Irish / CIE Coal Wagons

[burnthebox]

Hi guys, anyone got any photos of the coal wagons or suggestions as to where I’d get to see some of these that were used here by CIE
TIA

BTB

[Mayner]

There was no specific CIE coal wagon as such.

CIE used its standard wooden bodied and corrugated wagons to carry coal, sugar beet, gypsum and bascially anything (including containers & farm machinery) that could be carried in an open wagon. Both types were used for coal and general traffic up to the mid 1970s. In later years coal was transported in open top ISO containers on flat wagons.

Provincial wagons produce a kit for the corrugated wagon.

Studio Scale Models produce a whitemetal kit of the "Standard Irish" open wagons used by the GSR, GNR & CIE

The Bachmann Branchlines 5 Plank open looks reasonably close to the earlier wooden bodied opens

https://www.hattons.co.uk/60907/bachmann_branchline_37_061c_5_plank_wagon_with_wooden_floor_in_br_grey/stockdetail.aspx#:~:text=*Click the photo above to see a larger picture.

[flange lubricator]

The coal wagons used on the weekly Foynes -Ballina coal /oil train were older 20’ Tso containers with the roofs cut off re purposed to carry  coal painted with grey primer on the inside and black on the outside . 

 

[burnthebox]

Hi guys & many thanks, so would something like this be out of place on an Irish layout, 

BTB

Edited August 17, 2020 by burnthebox
L

[Mayner]

20 hours ago, burnthebox said:

Hi guys & many thanks, so would something like this be out of place on an Irish layout, 

BTB

It passes the two foot rule in that it looks the part from normal viewing distance or in  a train on a layout.

If you want to try your hand at lettering and or weathering there is a nice photo of one of these wagons lightly weathered and with snail loco and a BR van with CIE wheel logo.

http://www.derg.ie/albums/workbench/IMG_5337.jpg

 

[jhb171achill]

23 hours ago, burnthebox said:

Hi guys & many thanks, so would something like this be out of place on an Irish layout, 

BTB

That’s perfect for any Irish layout, BTB. The GNR, GSWR, NCC, UTA, DSER, W & L, MGWR and CIE used these, or ones extremely close to them.

Slightly darker grey all over (use British LMS shade, with marginally lighter for CIE) for both body & chassis, and “flying snail”.

By the 1950s CIE are churning out the corrugated opens at a great rate of knots, so by the 1960s the wooden ones, while still about, are gradually becoming a minority. Despite that, a few survive to get the “roundel” logo, and a smaller number still even manage to get the brown livery after 1970, by which time they are a rarity.

I am unaware of any in traffic after 1973.

The UTA painted some in a reddish-bauxite colour in 1965/6 or thereabouts  for the Courtaulds traffic. A couple survived as ballast wagons with NIR got a few years into the 1970s.

[Ironroad]

On 8/16/2020 at 8:49 PM, Mayner said:

There was no specific CIE coal wagon as such.

CIE used its standard wooden bodied and corrugated wagons to carry coal, sugar beet, gypsum and bascially anything (including containers & farm machinery) that could be carried in an open wagon. Both types were used for coal and general traffic up to the mid 1970s. In later years coal was transported in open top ISO containers on flat wagons.

Provincial wagons produce a kit for the corrugated wagon.

Studio Scale Models produce a whitemetal kit of the "Standard Irish" open wagons used by the GSR, GNR & CIE

The Bachmann Branchlines 5 Plank open looks reasonably close to the earlier wooden bodied opens

https://www.hattons.co.uk/60907/bachmann_branchline_37_061c_5_plank_wagon_with_wooden_floor_in_br_grey/stockdetail.aspx#:~:text=*Click the photo above to see a larger picture.

The containers in the first picture labeled BLMC would seem to belong to the "British Leyland Motor Corporation" and since that company was only formed in Jan 1968 this photograph was probably taken much later than that.

There is a Parkside model that looks to be of the same container (probably just requires the correct livery and decals if possible) that could be used with the Bachmann 5 plank open or similar for a little extra interest.    https://www.hattons.co.uk/322381/parkside_models_pa21_br_bd_container_for_conflat_wagons_plastic_kit/stockdetail.aspx

[Mayner]

1 hour ago, Ironroad said:

The containers in the first picture labeled BLMC would seem to belong to the "British Leyland Motor Corporation" and since that company was only formed in Jan 1968 this photograph was probably taken much later than that.

There is a Parkside model that looks to be of the same container (probably just requires the correct livery and decals if possible) that could be used with the Bachmann 5 plank open or similar for a little extra interest.    https://www.hattons.co.uk/322381/parkside_models_pa21_br_bd_container_for_conflat_wagons_plastic_kit/stockdetail.aspx

The photo may have been taken in the early 1970s,  I remember seeing a photo on a train with BR containers in wooden open wagons (possibly the same) on the Ballina Branch during the early 1970s. Lyons Tea also had similar containers which were also transported in open wagons https://peco-uk.com/products/lyons-tea-container 

I bought a set of Bachmann BD containers as a load for open wagons, but end detail needs to be trimmed back slightly tom fit in an SSM IRCH open, I don't know about the Bachmann or Dapol Opens

https://www.bachmann.co.uk/category/model-railway%2Fbranchline/accessories.

Cable drums would be another good load for an open, CIE transported cable drums for P&T and ESB and parked P&T vehicles and cable drums seem to have been a common feature in CIE goods yards during the 60s and early 70s

[WRENNEIRE]

Any use?

 

[burnthebox]

Hi ya Dave, great photo, very clear, looks almost new..! So is it Irish, & is it C S or G S 

Paul

[jhb171achill]

44 minutes ago, burnthebox said:

Hi ya Dave, great photo, very clear, looks almost new..! So is it Irish, & is it C S or G S 

Paul

G S.

Both the Great Northern Railway and the Great Southern, as well as the GSWR before it, tended to make the letter "G" look like a "C".

This even gave rise to an error in CIE's designation in the early 1960s or ex-GNR railcars, where the GN number was prefixed with a "C" instead of a "G"! Thus, railcar 609 (imaginary number) would become C609N instead of G609N!

If that happened today, we would be screaming about the illiteracy of the "youth of today"..........

And yes, the wagon is new in the picture.

[leslie10646]

The GN had 15 ton coal wagons -

I happen to make them, of course, but not much use for CIE because I suspect that they scrapped any that they inherited - after all they had much more modern wagons.

I have toyed with the idea of doing the RCH six plank open as a kit, having previously done the four plank as a Dapol commission. The GN had lots of them. I haven't got my wagon book to hand so can't say how many.

 

[David Holman]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the main difference between Irish open wagons and those in Britain, the fact that in Ireland, they mostly had 4 or 6 planks, whereas 3, 5 or 7 was common in Britain?

 Now worried I've become a plank counter. Hopefully can get get some cream for it.

[jhb171achill]

4 hours ago, David Holman said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the main difference between Irish open wagons and those in Britain, the fact that in Ireland, they mostly had 4 or 6 planks, whereas 3, 5 or 7 was common in Britain?

 Now worried I've become a plank counter. Hopefully can get get some cream for it.

Take one plank, three times daily before meals, until it’s a flat wagon.....

Do not drive while taking this medication.

[flange lubricator]

On 19/8/2020 at 12:05 AM, Mayner said:

The photo may have been taken in the early 1970s,  I remember seeing a photo on a train with BR containers in wooden open wagons (possibly the same) on the Ballina Branch during the early 1970s. Lyons Tea also had similar containers which were also transported in open wagons https://peco-uk.com/products/lyons-tea-container 

I bought a set of Bachmann BD containers as a load for open wagons, but end detail needs to be trimmed back slightly tom fit in an SSM IRCH open, I don't know about the Bachmann or Dapol Opens

https://www.bachmann.co.uk/category/model-railway%2Fbranchline/accessories.

Cable drums would be another good load for an open, CIE transported cable drums for P&T and ESB and parked P&T vehicles and cable drums seem to have been a common feature in CIE goods yards during the 60s and early 70s

Great picture on the IRRS twitter feed of one of the smaller Lyons Tea container

Irish Railway Archives (Ciarán Cooney) (@irishrailways) / Twitter