr models, kit or scratchbuilding depending on how far you want to go or whether you have a greater preference for getting something up and running quickly or model making. In steam days the Mill was likely to have been shunted by MGWR tank locos and their Standard Goods. During GSR/CIE days steam locos appear to have largely stuck to their own territory. A J26 appears to have been the final Liffey Junction shunting/pilot loco until replaced by a G611 during the early 60s The BachmannJ72 and Hornby J83 are probabably the closest RTR British outline models in terms of size and general outline to the ex-MGWR J26 (small tanks) and J10 (Banking) Tank the modifications involve a considerable amount of work!. Eoin (ECM) Inchacore Class J10 conversion (actually looks closer to a J26) covered the conversion of the older Mainline (Palitoy) model gives an indication of the level of cosmetic work involved, but a replacement chassis unlikely to be required in converting the current Bachmann model. The Hornby Railroad J83 looks closer in size and outline to the J10 tanks used for heavy shunting and banking duties in the area. SSM produce an etched kit of the Small Midland Tank MGWR E GSR/CIE J26 but potentially challenging as a first attempted at a brass kit and based on a model of the loco in as-built MGWR condition up toaround 1912. Ironically O Gauge is probabably a better option for attempting a model of North City Mills using kit built locos and stock as Alphagraphix produce relatively straightfoirward to assemble models of the ex-MGWR Standard Goods J19 and Small Tank J26, check out David Holman's & Galtemores threads on building compact O Gauge layouts and kit/scratch building locos and stock including Alphagrapkix kits. At the end of the day the distinctive combination of canal and mill structures at Clonliffe and North City Mills would make quite distinctive models (a distinctive part of Dublins Inductrial heritage) in their own right and the trains less significant in terms of the overall model compared to say a model of a station or goods yard.