David Holman

Nice one. Plenty of ideas to play with there, John.

Sorry we couldn't oblige, Leslie!

Privileged to meet Richard once, at the Manchester Show, the Christmas before he died. We ran his SLNCR Lissadel on my Arigna Town layout (there are photos in the layouts section here if you scroll down far enough) and I am now the proud owner of his WL&W 0-6-0 Shannon as well as a Terry McDermott kit of a 101 class that he never got round to building. Prolific modeller and lovely man. His layout designs very much focussed on the 'less is more' concept, but were also very much about prototype working practice. An internet search of Castle Rackrent will give lots of pictures.

Starting to recover from Allypally - it was a great weekend, but shows at large venues are really hard work! AP is a fine venue, with lots of space and height, so it is not as stuffy as many shows, where you often have no idea what the weather is like outside. However, Cultra is very much the best in my experience, not least because of the surroundings... The best part of the weekend was catching up with so many folk we'd not seen over the last couple of years and it was lovely to see a fair few from this forum, plus Mick from Ballyconnel Road too, with pictures of his latest 3mm scale loco. Special mention to Galteemore and his son Tim for all their help on Sunday. Operating a terminus-fiddle yard railway all day demands a lot of care and concentration, especially with just the three of us. There wasn't a great deal of time off compared to Saturday, when there were five operators. Their help was invaluable at the end too. Fintonagh can be dismantled in 5 minutes, but AllyPally, while vast, is a nightmare to get way from, especially as some of the stewards are more than a bit 'jobs worth'. It took me nearly half an hour just to get my car from the car park, then it was a case of carrying the layout and equipment down three flights of stairs. Yes there are two goods lifts, but that would have taken even longer, with all the other stands trying to get out of just three exits. My shopping was limited to just some A1 sheets of plasticard from Eileen's. Like all oil related products though, this stuff is getting ever more expensive. However also got two new books and am already enjoying Rails Through Tipperary. The other is a new one by Giles Flavell on Radio Controlled Models. Giles is well known for his 7mm scale working cranes and lorries, but there is a section on locos too. Whether I'll understand it all, let alone replicate anything is another matter, but you never know...

Here are the track plans from the back two pages of the Freezer Booklet '60 Plans for Small Railways'. As you can see, most are 1.8 x 0.3m [6'x1' in old money], though one is about the same length as your proposal. Fairly sure they use Peco 60cm radius points. The short plan uses Y points though - something well worth considering as they are great space savers. Where possible though, it helps running quality to arrange points as a ladder, avoiding that reverse curve which is causing the problems. One thought is to have the turntable accessed from the middle siding, via a diamond over the track to the front siding. However, might be worth considering moving the turntable to form part of the run round loop, as below: There were several examples of this in Ireland, Foynes for one and each end of the Waterford & Tramore another. Harcourt St too, I think. My sketch is one of many attempts to redraw Castle Rackrent, Richard Chown's legendary 7mm broad gauge layout from the 1970s. Putting the turntable here saves a lot of space, because two points and the headhunt will occupy over 60cm of space in 4mm scale, whereas the turntable will only need 30cm at the most. Mine is drawn for 7mm scale, but am sure you can play around with it to suit your own ideas. The two middle points are both Y format. Hope that helps!

Splendid! Have relations in Vancouver and on the Island & their houses very much echo what you describe. If only...

Love the American walk around concept, but all too often there isn't the space this side of the pond. That said, the Rev Edward Beal once wrote that he didn't think 20x20 feet was particularly large as a layout room - his house had several that size! Something to do with living in a rambling Edwardian or Victorian vicarage no doubt. He had some interesting ideas for the time though - must dig out a few.

Certainly is. Super work, Ken.

Tasty!

Very much agree, especially as I now have stock to cover two eras, 1900s & 1950s, on my projects. Seems that on both sides of the water, infrastructure didn't change much over the years until more recent modernisation. Over here though a repaint was often the precursor to closure on many branch line stations.

Certainly is! Been wondering how things were going, so great to hear some news.

I do like a good fitted freight!

Fascinating, thanks John. I guess the same sort of thing applies to the peninsula on the east side of Strangford Lough, down to Portaferry, or even to Strangford from Downpatrick on the other side. But then this was Belfast and County Down territory, not the wealthiest, one thinks. Likewise Kilkeel, an obvious extension from Rostrevor. Would make a nice Dundalk, Greenore and Newry model, stocked with LNWR locos and coaches, of course.

Fictitious sources of traffic for model railways have included treacle mines and even a factory that produced the holes for toothbrush handles, but seems there is also a large ketchup refinery in Ireland that I didn't know about!

I'm afraid not. Was comparing my Irish road atlas with my railway one (the Hajducki version) and wondering about towns like Belmullet and Louisburgh. Like as not, their populations would have been well below 5000 in 1900, though but for the famine and subsequent migration, it might have been a different picture. Comparing maps, it also throws up the question of why certain lines stopped where they did (money and/or geography no doubt). Ardara in particular, for having gone to the trouble of building the line to Glenties, why stop there instead of continuing on the the coast, just a few miles further on? Have long thought it would make a fine Donegal 'might have been'. There are also several isolated mineral railways that, in my world at least, offer the opportunity to outside connections, like the one between Bundoran and Sligo in the West and at Annalong in the east. That said, there are plenty of real places to play with too, of course.

Good stuff folks, this is just the sort of thing I was hoping might develop. There are clearly many might have been and adaptations to be explored, but here's an interesting one: What is the largest town in Ireland never to have a railway? And should that be in terms of present day or, say, 1900 population?

Could well be this one, from Cyril Freezer's book of small track plans, first published in 1960. My copy dates to 1971 and cost me 17p! It's actually a nice plan, offering plenty of operational potential, though the curves are very tight at just 18" radius. As Cyril said on several occasions, many of his plans would benefit if the was a foot of extra space all round. These days, we'd probably want at least two feet and even then the radius would only be 30".

Thought it was - the small hole in the side to access the sandbox filler is the give away - or, like a Midland Jinty, is it really where the key to the clockwork motor goes? Nice bit of scratchbuilding too!

Fantastic - thanks for sharing this, Ken. Have been pondering RC on and off for a while, even if only doing a few locos, so that there would always be something to run in a crisis. Has happened to me twice, albeit in over 100 shows - once when a dead short caused a total shutdown for almost and hour and recently when I took Belmullet out and a dodgy controller plug ruined most of the morning on the first day. Getting all the stuff into a 7mm loco ought to be easier than with a small 4mm loco, though am wondering if some of the items need to be bigger, to cope with the larger size/weight? That said,a Mashima 1833 motor gearbox only draws about 0.25 of an amp and my one amp Gaugemaster handheld controller is adequate for all my locos. Definitely something to consider, after all and average exhibition day is about 7 hours, so a mix of conventional and battery power could easily cover that, plus allowing a second/third loco to run without extra wiring. Yes, DCC, does that but have found I just don't get on with it. Fine looking J26 too!

And then there is Courtmacsherry, for me t h e perfect branch terminus in all sorts of ways, not least the way the town provides the backscene and the loco shed hides the hole in the sky to the fiddle yard. Quite long though, as Andy's splendid recreation shows, but then a bit of pruning and rename it Port Macsherry and it becomes doable even in 7mm scale, especially given much of the stock to run on it is available from Alphagraphix.

Indeed, though if I did the BCR, then I'd probably do Lydham Heath. Minimal, to say the least, but a reversing point, so reasonable activity. 7mm scale, radio controlled battery power, to enable a decent depth of weeds in the track. Plus the iconic Carlisle, of course. Find me an excuse for a similar loco to have run in Ireland and I'd be very tempted to build it in broad gauge. That said, Barry Norman has already done Lydham Heath in S - and very fine it is too.

I don't know about anyone else, but I often get inspired to create model track plans, even though I know they will never get built. Almost a case of exorcism, give that time and resources are inevitably finite... Anyway, among several others, Angus's latest posts on layout planning set me thinking that perhaps a dedicated ideas thread might be of interest and hopefully generate a bit of discussion. There are plenty of books on layout planning of course & I've certainly bought a few over the years, but it strikes me that, while on the one hand, Irish track plans are not that dissimilar to British ones, they tend to have their own specific features [like almost every terminus having a turntable], not to say a few peculiarities too. Trains having to reverse out of the terminus being one, as in the case of the Clifden branch out of Galway or the Schull line out of Skibbereen. So, here might be a good place to share some favourites. In additional, there are also factors, as discussed in Angus's thread about what actually works as a design - both from an operational and/or visual point of view. Scale is another, for we all have a finite amount of space to work in, while shunting layouts are probably better suited to medium and larger scales. Also, what you you want from your model railway? Some of us, me included, are more interested in building things [and creating as realistic a scene as possible], than operating, a reason why Iain Rice & Bob Barlow's magnificent Orford Quay has always inspired. Just look at those winter trees, for example. So, to get things rolling, here are a couple of thoughts. Rice's take on Westport Quay has been mentioned recently, so below we have the approximate layout, plus his adaption from his Light Railway's book for a Scottish theme. I really like the little quayside extension's scenic potential and notice how the provision of two sidings there mean you can do some basic shunting in that area. I also like his fishing harbour design, Especially the way the two sidings extend out on to the pier. However, all three designs lack a turntable [ok, Westport Quay didn't have one anyway], but one of many things that can bug me about layout design is where any shunting can end up with the loco and part of the train actually having to go off scene to make it happen. One of the most extreme versions of this is the Barry Norman design below. Very compact and probably really only a diorama, but you would hardly ever see your prized locos on scene. The same could be said for the almost honorary Irish railway, the Bishop's Castle - though few if any Irish lines ever degenerated into the state this line got into. It's a nice track plan and the addition of a turntable would make it very Irish I think, but you do need a decent bit of mainline out of the station to allow all operation to be 'on scene'. Finally, for now, I've thrown in my own Fintonagh track plan, as an example of how you can keep nearly all the action on scene, including a turntable. Note too the siding sneaking off stage left at the front edge. With only two short sidings on scene, this allows for pretty much any sort of additional traffic, without needing to to model that section - a useful dodge I've used many times. Yes, trains are short [just four wagons], but the layout is fully operable and has proven to sustain interest of numerous shows. As an idea, it could easily made larger of course, something that rarely works the other way round. Anyway, hope this starts some worthwhile discussion, as I for one am always interested in new ideas for track plans.

It's competition night at the Chatham Club the week after next, so nothing like a deadline to get something finished! Don't know what other clubs do, but we have five categories: Locos, Coaching Stock, Wagons, Buildings and Miscellaneous. The latter is the one the crane will be going in, which has in the past been won by everything from ships to scenics to road vehicles. Members vote on each others' models and so it is a bit of a lottery, but equally also mainly a bit of fun, so we are hoping for a good turnout after missing the last two years. I've been searching for that little bit extra, in the hope of making the model more believable & managed to find a picture online of how the old Aifix kit had been adapted to have a pseudo 'luffing' arrangement. Hence did a simple copy of this by adding a couple of plastic brackets to the centre of the jib, along with a couple of extra cables [fishing wire], via a pulley on a wire arm, as a means to move the jib up & down separately. None of it actually works, I hasten to add! The rest of the work has been about trying to tone down the plain [primer] grey paint. Did this first with an overall wash of 'Null Oil' [Games Workshop], followed by various applications of weathering powders to give a patina of rust. Being a harbour crane, am assuming the salty air would lead to rapid corrosion. Still need to get the cable to the hook straight. Could be I'll need to swap the fishing line for some sort of thread from the end of the jib. What I haven't been able to work out is how a 12" to the foot version of this crane would have been powered. Safe to assume that steam is very unlikely, so diesel or petrol the best bet. However, the kit doesn't come with with any sort of exhaust pipe, yet if it was electric, where would that source come from? Some dock cranes were hydraulic powered, but they were static. Either way, unlikely anything other than steam power would have been used much before WW1, so the model is only really applicable for after that, it seems.

Fascinating - plus a fine piece from Eoin too. My Railway Altas of Ireland (Hajducki), shows it as Hodgsons Tramway, with gauge at 3'6 Over here in SE England, there were many such tramways, often in obscure gauges like 4'. Aveling and Porter locos predominated - not surprising as they were built in Rochester. Essentially traction engines built to run on rails. I even have a bit of archaeology in the garden wall separating us from our neighbour. The wall itself is breeze block, but every 12' is a vertical post which is a section of flatbottomed rail from a local tramway.

Sounds like the one I have built!