Mol_PMB

This sounds like a great plan, and it's good to set down some clear goals. I'm excited to see how this develops. Heavy duty trackbed construction is a good idea for a more permanent layout - you can use things like concrete lintels and fenceposts laid flat to give a strong and flat trackbed. If you're going to feature water (and I would recommend it, I really enjoyed making my garden pond and watching it develop) then this needs to be planned at an early stage and you might do well to get most of the heavy digging done before the tracklaying.

I'm sorry, it's too late! I only bought 3 corrugated wagons, and I've now converted all of them. I didn't take a side-by-side photo, the best I can offer is this one from earlier in the thread: However, if you can be patient, I have increased my H van order to 6 wagons, so I'll have plenty of them to show comparisons. Having now trawled through the wagons in the IRRS archive, I now think there are a total of 6 buffer types used on the triangulated wagon underframes: Small buffers with two ribs each side (this is the type fitted by IRM) Small buffers with one rib each side Small buffers with two ribs each side, on spacer block (green vans only) Small buffers with one rib each side, on spacer block (green vans only) Large buffers (this is the type I'm approximating with the Hornby loco buffers) Very long large buffers with step on top The one at Maam Cross has the second-largest type. (thanks for the pics BTW) I think some wagons were built with the first, second and fifth types, the others were later modifications. I plan to modify two of the H vans to former green vans with the buffer spacers, one van with the normal body type (in brown) and one of a Palvan type (in grey), as I have found evidence that some survived into those liveries. It would be great if IRM could produce some spare bits! At the moment I am working on weathering the three corrugated opens, but there's a lot more to do yet.

Sadly it's very rare to see an Alligator box here in Manchester these days. Plenty of those shocking pink ONEs though. I do own one of these though!

I do love a MOL container. Got my name all over it

Skills can be leant with practice, and over time you can build up a collection of tools and equipment too. When I first started modelling Irish railways I wasn’t skilled enough, but over time I’ve developed my skills. It can be very satisfying! Let me know if you would be interested in more details of how I’ve done anything shown here

Thanks! It's a tiny layout so it's easy to make good progress. It turns out that I didn't make enough gorse bushes. I'll have to cultivate some more!

I was able to line up and refit the old buffers fairly well. I fitted the guides first and then put in the sprung heads. On one of them the sprung head tends to stick in when compressed, but the others are all fine. I'm reasonably happy with the result. I'm considering changing the brake gear on this wagon, to the alternative 4-shoe type fitted to some of the corrugated wagons. But to do that I'll need some parts from the H van underframes which won't be here for a while. So for now it can keep the standard brakes. I then tackled the third wagon, and managed to salvage all the old buffers and replace them with the larger Hornby ones, the same process I used on the first wagon except that I now have a stock of spare IRM buffers for future conversions. Here are the three wagons together on the photo plank. Tomorrow when I have daylight again, I'll make a start on the weathering of these three wagons.

I've now got access to the IRRS photo archive and while I cannot post any photos here, they have enabled me to spot something I had missed before. Apart from the colour, there was another difference with the green vans. They had their buffers spaced away from the headstocks by a few inches. This was to suit the screw couplings that were fitted, which are longer than normal 3-link couplings. The spacers look more complex than a simple block, and may have included some extra resilience. This is very clear on the IRRS photo of three of the 'pallet van' door versions (including 18828) but can also be seen on the green van partly hidded by Sambo here: Normal vac braked H vans had instanter couplings and the buffers mounted directly on the headstock.

This photo also from Ernie shows a rake of 3 with the Y-shaped protrusions (plus a 4th in the shed), and a taller container of some sort too: From Jonathan Allen, 3 of the early non-ISO 20' keg cages. Only the middle one is on a 25436 series flat, I have yet to positively identify the other flat wagons here: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/49750786666 Again from Jonathan Allen, an overhead view of the non-ISO 20' keg cages: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/44785081805

Now, the first post dealt with the half-height 20' containers with ISO fittings, but they were preceded by a non-ISO type, during the transition from the old wooden containers to the standardised ones. ISO standards for dimensions, strength and corner fittings were only developed in the mid 1960s and several organisations (including BR Freightliner) initially used non-standard fittings. CIE did too, they were different again. Here are a couple of images of the first type of 20' half-height container. Note the lack of ISO corner fittings, and an internal numbering system rather than the ISO international standard. From Brian Flannigan, the Y-shaped protrusions on this would enable stacking: From Ernie, this one's lacking the Ys: The 25436-25982 series wagons were built in 1966 to carry these containers, and other pre-ISO 20' boxes. They mostly had plain bearings, and had a solid floor with non-ISO corner restraints. The solebars looked very 'busy' because there were trays for storing chains, and protruding chain eyes. These were used to secure a variety of non-standard containers. There's one more hiding behind a corrugated wagon in this photo from Pete Robins. Like the adjacent cages, it's loaded with kegs. It might be worth considering these early keg cages in a subsequent post.

Here are some detail photos of these unusual half-height open top ISO containers, mostly dumped late in life. They include a selection of legible serial numbers. Using a selection of Jonathan Allen photos from Flickr, we can see them in service. This one has a CIE sheet cover lashed over it, it looks like the sheet is specially made for this container type. Just teasing us on the edge of the photo is another one of a slightly different type: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/52050027229 Look closely, and there's one of these containers at Adelaide with a Guinness tank inside it: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51749282528 Here's a couple of them in a short liner at Claremorris: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/50706358862 The one in this train at Moira is also sheeted: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/52899057237

Nice model! At least one of the containers in the background of these Jonathan Allen photos has a legible number panel - CIEU 060369 3 IRL 2208 8 https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51769520243 https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51769522113 https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51768451412/in/album-72177720295407867

A nice closeup side view of the headlights on 156, in this photo from Jonathan Allen: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/46038979472/in/album-72177720295641846 I also found a photo of 160 so fitted. So at least the following 7 locos: 002, 154, 155, 156, 158, 159, 160.

Excellent work - it's always frustrating to pull apart things that were 'finished' but I'm sure it will be worth it for the improved reliability.

I agree. If you look at my second photo in the first post of the thread you can also see the lagging there, where a quarter of the outer cladding is missing. Originally, they seem to have been intended for tar and bitumen, which would have been loaded hot. On the sixth photo on my first post, just under the wording 'no naked flame' I think those two pipe fittings would have connected to a steam-heating coil within the tank. So if the train took too long to reach its destination and the tar 'set', you could liquify it again with steam.

I made a start on the second corrugated wagon tonight, and experimented to see if I could remove the buffers without destroying them, so that I could re-use them but positioned at the correct spacing. After a few false starts I think I am getting somewhere with this. This is the technique I used. First, use a tiny jewellers' screwdriver to push the buffer head out from the rear. If you have enough hands you can pull on the other end too. When it comes out, try not to lose the buffer head or the tiny spring. Then insert a piece of 2mm diameter tube or rod into the front of the buffer guide. Wiggle it around gently, and hopefully the buffer guide will come loose from the headstock: I then added some plastic strip to the outer edge of the moulded buffer base, and when that was stuck well I sanded down the faces. I marked the new holes (25mm centres) and drilled them. However, there was quite a recess where the old buffer holes were, so I inserted some 1mm plastic rod with a dab of filler round it. I'm waiting for that to set before I sand it down flush. The back of the buffers will need to be smoothed off too, before I glue them back on. If I can make this work, then it should also work on the H vans and I might be tempted to order some more!

The ballast stuck well, and so this afternoon I gave the track a light airbrushing to blend in the colours. Then I set to work with the static grass machine. I started with some patches of dark green, the same as I used on the gorse bushes, and the bushes themselves will be planted in these areas so the under-layer of dark green gives them a bit more depth. Then I covered almost all the rest in a paler green grass, leaving just a few gaps where I'll put some other type of bush or bramble. This now needs the glue to set overnight before I hoover off the excess and start applying localised additions of different coloured grass and flock. Anyway, it's starting to look the part now that it's not entirely brown!

Ah, many thanks John. I had got the impression from this thread that you had ceased production, and the website is down too. https://irishrailwaymodeller.com/topic/16213-last-orders/ Are your models 21mm-friendly? What do you still have available or to order?

Nearest I've found so far for your coal containers, they appear to come in several variants and different liveries! https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51699006747 https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51699802461

A nice rake of six cut-down wagons, with one unmodified one as well, in this 1979 photo from Jonathan Allen on Flickr: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/50768030252 Most have had a repaint in NIR pale grey, but a couple are still in bauxite.

Regarding the nearly-black livery of the H van in this photo of Ernie's that we discussed before: Here's another photo, also at Cork Albert Quay, which also shows a van in nearly-black livery, but this time we can see all of it, lower left. It has a green snail. There are also a couple more in nearly-black, on the distant right of the image. They are very much darker than the normal 'dark grey' which can be seen on some other wagons in the photo. I wonder if this nearly-black livery was a West Cork thing? Maybe they had some steam loco paint left over? At first glance they all look like an H vans but on closer inspection the nearer van is one of the earlier batch on a conventional (non-triangulated) underframe, in the 17012-17211 series built in 1946. The long brake lever and the lack of a plate below the door help to identify it. Like these two (also from Ernie): Incidentally, one of these would provide an interesting variation for a model - perhaps an IRM H van body on a conventional chassis. Which would free up a triangulated underframe to go under a palvan. Hmmm...

Definitely. 'Rails Through Tipperary' page 24 shows a later view from the same angle.

Some more photos of these tank containers, from Jonathan Allen on Flickr. They're mostly in the background but if you click on the links and then zoom in, a lot of detail is visible including lettering variations and numbers: https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51572604289 https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51571111947 https://www.flickr.com/photos/152343870@N07/51571921546

In the first photo, as well as the ubiquitous vans, there's a nice tar/bitumen tank in the background. These were numbered 23801-23890 and delivered in 1953/54. They had a 'British' underframe length of 17'6" rather than the Irish standard of 16'11". Also the flat wagon in the left foreground is interesting, with its low sides, some of these are seen in this photo from the National Library of Ireland on Flickr, mixed in with other types of flat wagon:

Sounds like a good plan to me - there’s no other reasonable approach short of a total scratchbuild. Paint them the right colour and put appropriate containers in, of course. CPWs are much later than my interests but I do recall the lengthy saga of their introduction. I look forward to seeing the results! Mol