Steam railcars

[Mol_PMB]

I just noticed this over on RMweb:

Frying Tonight: LNER ‘Chip Vans’ Sentinel Cammell Railcars Join The Heljan 00 Range - Heljan - RMweb

I wonder if we might see a GSR version? They had 4 similar Sentinel railcars, though they weren't identical.

[Mol_PMB]

There's a fairly decent dimensioned diagram of the GSR railcars in the IRRS archive, which I have a scan of. 

They were numbers 354, 355, 356, 357, all built in 1927.

355 and 356 seem to have survived to at least 1942, but had been withdrawn by 1950. The other two went earlier.

They were similar to the contemporary Diagram 88 LNER vehicles, but I think the Heljan model represents a slightly later variant - Diagram 96/97.

Edited yesterday at 10:40 by Mol_PMB
added diagram numbers

[Galteemore]

One of the Sentinels ended its days on the SLNC. A bogie was used as a luggage trailer for Railbus A! 

[Mol_PMB]

There's an IRRS photo of 355 here:

HDF_GSR_355_Limerick_1935 | [Photographer: Harold Fayle] Thi… | Flickr

The book 'Great Southern Railways' (Murray) has a photo of one on page 77; that shows the other side (but the same end)

 

There are strong styling similarities but many detail differences, not least that the GSR cars (and earlier LNER cars) were articulated, while the later ones (as modelled by Heljan) have a one-piece carbody. Nevertheless, the LMS-liveried model with a change of lettering probably wouldn't look out of place on a GSR layout.

[Mol_PMB]

Or there is this:

NIU3002 - LNER (Diagram 89) Sentinel Rail Car - OO Gauge - AVAILABLE AT END OF JANUARY

[Westcorkrailway]

Would these be the same? Colm creedon has photos of them on the Newmarket branch, also has photos of them in use at Albert quay, where they worked some branchline on trials 

[Horsetan]

2 hours ago, Mol_PMB said:

I just noticed this over on RMweb:

Frying Tonight: LNER ‘Chip Vans’ Sentinel Cammell Railcars Join The Heljan 00 Range - Heljan - RMweb

I wonder if we might see a GSR version? They had 4 similar Sentinel railcars, though they weren't identical.

I wonder if there'll ever be a kit for the Drumm battery cars?

[Mol_PMB]

A good find!

Yes, those pics show one of the GSR cars - it looks like 357. Interesting to hear about the use in West Cork - maybe Kinsale?

The NIU Models kit looks very close to the GSR type.

 

 

[Mol_PMB]

4 minutes ago, Horsetan said:

I wonder if there'll ever be a kit for the Drumm battery cars?

If you drum up enough support then I suppose they might cell enough to make it worthwhile. It would depend how much they charge.

 

These steam railcars are too early for me, but tempting!

[Turin60]

Is this the current froth subject.

Hat & coat time?

John Bruce.

[leslie10646]

19 hours ago, Horsetan said:

I wonder if there'll ever be a kit for the Drumm battery cars?

@Fran and Co really do get high marks for this vehicle - pity it isn't like the irish articulated one - which ended up steam-hauled! It has certainly evoked plenty of comment. I had no idea that there were so many of them and for so long!

A pity that I already have a GWR steam railcar - but with its outside motion it was more like the GNR one!

Drumm? With A1 and 3D, it's a matter of time? 

Still we mustn't rub it in to the English that the Irish thought of it first.

And then  there's the Sainted Paddy's BEMU ........

[Mol_PMB]

The Drumms must have been the only vehicles in Ireland to have operated with steam, diesel and electric traction. I have now found two photos of them in use as AEC railcar intermediates.

[Horsetan]

1 hour ago, Mol_PMB said:

The Drumms must have been the only vehicles in Ireland to have operated with steam, diesel and electric traction...

Irish expediency. 

[Mayner]

There is some useful information of the Sentinel and Clayton railmotors in Locomotives of the GSR.

Although Sentinel railcars appear to have worked passenger services on the Cashel, Newmarket and Foynes branches a Sentinel also appears to have been used between Limerick, Nenagh and Ballybrophy.  I remember reading somewhere possibly IRRS Journal that Sentinel railcars were used on the Newmarket & Foynes branches because the branch good were worked by Mallow and Limerick based locos running through to the branch terminus (in UK terms a "Trip Working" or Turn) as opposed to a branch lijne loco based at Newmarket or Foynes. Its possible the Cashel 'goods" may have been worked by a Limerick Junction or Thurles loco. In its final days of operation the Edenderry Branch goods and occasionaal trips over the Meath Line to Drumree,-Kilmessan were worked by the Liffey Junction G611 Class pilot.

GSR Locomotives includes information on some unusual Sentinel or Clayton working on the Midland including: A 1928-- 11:10 all stations Mullingar-Sligo railcar which ran attached to the rear of the Cavan train as far as Inny Junction and 11:30 return from Sligo! 

Day returnes from Mullingar to Athlone & Athenry  1930 records 354,355 & 357 at work in the Western District, 356 in the Southern District.

Claytons 359,361 and 362 initially tried on Westland Row-Dalkey and Harcourt St-Foxrock suburban services. Also tried Mullingar-Sligo, Cork-Macroom and Cork-Clonakilty 'but only for relatively short periods at each location as they proved markedly less successful than the Sentinel version"  1930 -358,359 and 361 Midland District, 363 in Southern District.

Problems identified tendency to run short of steam (could not cope with greades on Foxrock services and having to stop for a "blow up" and considerable periods out of service under repair. Clayton went into liquidation 1929 resulting in problems obtaining spare parts.

So potentially Sentinel and Clayton steam railmotors in 'GSR Purple Lake"  livery working branch line passenger trains, short distance suburban and main-line feeder services. 

[Mol_PMB]

Thanks John, most interesting.

The Clayton carriage portions ended up on the W&T, the Sentinels seem to have been a bit ore successful in service but may not have had that subsequent life as hauled stock?

There's a detailed article on the LNER ones here, which also mentions some of the issues with performance and reliability:

LNER Encyclopedia: The Sentinel Steam Railcars