jhb171achill

I am trying to sell, on behalf of a friend of mine, some drawings which originated in York Road. They are general outline drawings, but contain much peripheral information such as engine size, modifications, etc. I reckon they would be invaluable to modellers of the UTA / NIR scene 1954-84. They are actually perfect fodder for modelling, including side and end profiles. On most, livery details such as location, size and shape of logos is evident. The drawings are as follows: MED power cars 6 & 7 MED power cars 14, 16, 18, 20 & 22 MPD power cars 63, 64 & 65 70 Class power cars 71-8 Driving Trailers 711 & 712 NIR Railbus RB3 Hunslet Locomotives 101-3 GM Class 110* Locomotives 111-3 (* Contrary to popular descriptions, including within NIR, they originally called them class 110, not class 111!) These are being offered for £4 / €5 each plus postage. Obviously, a buyer who takes the lot will pay a great deal less in postage... I'd have to put them in tubes to post. I'm giving first option to IRM readers because I suspect they are of far greater use, as well as interest, in a forum like this. If there aren't any takers, they will be offered for sale (probably at a slightly higher price) on the RPSI May Tour. The drawings are typically about 12 inches high X 15-20 inches long. PM me if interested.

cg - that's fantastic stuff, looks really well. Small point, in a constructive spirit - GNR goods stock would have body-colour metal strapping etc, ie grey... Don't be fooled by "Ivan" at whitehead! Well done.... and incidentally the LMS a toon you have on the 6 wheeler does indeed look about right.

Perfect, josefstadt, perfect! ;-) The mental image of a spoil train taking a smug self-absorbed John Lennon and a grumpy pair of Gallaghers to throw into Belfast Lough is an, ehh, interesting one! They could use them in the foundations of a wonderwall. ;-)

The colour you have chosen, Leslie, is to my memory as exact as you'll get. I never saw a pristine one myself, but have seen good quality colour pics (somewhere), and my own efforts to rub dirt off the side of one at one time would also bear this out. The "some lot from Liverpool" you mention were called the "Woodlice" or "Insects" or something, and were an Oasis tribute band - for me, a Stones fan, no better at their craft than the grumpy Gallagher brothers......

Ahhhh! OK, Nelson, this isn't a "Brown Van" at all - I misunderstood you. I thought you meant one like the recently restored one at Whitehead, or the trio at the DCDR. Those ones relate to the info I gave you. The above is a standard NCC goods van, which I would guess dates from mid-1920s to mid-1940s build. A van like this would have been all grey (standard LMS wagon grey - sloghtly darker than GNR), if unpiped; all bauxite if piped for attachment to passenger trains. I am unaware of roof colour, unfortunately, but since this is obviously of fundamental importance I will endeavour to find out. I suspect brown too, but I'd prefer to check. Chassis, drawgear, etc would be brown. This one, like most, would have remained as it was under UTA ownership, in all likelihood never being fully repainted, but just with lettering changed by painting a "patch" over the lettered bit, and replacing with UTA markings and numbers. JB

Superb!

Others have commented here on the "duck-egg blue" colour of these yokes. Having had a lifelong interest in liveries, I remember the first time I saw a spoil train "in the flesh", which must have been late '69 or so. The first thing I thought was, "What colour are they? What markings have they?"... As every wagon was so dirty that nothing at all could be discerned.... Dented sides as well, which as pointed out would be some challenge even for the very expert "weatherers" here.... See, I lived on the GNR side. Not this strange land of the NCC, where there were no proper goods trains, no "Enterprise" and thus no diesel locos, and what passed as goods was noisy railcars, no two alike, many of which were converted and even non-corridor steam stock, hauling brown vans or CIE vans to Derry! Quainter than fiction, this latter day 5'3" gauge Donegal-method operation.... Odd; odd indeed. But what wouldn't we give to see such a CDRJC-inspired collection of railcars, trailing wagons, today! Especially with filthy Jeeps rattling along a scenic shoreline with even filthier spoil wagons! And those of us here who have been witness to more than a certain number of birthdays will reminisce; we thought it would last forever.... Just like ICRs today. Hmmm.

Great clean engine.... needs Anthony to weather it.....

I would agree, Snapper; that blue is deeper than the real thing. The wagon is clearly new and the logo may be masked. I would be almost 100% certain they were lime green in service.

Non authentic or not, it looks amazing! I think the grey suits this class.... Didn't someone paint a model 141 in black & silver? I thought that looked well too....

They were certainly lime green when new. I personally never saw or heard of a grey one; might have been a one off, or faded / dirtied in so e way?

Sinn Fein are in the difficult position that they are in government on one side if the border, and therefore must assist in the administration of necessary / imposed spending cuts there, but in the south they can afford to blame Fine Gael for cuts, while advocating their reversal!

Superb job, very realistic!

That eejit deserves to be knocked off his bike, Eoin.... Congrats on your ongoing work on the loco. Mad, as you say!

Oh yes, I remember that now. The wagons had standard NIR maroon painted over the original number, and a strip along where "U T" had been. New NIR lettering was put on them in white. Other than that, the wagons were not repainted at all, and the original "duck-egg blue" is still to be seen under a layer of filth, rust, brake dust and ballast dust.

I'm not sure, Hunslet, I wasn't aware of that. I suspect they were leftovers which had not been altered, providing spoil transport rather than ballast was the main use. Had they been repainted, and if so, what colour? Hardly the light duck-egg blue? NIR tended to paint things light grey at that time. Did they have an NIR logo, or lettering for NIR, and if so in what colour? Must add that one to my ongoing livery database!

It was not substantially rebuilt; in fact, its alterations may all have been internal. I will take a run to Downpatrick some time soon and see what can be discerned. It would be good to lay this one definitively to rest. As fas as the Brown Van frame is concerned, it could not be less like what ran with it. For a start, the chassis would have been all wooden, and secondly, it is not known for certain whether (or when) it was four or six wheeled. That said, a brown van frame in this day and age is probably good enough for the time being. It changes a potentially seriously expensive restoration job, to a moderately affordable one. Using an NCC frame now does not preclude getting a proper frame made in the future.

Those are stunning - very true to life!

Mayner, that's interesting re ownership. You are right in that the N I Government technically owned them, yet they were lettered "U T"!

Correct, Boskonay.... The Hamburg thing looks amazing. And while we all have our opinions on this (above) actual layout, and the concept of "cheque book modelling", I would be the greatest believer in "each to their own". Anyone here who knows me would be aware that I find accuracy in the appearance of model locos and rolling stock to be the most important thing, but others would differ. I know of at least two modellers for whom accuracy of track layout in a model of a specific location is paramount. Others go for an overall "look", or none at all. At the end if the day, it's our layout, and if we want to run a set of hopelessly inaccurately painted De Dietrichs round a model of a German station, hauled by an out-of-scale Donegal 2.6.4T painted in GNR blue, and with a NCC "brown van" attached to the back along with a fertiliser bogie in lined LMS livery, nobody can tell us not to! So, again, hats off to the creator of this huge behemoth of a layout. He has put his heart and soul into something he enjoys, and wants to share it. All of that is good - very good - and if it attracts just one five year old to the hobby, he's done us all a service. It's just not MY thing at all...!

I have to say I commend him for time and effort, but the result doesn't justify it. Even "chequebook" modelling can sometimes look fine, if perhaps occasionally soulless, but I say each to their own; like others though, I just don't like it at all. There are "28 trains" - few if any are visible in the pics, though given the overall effect, they would add little to it. And "28 trains" are a very small number for a layout this size, anyway. It's like a huge Lego toy. However... good luck to him.... If he ever logs into IRM, he will have his eyes well opened.... The standards of modelling on so much seen here, made by members here, both layouts and stock, have to be seen to be believed. The only thing that must have to be seen to be believed on yer man's layout is the hole in his bank account.....

Correct, Hunslet. The most I ever saw together after the spoil contract was 2 or 3 max.

There ye go! Were you on it, Blaine? It's one I unfortunately missed.....

Love it! Here's my party manifesto: "Free Guinness for EVERYONE!" Can I count on your vote?

I just did. And he had my 5c in his pocket......