Murphy 071 Lighting

[JT22CW]

Evening folks,

 

Just taken delivery of my first Murphy 071. Stuck a Bachmann chip in it and tried the lights.

 

I've noticed the model does have the centre headlights, but, does anybody know how to turn them on...

 

Standard directional lighting is working even if the bulbs are tiny. Not sure about the big beams though...

 

Any help much appreciated...

[JasonB]

Their are 3 switches under the fuel tank for the lights it might be just a matter of switching it on.

[Noel]

Evening folks,

 

Just taken delivery of my first Murphy 071. Stuck a Bachmann chip in it and tried the lights.

 

I've noticed the model does have the centre headlights, but, does anybody know how to turn them on...

 

Standard directional lighting is working even if the bulbs are tiny. Not sure about the big beams though...

 

Any help much appreciated...

 

The main headlight is switched by a separate DCC function (F4)

 

F0 Turns directional running lights on/off

F4 Turns the main beam on/off

F8 Turns the cab lights on/off (if you have a 6 function decoder)

 

Depending on which Bachmann chip you used, it may not operate the cab lights. Popular bachmann DCC chips are only 4 function decoders). Personally I don't care for the cab lights (i.e. too bright, unrealistic and too white/blue tint).

Edited August 27, 2016 by Noel

[DiveController]

The main headlight is switched by a separate DCC function (F4)

 

F0 Turns directional running lights on/off

F4 Turns the main beam on/off

F8 Turns the cab lights on/off (if you have a 6 function decoder)

 

Depending on which Bachmann chip you used, it may not operate the cab lights. Popular bachmann DCC chips are only 4 function decoders). Personally I don't care for the cab lights (i.e. too bright, unrealistic and too white/blue tint).

 

The chip is easy enough to insert and remove on the 071. If you have any section of DC, try it there first. Directional lights and headlights will both work on DC. Ensure the tiny switches Jason refers to are all turn ON underneath, normally they are, straight out of the box. Test in both directions. Cab lights will NOT work under DC. 6-function decoder required if you want all 071 light functions on DCC. Turn the brightness of the cab lights WAY down when you are familiar with the correct CV later. It's little blue but still realistic. Which Bachmann chip?

Edited August 28, 2016 by DiveController

[Noel]

Hi Guys. There is no need to adjust the dip switches under the loco. Just use Function 4 for the head lights. Prototypically locos turned off head light when pulling into a station. Noel

 

PS: As I understand, main cab lights would normally be off while a loco is traveling at night so that the driver can better see signal lights in the distance (i.e. dark cockpit). Instrumentation would be dimly illuminated.

Edited August 28, 2016 by Noel

[DiveController]

Hi Guys. There is no need to adjust the dip switches under the loco. Just use Function 4 for the head lights. Prototypically locos turned off head light when pulling into a station. Noel

 

PS: As I understand, main cab lights would normally be off while a loco is traveling at night so that the driver can better see signal lights in the distance (i.e. dark cockpit). Instrumentation would be dimly illuminated.

No need to adjust the switches under DCC but to check the loco under DC they need to be on. I had one 141 with a poor solder connection/broken wire. If the chip works on DC & DCC no need to remove it either.

Usually the cab lights would be off in motion like driving your car at night and used mainly at the MPD/station or however you like it.

[JT22CW]

Cheers for the input so far folks.

 

The three switches underneath are all pointed in the ON position but I'm still not getting the main headlights.

 

I might leave it for now, as I'm eyeing up the DCC Sound chip Murphy have produced, unless anyone has any suggestions towards a different sound provider for the 071...

[Noel]

Cheers for the input so far folks.

 

The three switches underneath are all pointed in the ON position but I'm still not getting the main headlights.

 

I might leave it for now, as I'm eyeing up the DCC Sound chip Murphy have produced, unless anyone has any suggestions towards a different sound provider for the 071...

 

The MM 071 sound chip is pretty good and it's on an ESU decoder. MrSoundGuy sells a Zimo decoder with 071 sound which is also pretty good. The main difference is the 'real drive' throttle and braking control on the Zimo which includes coasting. Some folks love it, some hate it and prefer the ESU deceleration method. Personally I like driving locos with the Zimo sound chip as its closer to the real thing. To stop the loco you have to apply breaks using F4, so timing the correct stopping point at a platform is interesting. But I also really like driving my 071 with the ESU. Splitting hairs needed to separate them. I prefer the sound of brakes on the ESU, but prefer the coasting and braking procedure on the Zimo.

[DiveController]

The MM 071 sound chip is pretty good and it's on an ESU decoder. MrSoundGuy sells a Zimo decoder with 071 sound which is also pretty good. The main difference is the 'real drive' throttle and braking control on the Zimo which includes coasting. Some folks love it, some hate it and prefer the ESU deceleration method. Personally I like driving locos with the Zimo sound chip as its closer to the real thing. To stop the loco you have to apply breaks using F4, so timing the correct stopping point at a platform is interesting. But I also really like driving my 071 with the ESU. Splitting hairs needed to separate them. I prefer the sound of brakes on the ESU, but prefer the coasting and braking procedure on the Zimo.

Can 'Real Drive' be programmed on the Murphy ESU chip by fiddling with the CVs? I'm curious how RealDrive is achieved that couldn't be done with any decoder or is it just preprogrammed for you?

JT22, you should try the lights on any DC piece of track if you have an old transformer, neighbor's kid set or whatever.

[Noel]

Can 'Real Drive' be programmed on the Murphy ESU chip by fiddling with the CVs? I'm curious how RealDrive is achieved that couldn't be done with any decoder or is it just preprogrammed for you?

 

Don't know is the quick answer. Sure one could change acel and decel CVs on ESU chip, but that won't simulate 'coasting' nor direct application of brakes (eg F4 on Zimo). Have a google for some video showing real drive. For example if I get an MM 141/Zimo up to scale speed of 70mph and then zero the throttle she will continue 'coasting' around the layout barely loosing any speed for some considerable time unless brakes are engaged on/off using F4. On the ESU when you pull the throttle fully off the CV4 deceleration CV immediately slows the loco at a rate, no active application of a brakes input needed. You get used to both methods of simulating the inertia of a heavy train being brought gradually to a halt. With the ESU I find I progressively reduce throttle with '-1' speed step decrements as the train approaches, with the Zimo I do nothing but start brake input to control the rate of slowing.

[irishthump]

Can 'Real Drive' be programmed on the Murphy ESU chip by fiddling with the CVs? I'm curious how RealDrive is achieved that couldn't be done with any decoder or is it just preprogrammed for you?

 

No, driving characteristics such as Real Drive are controlled by the actual sound file that is loaded on to the decoder. The CV's have no control over this. personally I'm not too fond of the Zimo decoders. The braking and coasting features are very good but the way the engine sounds react to throttle changes leaves a lot to be desired IMHO.

 

However, ESU recently realeased a new set of soundfiles that have similar features under the name "Full Throttle". These include a working brake, a "Coast" function which brings the engine sound down to idle while you control the speed independently with the throttle as well as "Drive Hold" which locks the speed of the loco while you adjust the engine sound with the throttle. Sounds complicated but is simple in practice.

 

I've programmed one of my own locos at home with one of these files and it works great. You can achieve very realistic running with it. I was planning to post a video of it when I get the chance.

 

Here's a video from ESU's YouTube channel. It's a bit long winded but you can get the idea....

 

[video=youtube;3k-MfiBY7eQ]

[DiveController]

I guess I assumed that changing the deceleration CVs on the chip would simulate coasting. If decel CV is set to minimal deceleration then the train should coast but will eventually stop without any braking (although unless you have a very large layout it might take more than a few circuits of the 'standard' layout). I tried a friend's RealDrive equipped sound chip in my 079SA and if I recall correctly it stopped from whatever speed it was doing after about 2.5 circuits of a 8x4' layout. Not practical for prototypical stopping to throttle off a scale mile of two down the track and hope to hit the stopping point, I grant you. I supposed that 'braking' temporarily changed the decel CVs setting to slow the loco when F4 is toggled on or off, just like there has to be some change in these settings when 'light engine' is selected. Thanks for your thoughts on the sound chips. Really liked the RealDrive when I ran the loco. Will be investing in these at some point, I think. Sorry if this is drifting off but JT22 did bring the subject up...

EDIT: Thanks, IT, Noticed you typing away at the same time. very interesting. Would be interested in your post at some point when you can

Edited September 10, 2016 by DiveController

[irishthump]

I guess I assumed that changing the deceleration CVs on the chip would simulate coasting. If decel CV is set to minimal deceleration then the train should coast but will eventually stop without any braking (although unless you have a very large layout it might take more than a few circuits of the 'standard' layout). I tried a friend's RealDrive equipped sound chip in my 079SA and if I recall correctly it stopped from whatever speed it was doing after about 2.5 circuits of a 8x4' layout. Not practical for prototypical stopping to throttle off a scale mile of two down the track and hope to hit the stopping point, I grant you. I supposed that 'braking' temporarily changed the decel CVs setting to slow the loco when F4 is toggled on or off, just like there has to be some change in these settings when 'light engine' is selected. Thanks for your thoughts on the sound chips. Really liked the RealDrive when I ran the loco. Will be investing in these at some point, I think. Sorry if this is drifting off but JT22 did bring the subject up...

EDIT: Thanks, IT, Noticed you typing away at the same time. very interesting. Would be interested in your post at some point when you can

 

Setting the deceleration to it's maximum would simulate coasting, but there's problem with doing that with MM decoder. ESU decoders use a different setting to practically all other makes of decoder when it comes to acceleration/deceleration CV's. There is a standard NMRA formula for this which ESU for, some unknown reason, didi'nt follow. The result is the maximum acc/dec rate on their decoders is about 25% of other makes. So if a loco fitted with a Zimo decoder takes 2 laps of a track circuit to stop then an ESU decoder with the same dec value will stop in .5 laps of the track.

[NIRCLASS80]

ESU have recently introduced an option called "Full Throttle" to there North American range of sounds. These can be downloaded and the Irish horn and station announcements edited onto them using the ESU Lokprogrammer. I have done this and the engine sound is terrific. See the video in post number 11.

Edited September 10, 2016 by NIRCLASS80

[Noel]

Hi IT, that's a huge improvement that allows more control over sound. I presume one would have to reprogram MM/ESU decoders yourself with a software update from V4 and reload sound files? Noel

[irishthump]

Hi IT, that's a huge improvement that allows more control over sound. I presume one would have to reprogram MM/ESU decoders yourself with a software update from V4 and reload sound files? Noel

 

Noel,

 

Yes, the decoders require a small firmware update to use the new files. Obviously you need the Lokprogrammer to do this.

 

There's a large range of updated soundfiles already available on the ESU website and they're adding to it every month. These features are aimed squarely at the US market so the engine sounds we need are well catered for. There are already several different soundfiles just for the EMD 567 so you can programme 3-4 141's each with a slightly different engine sound.

[Noel]

Noel,

 

Yes, the decoders require a small firmware update to use the new files. Obviously you need the Lokprogrammer to do this.

 

There's a large range of updated soundfiles already available on the ESU website and they're adding to it every month. These features are aimed squarely at the US market so the engine sounds we need are well catered for. There are already several different soundfiles just for the EMD 567 so you can programme 3-4 141's each with a slightly different engine sound.

 

Forgive the pun but that 'sounds' great. If I was to get a lokprogramer and download the sound files from the ESU site, where would I get the sound tracks for Irish horn, station announcements, platform whistle, etc? Presume brakes and flange screech are on US files?

[irishthump]

Forgive the pun but that 'sounds' great. If I was to get a lokprogramer and download the sound files from the ESU site, where would I get the sound tracks for Irish horn, station announcements, platform whistle, etc? Presume brakes and flange screech are on US files?

 

You can download the Lokprogrammer software from the ESU website for free and play around with it before you even buy the programmer itself. When you download the software it includes several sound template libraries which contain various engine, horn, brake, whistle sounds which you can use to build your own soundfiles from scratch. These libraries don't contain the Irish-specific sounds but if you download the 201 and 071 sound files you can copy these sounds to the libraries on your PC. It's then a fairly simple job to download whatever US sound file that has the engine sound you need then just swap out whatever sounds you want for Irish ones.

[irishthump]

For what it's worth, the Lokprogrammer will set you back about €120, basically the cost of one MM 071 chip, but it's probably the best investment I've made.

I can overwrite any of my Loksound decoders so I'm not stuck with sounds I don't like. Also, blank Loksound decoders can be got for €100 each plus free shipping.

[Noel]

For what it's worth, the Lokprogrammer will set you back about €120, basically the cost of one MM 071 chip, but it's probably the best investment I've made. I can overwrite any of my Loksound decoders so I'm not stuck with sounds I don't like. Also, blank Loksound decoders can be got for €100 each plus free shipping.

 

Thanks, very interesting. Would love to see a video of some of your ESU sound work sometime if you get a chance to post. If I made a mess of a sound mix and blew it onto LokSound V4 chip, I presume with the programer I could just restore the 071 or 201 sound files to get back to the decoder as shipped by MM?

[irishthump]

Thanks, very interesting. Would love to see a video of some of your ESU sound work sometime if you get a chance to post. If I made a mess of a sound mix and blew it onto LokSound V4 chip, I presume with the programer I could just restore the 071 or 201 sound files to get back to the decoder as shipped by MM?

 

Yes, they use the same files.

[Noel]

Yes, they use the same files.

 

Will download the app and try it out. I resume you can play the sounds through the app to see how the mix is working. Did you download the 200mb template pack which seems to be their entire sound library?

[irishthump]

Will download the app and try it out. I resume you can play the sounds through the app to see how the mix is working. Did you download the 200mb template pack which seems to be their entire sound library?

 

Yes. You can play back the various sound functions but you can't really see how the loco drives without having it on the track.

Edited September 10, 2016 by irishthump

[irishthump]

I guess I assumed that changing the deceleration CVs on the chip would simulate coasting. If decel CV is set to minimal deceleration then the train should coast but will eventually stop without any braking (although unless you have a very large layout it might take more than a few circuits of the 'standard' layout). I tried a friend's RealDrive equipped sound chip in my 079SA and if I recall correctly it stopped from whatever speed it was doing after about 2.5 circuits of a 8x4' layout. Not practical for prototypical stopping to throttle off a scale mile of two down the track and hope to hit the stopping point, I grant you. I supposed that 'braking' temporarily changed the decel CVs setting to slow the loco when F4 is toggled on or off, just like there has to be some change in these settings when 'light engine' is selected. Thanks for your thoughts on the sound chips. Really liked the RealDrive when I ran the loco. Will be investing in these at some point, I think. Sorry if this is drifting off but JT22 did bring the subject up...

EDIT: Thanks, IT, Noticed you typing away at the same time. very interesting. Would be interested in your post at some point when you can

 

I forgot to mention. The MM 071 Loksound decoders have a notch up/down feature which allows you to change the engine sound independent from the loco's speed. You can notch right down to idle without altering the speed at all.

Edited September 10, 2016 by irishthump

[Noel]

I forgot to mention. The MM 071 Loksound decoders have a notch up/down feature which allows you to change the engine sound independent from the loco's speed. You can notch right down to idle without altering the speed at all.

 

Maybe its the V4 software I have, but I never got the handle of that, possibly because they daftly put notching on functions higher than 9 so on most cabs require combinations of buttons or a shift key which I found it a bit clunky to operate. But the new ESU video you demonstrated seems to handle this better because the notching is done through the throttle control rather than FN buttons.

[irishthump]

Maybe its the V4 software I have, but I never got the handle of that, possibly because they daftly put notching on functions higher than 9 so on most cabs require combinations of buttons or a shift key which I found it a bit clunky to operate. But the new ESU video you demonstrated seems to handle this better because the notching is done through the throttle control rather than FN buttons.

 

Having notching assigned to high numbered function keys is only part of the problem, you also have to aware of how notching works within the sound file.

Once you activate notching up it will remain active until the function key(s) are pressed again. It can also take a second or two to activate so you need about of practice to get the feel of how it operates. Assigning the notch functions to lower keys makes it a lot easier.

Again, this is a much easier process with the Lokprogammer.

[Noel]

Having notching assigned to high numbered function keys is only part of the problem, you also have to aware of how notching works within the sound file.

Once you activate notching up it will remain active until the function key(s) are pressed again. It can also take a second or two to activate so you need about of practice to get the feel of how it operates. Assigning the notch functions to lower keys makes it a lot easier.

Again, this is a much easier process with the Lokprogammer.

 

Yes but they don't make it intuitive to use like an iPhone UI. I still think DCC UI seems left in the dark ages. It just hasn't moved with the times, even if it sounds great and fingers get RSI

[Junctionmad]

Yes but they don't make it intuitive to use like an iPhone UI. I still think DCC UI seems left in the dark ages. It just hasn't moved with the times, even if it sounds great and fingers get RSI

 

The primary issues being the lack of standards once you move away from the original basic dcc standard which was designed for very simplistic US focused operations

[JT22CW]

Update folks!

 

OK. So. On DC the main beam headlights do work.

 

On DCC. Not so much. Tried a few chips, I've got a Bachmann on in at the minute, and having tried all the functions, no joy.

 

Am I going to have to get the proper Murphy chip...

[Noel]

Update folks!

 

OK. So. On DC the main beam headlights do work.

 

On DCC. Not so much. Tried a few chips, I've got a Bachmann on in at the minute, and having tried all the functions, no joy.

 

Am I going to have to get the proper Murphy chip...

 

F4 on any manufacturers DCC chip should turn headlights on, so I don't think the chip is your problem, there seems to be a fault on the loco itself.

 

Ps. Lateral thinking unless your DCC controllers cab has had the FN buttons reprogrammed and F4 is not actually F4. Highly unlikely but a remote possibility.

[JT22CW]

If there was a fault on the circuit board tho, I'm not sure why the main beams would work on DC and not DCC.

 

Lights function on most of my chips as always been F0 mind...

[JT22CW]

The cab light works off F2, but only works at one end and the button has to be held down for it to turn on...

 

Anyone else had these problems or is it just me, getting very worried now, as Kernow MRC has sold out of the 071 I own...

[irishthump]

The cab light works off F2, but only works at one end and the button has to be held down for it to turn on...

 

Anyone else had these problems or is it just me, getting very worried now, as Kernow MRC has sold out of the 071 I own...

 

I don't think there is a problem with the loco.

 

What decoder are you using and which DCC system do you have?

 

The reason I ask is:

 

1) The decoder probably does'nt have enough function outputs. The headlights requires 2 separate functions for them to work in both directions. This is the reason it only works at one end.

2) The reason F2 has to be held down is because of the DCC controller. A lot of brands set F2 to only operate as long as it's pressed (This is because most sound decoders assign the horn to F2.)

[JT22CW]

Sounds like a 6 function decoder might be the solution then. I've heard the 201s require 6 function chips, trying to find knowledge of 071s needing the same.

[WRENNEIRE]

Why bother with cab lights men?

I dont think they add anything to the whole digital experience

They are too bright also imho

[Noel]

Sounds like a 6 function decoder might be the solution then. I've heard the 201s require 6 function chips, trying to find knowledge of 071s needing the same.

 

FYI, I have Lenz 4 function decoders working fine in my 071s. The only thing that doesn't work is the cab lights (which is no loss imho).