GSR & CIE station nameboards

[jhb171achill]

Killeagh was one of quite a few stations which never got a GSR bilingual nameboard, let alone a CIE one.

The Patrickswell and Askeaton ones are standard GSR, and I took them to show the font. Standard enamels with off-white lettering on a black background.

The white-background CIE ones appeared at most stations by degrees after 1966, which is when I think the first appeared - I stand to corrected on that but it was around the time they were re-naming stations after the 1916 guys.

These were white PLASTIC, with black plastic letters glued on. Pretty much everything had to be “plastic” in the 1970s to show how “modern” it was! How times have changed..... These white signs had spread to most places by the early 1970s and would remain through most of the 1980s.

”Killeagh” is standard GSWR design.

 

[David Holman]

Question - were there bilingual signs before independence? Belmullet is shown on my current AA road atlas as being in a Gaelic speaking area, so would a station nameboard have been in both languages in the early 1900s?

[minister_for_hardship]

6 minutes ago, David Holman said:

Question - were there bilingual signs before independence? Belmullet is shown on my current AA road atlas as being in a Gaelic speaking area, so would a station nameboard have been in both languages in the early 1900s?

No. English only.

[Galteemore]

The bilingual signs were a post Partition way of advertising that things had changed. Mind you, quite possible that a local Gaelic Leaguer would have chalked up a cheeky translation underneath the sign in the turbulent years of the Third Home Rule crisis ! 

[David Holman]

Looks like I will need to make removable signs for my layout when it goes dual period. Easier than having two liveries for all the buildings. I shall have to plead artistic licence.

[minister_for_hardship]

They were also English only at GNRI, CDRJC, DN&GR, L&LSR and SL&NCR stations in the ROI. Anything that wasn't GSR/cross border.

Edited March 31, 2020 by minister_for_hardship

[minister_for_hardship]

A pair in captivity. 

Cheap painted-on plywood with metal angle surround edged in orange.

More substantial timber sign, stuck on black plastic letters and grey surround.

[minister_for_hardship]

[jhb171achill]

3 hours ago, David Holman said:

Question - were there bilingual signs before independence? Belmullet is shown on my current AA road atlas as being in a Gaelic speaking area, so would a station nameboard have been in both languages in the early 1900s?

No. 

They were entirely a GSR thing, and carried on by CIE and IE.

All railway companies, without any exception, that were pre-1925, and all after that date that were not to become part of the GSR were always English language only.

Even in Irish speaking areas, like Cahirviceen, Valentia Harbour, all stations west of Rosscahill (“Ross” on the Clifden line), and probably Baltimore, they were English-only, because Irish was seen as “backward” and English “civilised” by the then-management of the railway companies in their lofty offices in Dublin!

The GSR never even got around to changing them all. It is worth documenting lines which remained English past GSR times, and even past CIE times, to closure.

Please feel free to add to this, but from the top of my head....

The T & D

Most of the C & L, if not all

Mallow - Waterford

Fenit branch

Waterford & Tramore

Most of Youghal Line, if not all

Cobh branch mostly 

What about Wisht Caaark? Certainly a lot of their stations never got GSR enamels.

Incidentally, the Belmullet area today would be bilingual rather than a true Gaeltacht area. 

[Edo]

Bagnalstown to Palace East and Macmine to New Ross never got the Dual language ones either - english only.....not sure about New Ross - prob didnt as it was Goods only after 64.

Ps - Bagnalstown did as it remains part of the network.

Edited March 31, 2020 by Edo

[minister_for_hardship]

36 minutes ago, Edo said:

Bagnalstown to Palace East and Macmine to New Ross never got the Dual language ones either - english only.....not sure about New Ross - prob didnt as it was Goods only after 64.

Ps - Bagnalstown did as it remains part of the network.

New Ross got a standard bilingual GSR board on concrete posts, saw it in a photo somewhere, possibly removed after 64 along with footbridge and other trimmings.

[jhb171achill]

Bagenalstown, yes, and I paid CIE £3 for it in 1977, when I found it lying in the muck inside the former loco shed.

CIE put it on a goods train to Dublin, and it went by NIR parcels to Lisburn, where I collected it.

Regrettably, I had to sell it in the 1990s. I’d love to know where it is now!

Incidentally, the Belmullet area today would be bilingual rather than a true Gaeltacht area. 

The South Wexford didn’t have GSR enamels, I think. That had to await CIE days. Maybe some of the stations did....?

The Achill & Clifden lines never had GSR enamels anywhere.

[minister_for_hardship]

1 hour ago, jhb171achill said:

 

Please feel free to add to this, but from the top of my head....

The T & D

Most of the C & L, if not all

Mallow - Waterford

Fenit branch

Waterford & Tramore

Most of Youghal Line, if not all

Cobh branch mostly 

What about Wisht Caaark? Certainly a lot of their stations never got GSR enamels.

Incidentally, the Belmullet area today would be bilingual rather than a true Gaeltacht area. 

Ones that I can think of that never got a bilingual board...open to correction.

Headford Jct, Loo Bridge. Dooks, Listowel, Abbeyfeale, Newcastle (West),  Ballingrane Jct, Rathkeale, Fermoy, Bruree, Newmarket, Mourne Abbey, Rathduff, Clondulane, Dunkettle, Little Island, Cobh Jct, Carrigtwohill, Midleton (cabin had a small version, ditto Killeagh and Youghal)

Blarney (both), Ballymartle (Kinsale branch), Clonakilty.

Early closures, Clifden branch, Achill branch.

Curiously the Muskerry got one GSR board (Western Road) as did the Passage (Monkstown) and some perhaps not all T&D roadside halts got them.

 

8 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

 

Regrettably, I had to sell it in the 1990s. I’d love to know where it is now!

Manhattan, there's a Bagenalstown GSR board in Fitzpatricks Hotel.

Edited March 31, 2020 by minister_for_hardship

[jhb171achill]

Yes, the T & D is a curious one. Roadside halts, yes, but not so much stations!

And the North Kerry, as you say.

Collooney (South) had the navy blue enamel English-only WLWR one to the end, and it lay there long past closure.

The whole Collooney - Limerick line had very few.

Attymon & Woodlawn still had small MGWR enamels on platform seats until c.1980 at least.

 

[minister_for_hardship]

I guess like major BR stations having never gotten a regional "hotdog", I don't recall that Kingsbridge, Broadstone, Westland Row ever got a GSR nameboard either? Ditto Cork, Galway(?), Limerick(?), Waterford(?)

Sligo did get one, it had a fine display of GSR signage well into the 1990s.

[jhb171achill]

15 minutes ago, minister_for_hardship said:

Manhattan, there's a Bagenalstown GSR board in Fitzpatricks Hotel.

Wowwww!!!!!!   I think I had sold it to a guy in England at the time but I really can’t remember who, as I sold a large amount of “railwayana” at the same time....

He must have sold it on....

[jhb171achill]

More nameboards.

Mallow is a PAINTED GSR one, like that still existing in very recent years on the cabin at Cherryville Junction.

As such, and on account of the word “Mallow” being a short word, it’s in a more “stretched-out” style of writing.

Clonsilla is interesting. On the face of it, it’s a Midland sign - BUT - the Mudland usually didn’t have just the station or location name. They typically had “CLONSILLA STATION SIGNAL CABIN”.

So - is this MGWR or very early GSR!

The one of Gorey shows the station nameboard, as standard CIE practice, in the 1980s - plus, in this case, a PW train.

[Tobin]

On 31/3/2020 at 12:49 PM, Edo said:

Bagnalstown to Palace East and Macmine to New Ross never got the Dual language ones either - english only.....not sure about New Ross - prob didnt as it was Goods only after 64.

Ps - Bagnalstown did as it remains part of the network.

Incorrect about the North Wexford line: Macmine Junction, Chapel, Rathgarogue, New Ross and Glenmore all received GSR bi-lingual signs.

I'm not sure about the Bagnalstown-Palace East line but Palace did only have DSER english only signs.

From my knowledge, most of the stations on the South Wexford line including Waterford retained their GSWR english only signs till updated with the white signs. Not Sure about Rosslare Strand, Harbour or Pier.

Kilrane retained its GSWR english only sign till closure.

Woodenbridge Junction possibly had english only till closure.

Tara Street and George's Quay was english only till updated till the white signs.

Arklow kept its DSER english only sign above the station exit well into the 80s (albeit painted black letters on white board)

Greystones and Delgany had a GSR bi-lingual sign also well into the 80s

Other stations to definitely receive GSR bi-lingual signs: Edermine Ferry, Enniscorthy, Ferns, Inch(Possibly, my memory is a blur), Avoca, Rathdrum, Rathnew, Wicklow, Greystones and Delgany, Bray. All stations on the Harcourt Line. Killiney and Ballybrack, Dalkey, Sandycove and Glasthule, Dun Laoghaire, Blackrock, Liffey Junction.

Not sure about terminal stations such as Harcourt Street, Amiens Street, Kingsbridge and Westland Row but Amiens Street did gave a GSR bi-lingual sign on the signal cabin.

[jhb171achill]

I think Harcourt St did have GSR bilingual. I knew about Macmine, but not some of those others you mention - interesting, shows that there quite a few variations.

When I explored Woodenbridge in the 1970s, there was an old sign inside the then-disused building. I saw it through the window - too big to retrieve! It was a DSER one, so unless Woodenbridge had a GSR on the other platform, then it remained original till closure.

[minister_for_hardship]

I actually met the gentleman that owns the Liffey Junction GSR board once, he got it out of the canal where it had been dumped.

[jhb171achill]

1 minute ago, minister_for_hardship said:

I actually met the gentleman that owns the Liffey Junction GSR board once, he got it out of the canal where it had been dumped.

He was lucky it survived - an enamel surface on a steel sheet!

I’d love to have that one!

[minister_for_hardship]

On 31/03/2020 at 12:39 PM, jhb171achill said:

 

What about Wisht Caaark? Certainly a lot of their stations never got GSR enamels.

 

Ones that got them; Albert Quay, Ballinhassig, Crossbarry, B'neen & E'keen, Bandon, Clon Jct, Skeaf, Creagh, Drimoleague, Dunmanway, Bantry.

[Westcorkrailway]

4 minutes ago, minister_for_hardship said:

Ones that got them; Albert Quay, Ballinhassig, Crossbarry, B'neen & E'keen, Bandon, Clon Jct, Skeaf, Creagh, Drimoleague, Dunmanway, Bantry.

Im aware that At least skeaf and drimoleagie survived. Clon junction has a replica one but to be fair there is probobly plenty more i dont know about

[minister_for_hardship]

1 hour ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Im aware that At least skeaf and drimoleagie survived. Clon junction has a replica one but to be fair there is probobly plenty more i dont know about

Clon jct had a painted one or at least it looked that way to me, not the new one seen by the station site. The original is still around I believe.

Creagh is around as well, in bad shape though.

Edited March 27, 2021 by minister_for_hardship

[Westcorkrailway]

3 minutes ago, minister_for_hardship said:

Clon jct had a painted one or at least it looked that way to me, not the new one seen by the station site. The original is still around I believe.

Creagh is around as well, in bad shape though.

The origional one snapped on half and was recently removed.....god knows what happened to it 

 

Not a gsr sign but waterfall is also still at halfway vintage club

[Galteemore]

They are such iconic things, those GSR signs, that just shout Free State/Eire at you. Like a green pillar box, they somehow symbolise something of our complex history...why is Mise Eire playing in my head now ?

Edited March 27, 2021 by Galteemore

[jhb171achill]

And you've got the "old" post office green too!

For scenery nerds, I am unsure when the current lighter green came into play - 1970s?

I'll need one of those pillar boxes myself - you seem to only be able to get them in packs of half a dozen....

[minister_for_hardship]

32 minutes ago, Westcorkrailway said:

The origional one snapped on half and was recently removed.....god knows what happened to it 

 

Not a gsr sign but waterfall is also still at halfway vintage club

The house was sold recently.

[minister_for_hardship]

1 hour ago, jhb171achill said:

And you've got the "old" post office green too!

For scenery nerds, I am unsure when the current lighter green came into play - 1970s?

I'll need one of those pillar boxes myself - you seem to only be able to get them in packs of half a dozen....

Wall boxes and the smaller kind of postbox that straps to a telegraph pole are more common than pillar boxes outside of cities.

[Tobin]

10 hours ago, Westcorkrailway said:

Im aware that At least skeaf and drimoleagie survived. Clon junction has a replica one but to be fair there is probobly plenty more i dont know about

Signs for Skeaf and Edermine Ferry are saved together with an assortment of other signs like Waiting Room etc. I'm not sure where but I have seen a photo somewhere.

[DiveController]

Theres a painted sign at the Ballinhassig platform now on private property, not the original, not sure what happened to that

[Westcorkrailway]

On 10/9/2021 at 8:08 PM, DiveController said:

Theres a painted sign at the Ballinhassig platform now on private property, not the original, not sure what happened to that

At least one of every nameboard on the West Cork seems to have survived except for Bandon. Who’s enamel sign was last seen on the floor of the goods platform in Albert quay circa:1965, who knows where they ended up….(probobly in Todd Andrews attic ) 

 

even the kinsale sign survived into preservation…..Unfortunatly Ballymartle (which never got a GSR sign and was made of wood) rot to peices. There is a possibility that the metal letters though survive in a certain mans railway collection….

 

 

Edited February 5, 2023 by Westcorkrailway

[jhb171achill]

Was Kinsale’s a GSR sign? If so it would have been very new….

[Westcorkrailway]

1 minute ago, jhb171achill said:

Was Kinsale’s a GSR sign? If so it would have been very new….

Christ no not at all! As much as the GSR gave signs to doomed lines like passage and muskerry. As far as I know none went on the kinsale branch 

 

however I do know that an unused sign exists that was supposed to go up in waterfall (I believe GSR style)  which had CBSCR signs till the end 

[jhb171achill]

Update here; Headhunters Railway Museum in Enniskillen has a number of very clean GSR enamels from (or for) doors - bilingual “Waiting Room”, “Gentlemen” etc.