Mol_PMB

A lovely photo from Ernie showing an up railcar set on the West Cork lines, hauling a cattle wagon as tail traffic: Note that this is a vac-braked cattle wagon so could legitimately run at the back of the train without a brake van. One doesn't often see photos of tail lamps on goods wagons, but this is a nice example. The leading railcar is a Bulleid wedgehead, identifiable by its body and roof profile.

Super photos as ever! Thank you. I particularly like the last one with tail traffic on the railcar set. The (distant) leading car is a Bulleid wedgehead.

I have spent all day making the backscene, and it's still not finished. How hard can it be to cut a piece of board!? This backscene is a complex shape though, with a step in it along the length, and a curved corner at one end. I decided I needed to make it at this stage and trial-fit to help confirm the exact dimensions of the buildings and to decide a few other issues. For now, I will probably arrange for it to be screwed in place so that it can be removed in case modifications are needed as the build progresses. I also want to seal the board properly, hopefully to reduce warping problems. Eventually it will be fixed permanently. Here is a back view. Note how one of the fiddle yard tracks is tucked partly under the main part of the backscene - this allows me to make the scenic side an inch wider. Here is a front view. The step in the lower part will be concealed by buildings on this side. The angled section on the right hand side will partly conceal the sector plate. This shows how the buildings sit over the top of the step in the backscene and conceal it. I haven't yet done the mockups for the buildings at the near end - I needed to get the backscene made so I could work out the dimensions in this area. At present, the right-hand end looks a bit unsatisfactory, with a 'letterbox' in the backscene. The building behind the tracks will conceal part of that, as well as the awkward interface in the corner. In front of the tracks at this end I'll put in another small panel to minimise the width of the letterbox. Then I will have a few large trees and some undergrowth in the front corner as a view blocker so that the remaining hole in the backscene isn't so visible. There really was a group of trees in this spot, and I hope their height will balance the height of the mill buildings at this end. I have splashed out on some trees from Primo, but they haven't arrived yet. https://primomodels.co.uk/category/deciduous-autumn I may also have a go at painting some more trees on the angled part of the backscene. I'll need to practice on some scrap first, and work out the best approach. I did this on my Swiss layout and it was quite effective, but Spruce trees are a bit easier to paint than deciduous!

I confess I had my tongue in cheek with the 0-6-4+4-6-0 Garratt suggestion - I was thinking along the lines of using common parts with the conventional Beyer Peacock locos on the SLNCR. I hadn't realised there actually was an SLNCR Garratt design sketched out. A 2-6-0+0-6-2 would make a lot more sense technically, but undoubtedly more powerful than was needed. That's made me wonder whether a wide-firebox Garratt would have have been a better bet than Bulleid's design, for the turf-burner brief. Anyway, better get back to East Anglia. Sorry for the digression.

I am very much looking forward to the Manchester show. I’ll keep an eye out for it.

Many thanks John, that’s very comprehensive and helpful. I shall joint my concrete panels accordingly. Going off at a tangent, do you know what that little tank wagon 254A carried?

Indeed. I can picture a modified traction engine pottering along the SLNCR with a few cattle trucks much more easily that I can visualise an 0-6-4+4-6-0 articulated monster!

I never knew the origin of the name. Fascinating! The advantage of a Garrett locomotive over a Garratt locomotive is the much smaller size of layout required.

An excellent talk, thanks to Leslie for publicising and Roger for the talk itself. Sorry I wasn’t there in person, but rest assured I do attend my local Manchester meetings and I may even have had my arm twisted to give a talk next year.

Sounds like an amazing space! Speaking as someone who has started a lot of overambitious layouts and finished few, I would recommend building a module at a time to start with, whilst keeping a grand plan in mind that they will eventually fit into. Don’t try and build 20 baseboards at the start.

A little postscript to my previous notes on the tar tank wagons built by or for CIE. I was having another look through the GNR wagon diagram book today (available to purchase as a pdf from the IRRS) and I've realised that the GNR had some tar tanks as well, some of which were inherited by CIE (and others by UTA). So for completeness I'll describe them briefly. GNR wagon diagrams 56 and 56A show 'Creosote or Tar Tank Car' and are dated 1940 and 1950 respectively. Both show vehicles that are outwardly similar in appearance though with small dimensional differences. They are converted steam loco tenders, retaining their 6-wheel underframe, but fitted with a wagon-style lever handbrake accessible from the ground. The body appears to comprise part of the original tender body, extended upwards into taller rectangular tank. Their capacity is in the range 3425 to 3725 gallons, so a bit larger than the biggest of the cylindrical tanks described above. The laden weight was up to 33 tons (on 3 axles, of course). A total of 5 are listed, the first three were built as engineers' wagons in 1940 but two were transferred to traffic stock in 1950, at which point two more were built for traffic. 'old plate number' 42, engineers # 8192, remained with the engineers. 'old plate number' 48, engineers # 8193, traffic # 6025, went to CIE 'old plate number' 35, engineers # 8194, traffic # 6026, went to UTA 'old plate number' 39, traffic # 6027, went to UTA 'old plate number' 40, traffic # 6028, went to CIE The diagrams (which I can't reproduce here) are well-dimensioned and also show the livery details. The underframes are of the inside spring type of the 1890s, but I haven't been able to work out exactly which type of tender they were. I've no idea how long they lasted in service, but noting their large capacity and the growing need for tar tank wagons in the 1950s, I suspect they ran for a few years with CIE. I'm now wondering where I might find a spare old GNR tender. Having said that, I don't think any of the GNR loco kits include a sufficiently old tender. So far I have failed to find any photos of them. Has anyone else seen one? This photo from Ernie shows a similar type of tender, unconverted. The diagram indicates that the coal rails and flared top were removed, and the plain rectangular tank extended upwards by a couple of feet.

That looks very nice indeed. I didn't get one in John's recent sales push, on the basis that I had no need for a horsebox and it was a bit of an old prototype. Now my FOMO is making me wish I had! At least I've got a 650 class to build. Which is also something I don't really need and isn't very appropriate for my model location. But never mind!

A quick Flickr search produced these: https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/53813368993/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/51051528111/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/49458836682/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/53511735395/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/51370098550/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/50604223122/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishswissernie/52693318587/ https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/54251552989/ I searched for CIE 532, MGWR 532 and GSR 532. Note that some of them are in the IRRS archive so can only be seen by members.

652 and 658 were withdrawn in 1954, which may rule them out depending on your preferred date. You have a CIE buffet car in the train, built around 1953/4. Your G2 model is the Belpaire version. Boilers were swapped between locos from time to time, but in the mid to late 1950s the following locos had round-top fireboxes and can therefore be excluded: 651 654 655 658 661 662 663 665 657 had a much larger tender of different appearance, probably from another class of loco. Potentially that leaves a shortlist of locos that broadly match the model's appearance: 650 653 656 659 660 664 666 667 668 By this stage of their lives, every loco was different in minor details, although the Belpaire-boilered ones had more in common than the round-top. Some of these differences were the shape of the front of the tender, the cabside details, arrangements of pipes and handrails on the boiler, and the boiler fittings such as chimney, dome and safety valve bonnet. These minor differences may be more easily overlooked than the shape of the firebox. I have put together a list of photo links of the G2 class. Let me know of you would like a copy.

More progress with the mock-up buildings. I'm afraid that even with computer-aided toys, my progress at rough mock-ups is far slower than Darius's construction of complete finished buildings! This is definitely proving a useful exercise. With few absolute dimensions to work with, and photos from a limited range of angles, making the mock-ups helps me to see how the buildings fit together and whether the proportions look anything like the photos of the real thing. I've already identified some dimensional tweaks that are needed, but I feel I'm creating the right atmosphere. The 141 has yet to be re-gauged - it's sitting on the checkrails which are at 17mm gauge.

I've got a fair bit to do as well, representing tracks set in concrete. I'd also welcome ideas. My current plan is to use 1.5mm card just below the level of the rail tops, paint it pale grey and dust on talcum powder to give a bit of texture. Other ideas welcome!

At the very least. the new announcement from Accurascale is likely to provide a ready source of cheap secondhand 08s!

It's a class 10, so you may be looking in the wrong list? They were mostly based on the Eastern Region. Grantham / Peterborough area for this one, it seems.

I tend to agree, use the standard 08 chassis and overlook the small dimensional differences. If IRM don't do a D class body, there would definitely be scope for a 3D printed body to fit an 08 chassis. Whilst there weren't many of them, I think they would be popular in the absence of other Irish shunters.

The photos above are at Inchicore as the first D class was being built, hopefully one day the Accuragronk will spawn an Irish variant? https://irishrailwaymodeller.com/topic/1540-d301-class/

"Where on earth are we going to fit the Accurathrash speaker in here?"

The end framing is early GSWR in style, with a single vertical timber rib on the upper half, then a horizontal iron bar and a horizontal timber, then two vertical ribs on the lower half. This arrangement was used on both covered vans and cattle wagons: https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/53508875896 https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/53507783407 https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/53511622704 https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/53499200135 The sides are confusing, partly because of their poor condition. Looking at the timbers it's had to tell what has vanished, and what was never there in the first place. And indeed what may have been added/modified during its life on the ground. However, the presence of a vertical rib as highlighted in your last photo suggests it's not a cattle wagon.

On closer inspection, is it actually the long-lost last surviving cattle wagon in Ireland? (all pics from Ernie). @jhb171achill, are you looking for another retirement project? This would look grand at Cultra! There were also covered vans with those tiebars, but the side framing of the grounded body looks more like the cattle wagon variant. Here are a couple of the covered vans:

Many thanks for the advice, John. It's good to know of the pitfalls with certain makes of wheel. I've had a look at Ultrascale, but their website is currently down and there doesn't even seem to be a way of getting on the waiting list. Even the GW quartering jig is only available on back-order with a considerable lead time! Fortunately, quartering a 4-coupled loco is easier than a 6-coupled one. Phoenix do seem to have the right sizes, which is a good start. That seems to be the best available option. Having spent 20 years modelling in 7mm scale, with the ready availability of Slaters wheels having all those advantages, I have been really surprised to find that in the much more popular 4mm scale, getting hold of decent wheels is such a challenge. I see that Scale Link are retiring in March 2026 and their range of Romford/Markits types is also being run down with many sizes unavailable. The wheel/rail standards I'm working with are 21.0mm gauge, 19.2mm back-to-back, 19mm across checkrail faces. On the wagons and loco I've built so far, I'm using EM profile wheels with a 2.3mm tyre width (compared to 2.8mm on the IRM wagon wheels). This seems to work. With a steam loco I've got the old challenge of the overscale tyre width in the splashers. When looking at the wheels available online it's often unclear what the tyre width is. But it looks like the Sharman ones are reasonably fine. Thanks to all for your advice. I'll get there eventually!

That's an old one! The horizontal metal tiebars would suggest around 1900, I think.