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Vlak

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  1. Vlak

    IRM Fert Wagon

    Richardson’s Fertiliser (based in Belfast) were also brought by road from the factory and loaded in Adelaide freight yard for transport across the Irish Railway Network. I seem to recall that occasionally several ferts would run from Belfast - North Wall - Mallow for the Co-Op in Farranfore which had it’s own siding off the station loop. This traffic ceased around 2001/2 if I’m not mistaken.
  2. Great pictures! The two photos above show two different types of oil wagons. The first wagon (grey & red) was formerly class A(?) oil wagons imported from Britain for use on the Esso Oil traffic from Dublin to Sligo Quay and Claremorris. As far as I’m aware they retained their original chassis and were simply re-gauged, and were therefore longer than most other 2-axle wagons in Ireland. The lower photo of the Burmah Oil wagons is interesting. There were several series of tank wagons built by CIE to two different designs. The ones depicted below had longer tanks extended the length of the wagon frame, while the one shown in ttc0169’s photo is the other variety with a shorter tank. These wagons were all mounted on 12ft wheelbase flats, same as the cement bubbles, and both varieties of wagons were used by Irish Rail up until 2006 for internal movements of fuel oil. Anyone have any information on the Burmah Oil oil flows, where did they run to / from and when did they cease? It always occurred to me that IRM could easily replicate at least one variety of the fuel oil wagons by using their existing cement bubble ‘flat’ and modifying their weed spray tanks to sit on top with some minor adjustments and tweaks, although perhaps easier said than done!
  3. Hopefully my above post sheds some light on the restriction to train lengths in Ireland. As regards the Tara Mines trains when they are short formed (ie say 6 or 8 wagons instead of 12) this is due to the type of material they are carrying. There are two types of mineral ores extracted from Tara Mines; Zinc and Lead. If memory serves me correctly trains wouldn’t normally run with both lead and zinc in the formation due to unloading complications at Dublin Port. Rather trains containing lead are moved separately to zinc. As I understand it (and am open to correction!) if there is a shipment of say 1,000 tons of Zinc out of Dublin Port it will equate to a total of 20x wagons carrying 50 tons each. This would either require 2x trains of 10x wagons or more likely 1x train of 12x wagons with the second having just 8x to deliver the required tonnage. Often railways world wide move bulk cargo in tonnages based on the customer’s request. If more than what’s been requested can be accommodated on one train the extra wagons are either operated on their own or else tagged onto a separate train which passes it’s intended delivery point in order for the railway company to complete the full delivery.
  4. Due to the weight of a 20ft Bulk-Tainer / Bulk Tank when loaded only one is permissible on a flat wagon positioned in the centre to keep axle loadings within tolerance. Trains which have 2x tanks per flat wagon are empty. In relation maximum lengths of trains in Ireland passing loops are relatively short and are maxed out at 36TEUs (or 18x 42/47ft liner flats or 12x 62ft timber / PW flats). As regards Tara Mines trains they are limited to 12x laden wagons due to their weight (circa 900 tons gross weight per train?). Generally speaking Irish train weights have been quite low in comparison to Europe, the 071s are probably capable of hauling up to 1000 tons but train weights also have to factor in things such as braking distance, acceleration, frictional resistance etc.
  5. Vlak

    new murphys products

    The Mk III P/P sets used in Connolly went over to Heuston with the delivery of the 2900 railcars in 2002/3 from memory where they were deployed on Waterford services mainly from about 2003/4, the reason being to negate the requirement of running round in Kilkenny. The delivery of the Cafe/Bar coach in 2005(?) from the UK was the last Mk3 coach to be delivered to Ireland, and was intended for the Waterford line. For a period in 2005/6 several push/pull driving trailers were decommissioned (not sure all were) and labels were placed in the driving cabs to say they were for hauled operation only. Several sets also ran as conventional hauled sets minus a Control Car instead having a conventional generator van attached. Several generator vans were modified to run with the push/pull sets which negated the need for a Control Car to be in the consist which had the generator. The Control Cars came back into use by mid-2006, all subsequently having been recommissioned I seem to recall, perhaps after overhaul. Could have something to do with the LHB bogies the control cars had, which limited them to 70mph before they were changed out for conventional BT10 bogies. Push/pull sets were used on the Kildare locals from time to time due to if a shortage of 2900 railcars occurred, although I seem to recall in 2007(?) there was actually a booked turn out to Kildare in the evening utilising a set off the ex Waterford for a while - not sure if it was an amended diagram for a few weeks or if it lasted throughout the entire timetable. One of the last duties for the push/pull sets was working between Cork / Mallow / Tralee due to a shortage of units towards the end of loco haulage days.
  6. Something which seems to, perhaps, have been overlooked in terms of freight are the Jumbo Tar Wagons. These were 2-Axle wagons which were used for the conveyance of Bitumen to both Sligo (and possibly Galway?) for Cold Chon. They were loaded in Alexander Road at their Tar Terminal and usually added to liner trains for the run west. Based on what little information I can gather the traffic didn’t really amount to much more than 3-6 wagons per train at a time. The traffic flow seems to have ended around 2001/2, although the bogie wagons (which contained ISO Bitumen containers which were used to Mallow for Council use) seems to have lasted into until 2003/4. It has been challenging to find photographs of these wagons in detail, other than a few photos with them in the background, but they appear to have been constructed / modified by CIE using Bitumen tanks mounted on short wheelbase 20ft flats (same as the Cement Bubbles it would seem) with the same tank anchors as was the case for most fuel oil & latterly Esso Oil wagons. Two tank designs appear to have been in use, one with a flat end and another with a more rounded end with ribs. I attach two screen shots taken from the video linked below which provides a little more detail (hope the author of the video doesn’t mind!); it would seem that unique to tank wagons here the ladders were positioned at the end of the tank rather than in the middle. I would also hazard a guess the reason they gained the name ‘Jumbo’ was due to their larger more bulky tank design in comparison to the oil tanks to account for the lagging. Video of a typical formation for Jumbo Tar Tanks: Further discussion / information or even photos & drawings welcomed.
  7. In latter years there were only the two Quarries which were served as mentioned above. Once Lecarrow closed Lisduff was the last quarry owned(?) by CIE and ceased operations sometime in the 1990s at which point Lisduff was designated as a loading point with ballast being brought in by road from nearby quarries. Ballast has been loaded at numerous points throughout the network, and almost all lines have designated loading points / sidings, which is a lot more efficient than running trains for miles from the likes of Lecarrow & Lisduff. When ballasting work is required the Hoppers tended to stable at the loading points and carry out work in the area, before moving on to the next location for work. For example if ballasting was required between say Kildare and Portarlington the hoppers would be based in Portarlington where they were loaded, then run to Kildare, run round and work back to Portarlington to re-load before repeating the process until the work within the area is complete. Let's say the next area for ballasting was Malahide, the hoppers would then be worked from Portarlington - Dublin's North Wall Freight terminal where they would then be based & loaded up until the work in Malahide was complete before moving onto wherever they were needed next. Edit: As regards T/Ts for the likes of freight & PW trains paths are inserted more to facilitate moves as and when they are required, as Mayner pointed out it was probably put in place to cater for the Western Division Hoppers running to/from Lisduff as and when the need arose. You may also notice several paths in the T/T for say cement or liner trains, but needless to say they didn't all run on the same day, rather depending on customer / operational requirements the train may have ran in an early or late path depending.
  8. I had heard numerous others refer to the R for re-powered (here at least) but yes you are indeed correct the engine balance was different, the 567 CR’s cylinder firing sequence was slightly different to the C alright (4x cylinders???) fired in different sequence from memory.
  9. The 645 power assemblies didn’t change the designation of the engines, they were simply designated (in Ireland for example) as ‘8-567CR’ 8 = 8x cylinders 567 = Engine block production series C = Type of Engine Block (the A & B versions had square inspection hatches while the C & D had circular inspection hatches, same as on the 645 & 710 engines) R = Was the designation as they were re-powered with 645 power packs. While your correct regarding the cubic displacement of the cylinders increasing from 567 to 645 the increase in power was negligible as the original governor settings on the 567s remained as was (835rpm on max) as opposed to 900rpm on the 645s. As regards the sound decoders the sound for the 567 models is correct for the later versions which retained the 567 block as it has the lower idle / max power settings recorded, while the 645 has the higher idle / max power settings, hence the difference in sound. Of course you can put in whatever decoders of your choosing! Edit: Forgot to add the exhaust manifolds on EMD engines had a lot to do with the sound. The C class locomotives (while the same engine as the 181s) has a completely different sound due to having 2x rectangular exhaust ports (1x per manifold) while the 121/141/181s had 1x circular exhaust port for the 2x manifolds.
  10. No, both 124 & 134 retained the 567 engine until their withdrawal in 2008. The 121s & 141s which were fitted with EMD 645 engines were recovered from former C class locomotives withdrawn in the 1980s for several replaced some 567 engines for reasons such as major failures / rebuilds or re-powering for push/pull duties as was the case for a small handful of 121s. All of the GMs which retained the 567 engines got power-packs from 645s as time went on (cylinder liners, pistons, heads etc) due to parts commonality, but their engine speed remained the same and didn't change the sound of the 567s. Hope this helps.
  11. I had a delve thru my archives and came across the photo of the IÉ Ballast Hopper, No. 24262. As an aside, I had a check thru some shots of the IÉ Fuel Oil Tank-Cars used for transporting fuel oil for internal use and the only one I could find was the IÉ liveried one depicted by DiveController in Limerick. While on the subject should IRM wish to make these models in the future the ones latterly used ran mostly on the same chassis as the Cement Bubbles, using 3x different types of tank design; two of which are depicted in DiveController's photo, with the third using an extended tank and were formerly Esso Oil tank cars (not to be confused with the class A tanks used on the Sligo & Claremorris Oil turns), which were utilised for IÉ fuel oil until the flow ceased in 2006. Anyway back to Ballast Hoppers, hope the photo helps.
  12. If I recall correctly there was 1x ballast hopper that had the IÉ plug & socket logo stencilled on the sides, as well as one of the tank wagons, used for transporting fuel oil for internal use around the network in years gone by. I’m struggling to think of any other freight wagons that carried the IÉ plug & socket logo with the exception of the weedspray train? PS: Superb work by IRM for yet another fantastic release! Edit: There were several tank wagons converted for Molasses traffic that carried the IR ‘points’ logo as well as at least one brake van I seem to recall.
  13. Thanks Wrenneire, appreciate the update.
  14. As we're into the last day of June is there any update on expected arrivals of the 121?
  15. Vlak

    Class 121

    The main difference in the 567 and 645 engines fitted to the Small GMs (including the 121s) was the engine idle & max power engine RPM settings, which gave a different sound. The EMD 567s fitted to most 121s and 141s were set to idle at 275rpm with a maximum power of 835rpm; The EMD 645s fitted to the 181s & C class (and subsequently fitted to some 121 & 141s) were set to idle at 315rpm with a maximum power of 904rpm. Flage Lubricator is correct about 567 engines being fitted with 645 power packs, however it did not change the idle speed, max power speed or sound of the 567 engines, it was just for the sake of common components. Essentially if you heard a 121 fitted with a 645 engine it's idle speed would be higher ticking over than a conventional 567 engine, and it's engine speed would be higher when on full power. Hopefully this makes some sense(!), but perhaps these few examples below may help illustrate the point. 146 (fitted with 567 engine with 645 power packs) idling: 142 (fitted with 645 engine) idling (notice the higher pitch from the engine compared to 146): And to keep this thread on subject see example of 124 + 134 paired together, both having the 567 engines fitted:
  16. Perhaps these photos may also help. Kegs were either loaded / unloaded into the cages on trains or else in yards. Vlak.
  17. Any word if the 121s will be released before the end of the year?
  18. When the Sligo timber flow ceased in 2008 8(?) timber wagons had their stanchions removed & have since returned to PW use. There was a trial carried out on a 42ft flat some years back with timber stanchions attached having been removed from the 4 wheel flats which went for scrap, but AFAIK it never entered service, or even trials. The stanchions have since been removed & the wagon is back working liner trains.
  19. Vlak

    Class 121

    Main difference between the EMD 567 & 645 engines was their engine speed. The EMD 567s fitted to the Irish BGMs idled at 275rpm & flat out ran at 835rpm. The 645 engines by comparison idled at 315rpm and in maximum power ran at 900rpm. I guess the best analogy in relation to sound (roughly speaking) is the sound of a 181 idling is close to the sound of a 141 in notch 2. By comparison the sound of a 141 in max power is similar to that of a 181 between notches 6-7. The exhaust manifolds are both the same on each loco and has been commented they sound very similar.
  20. Regarding ballast rakes there were times that a single plough was used; more often than not if the second one was away for repairs / maintenance. The general principle of having two vans was to negate the need to be able to spread ballast in one direction only; but for most (single lines) it could be overcome by dropping ballast in the direction which the plough was facing. For example if it was planned to drop ballast between Portarlington and Tullamore and the van was at the Tullamore end the train would run laden from Portarlington - Tullamore, run round and then drop going back to Portarlington. The ballast hoppers were formed into 3x rakes (known as Sets A, B & C). The usual composition was 15 hoppers & 2x vans. One of the rakes had a former GSWR plough van in the consist (dating from 1906) and although running on a more modern under-frame it was considered the oldest item of rolling stock left running in everyday service on Irish Railways.
  21. While sounding similar to the 141s the 121s had a bit more of a 'whine' to them in my experience. This video depicts 134+144 working a laden beet down to Mallow's Beet Factory and then subsequent shunting in very poor rail conditions. You can also hear the knocking at the beginning of the video as the pair build brakes, this is coming from the air compressor on 134. All 121's compressors produced this 'knocking' sound as they were building air / vacuum. While on the subject of the 121s is there any news or updates regarding the 121s or their production? Are we likely to see any pre-production photos or models by the end of the year?
  22. Hi all, Just joined this forum and although I don't currently model railways I have an interest in the Irish scene, and have been taken aback by the work many members here have produced. At the risk of hijacking a thread and perhaps tempting a ban on my first post here (!) if you'll allow me, perhaps I can give some information on GM engines used in Irish locos which may give some insight into their unique sound. The A class were re-engined with GM 12 cylinder 645E engines in the late 1960s & early 1970s. These engines were fitted with 2x superchargers (known as roots blowers). The two roots blowers were located on the generator end of the locomotive. For the observers among us you will notice the addition of the two "mushrooms" on the roof at the end of the 'air vents' to facilitate this on the rebuilt A classes. The GM engine's sound is very much governed by the type of exhaust manifold fitted to them. The A class have 3x exhaust ports on the roof roughly in the middle between the "air vents". It is this which gives them the unique sound. The original exhaust port for the Crossley engines was the circular hole at the opposite end of the fan which was filled in once re-engining took place. Generally 645 engines idle at 315rpm and have a maximum speed of 900/904rpm when on full power. For the A class most were limited to 800rpm owing to the electrics & generator output (although several were re-rated to 900rpm for several years before being de-rated back down to 800rpm). I would imagine this would have had something to do with traction motor cooling owing to higher voltage being through them (the motors on the A class were naturally ventilated as opposed to all other CIE/IR diesel electric locomotives which were force ventilated). Incidentally there are still several locomotives still in existence in Eastern Europe with the same engines & exhaust manifolds, and sound virtually identical to A classes - although on full power @ 900rpm! The notching on GMs is somewhat 'gradual' in terms of power. When the driver moves the throttle locomotive from say notch 1 - 2 the engine will rev up to the set RPM and then the load from the generator will increase (governed by the load regulator) and you should notice the engine revs drop slightly as the "load" increases. On the A class the load regulators (which are Metrovick and not GM) were tweaked to put out a higher rate of voltage once notching occurs, hence less of a "wind up / wind down" sound on the engine when notching up or down. This enabled the A classes to have the ability for quicker starts from stations. The load regulators on the C classes (again Metrovick) were set-up similarly to what is in other GMs, and more of a "whine" can be heard from the engine as it winds up / winds down. The 071s and Class 57s do have basically the same engines, but the 57s are more heavily silenced and have 4 (?) exhaust ports through silencers as opposed to one on an 071. The higher idle RPM on a class 57 may be down to it drawing ETH. Incidentally as far as I'm aware the 071s were fitted with different turbochargers in the early 1990s which seemed more durable than what was in them originally. If you listen to an 071 compared to a 111 there is a distinctly different engine note between the two. The 111s tend to 'whistle'... While the 071s engine note sounds a bit more "meatier"! Although, I should say that 076's engine is fitted from an ex Swedish diesel and sounds very similar to a 111. Hope this may provide some sort of explanation on the unique sound of our Irish locos, Regards, Vlak.
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