jhb171achill

New laminate coaches and tin vans turned out around 1955-8 were initially unpainted. However, they weathered very badly almost immediately, so by 1959 they were being painted green like everything else. Coaches started being painted black'n'tan in early 1963, after a few experimental ones in '62.

The Derry goods tended to be hauled by 70 class or multiple MPD cars. I never heard of GNR cars doing that....? For obvious reasons, MED cars wouldn't have been there either....

I'd need to check but I'm pretty certain that all Park Royals entered service in green.

I remember seeing a pair of BnT 141s double heading a Westport - Dublin train about 1975, both still in the older livery. Obviously, this involved a white stripe right round. The loco was so filthy - a rare thing then - that the lower orange part on the cabside was completely invisible. A photo would have shown an apparently black loco with just the white bit above. With an A or a C class, the white bit was a sitting target to be covered by filth and gunge!

Both AEC and BUT sets could end up trailing all sorts of interesting stuff behind them. I saw a picture of a two car set at one stage (I think on the DSER) with an 1880s six-wheeler behind it!

Extremely well deserved, gentlemen.

Hope it keeps you seriously busy, Leslie!

Thanks for turning up, Wanderer! Also good to meet Weshty of SSM...

A masterclass in how to do scenery...

I love that full train 70 class set!

Looks astounding despite barely being started!!!!!

There was nothing much for them to do after 1984, a bit like all the stored 201s now, while Korean biscuit tins trundle round on customer trains...... pity passengers and goods are long gone...... Both "C"s will operate on passenger trains on the DCDR once restored fully. C231 is as good as there already.

That's me standing at the bar!

Firstly, many thanks to all who were at Foynes yesterday. Barry and myself greatly appreciated the support and it was good to meet so many people. One of a number of long term future projects would involve sifting through a somewhat eclectic collection of unpublished material, the earliest of which is late 1920s. Much sifting and photoshopping will be required though, as although the raw material is interesting, the quality of the photos varies from the very poor to the adequately good; few are of really high standard!

Surely a 25-35 bogie goods train should be plain elementary. Extend a few loops and get on with it.

I'm dribbling too.....

That, then, was one of two things. (1) Filthy; thus the white bit entirely covered by grime thanks to the filth-spewing Crossley engines. I saw a "C" like that. (2) An absolute one-off - sent into traffic before complete repaint. I'd be more inclined to go for the first - can you put up a photo which might invite comment as to how clean or dirty it was otherwise, thus veering the verdict towards (1) or (2)? An interesting one. If it was Fermoy, it has to be pre-1967, as that's when that line closed. And that was also long pre-re-engining, so Crossley it was.

Very many thanks, Leslie! Looking forward to tomorrow. Next one's now under way!

It's green. Where's the flying snail?

Gone are the days when no two goods trains anywhere had the same consist! Everything's so standard nowadays, it's major news when a passenger train has three coaches instead of four.......!

They would have first appeared in 1963/4. The history of the black'n'tan was broadly as follows. First repaints from green had tan up to waist level. Then all black in one of the variations above, in some cases by degrees with yellow front patches added, others not. Once the 141s arrived, in black'n'tan, a lower tan band, not full height, was gradually added to rebuilt A and c classes, some D, G, and E classes having tan too. By the time the "supertrain" orange and black appeared in 1972, all the "all-blacks" were gone except for the E421 class, none of which carried any form of "supertrain" ever. The Es remained all black until withdrawal of the last in 1986. Between, say, 1964 and 1972, most of the above variations could be seen running concurrently, depending on painting dates.

That's a very nice layout!

Yes, Hurricane, there were two distinctive "all-black" liveries for "A"'s.# First - the livery which the ITG had A39 in from initial preservation until its reincarnation in BnT last year. This was all black, with the number in large numerals on the ends and the centre of the sides. No "roundel". After just a short time, they amended the sides - instead of a plain numeral in the centre, small numerals were put on lower body sides at each end, beside the driver's doors. In place of the large central numeral, a "roundel" (white letters, tan surround) was positioned. In each case, the usual white "flash" above the end cab windows was used, but the white lines didn't continue round the bodysides. It might be nice to see one of the ITG's two "C"'s done like that. It might be added that the "all-black" livery, in several variations, was used as standard between 1963 and about 1967 on all existing pre-GM classes; A, B101, B113, C, D, E and G classes.

It has to be admitted that the number of rails they run on, and the number of wheels and axles, the number of sides, ends and roofs, are 100% accurate!

They are not Cravens. They look nothing like them! They are inaccurately repainted British Railways Mk 1 coaches. The shade of green, lining and "flying snail" CIE logo are the wrong shape, wrong way round, and wrong size. The locomotive is not Irish either, nor like anything which ran here. The livery is farcical. Numerals are the wrong font, size and colour - which should be pale yellow. The logo is the wrong shape, size, and wrong way round. It, too, is the wrong colour. It should be pale green, lined in gold. (Not yellow either, as mistakes often show). Above all the locomotive should not be black! CIE painted their locomotives a dark grey all over. As a toy, it's fine. As a model it's a disaster. Incidentally, there's a salutary story behind the frequently-seen yellow snails on model loco tenders. Never, ever take livery details from preserved vehicles. Errors in accurate liveries are common. In Ireland they are endemic, with every single heritage group having wrongly painted at least some of what they've so carefully and painstakingly restored. When the RPSI first restored two of its locomotives, (461 and 184) it gave them a black livery with a yellow snail. But the black and the yellow were inaccurate. Unfortunately, these have been propagated in many models, a bit like the zebra stripes of black ironwork on the otherwise beautifully restored GNR brake van at Whitehead. On almost all Irish wagons, ironwork colour matched the body colour, as did chassis colour.