J15 170 Gauge O Upgrades

murrayec · January 21, 2021

Here is another project on the workbench at the moment, a Gauge O J15 0-6-0 model by John Hamill & Brendan Kelly. It's in the shop for upgrades- wheel weights, brake gear, new electrical pick-up system, a new backhead, a bit of paint, and some small fixes.

The model stripped down, parts being cleaned up and the plan of action being worked out.

The new Slaters backhead kit being assessed.

After a bit of research of photos a cad drawing was prepared of the loco & tender chassis to set up the brakes, wheel weights, pcb pickup plate and loco guard irons. When the drawing was complete the parts were cnc'd out in .5mm brass sheet for most bits except for the brake shoes which were cut from Tufnol, and pick-up plate from .5mm pcb copper clad sheet.

Tender brake shoes n hangers going together, brake rods all cleaned up and holes sized for fitting- the J15 had pull rods on inside and the outside of the wheels which is an interesting challenge to get this to work!

The chassis have been drilled .8mm holes to take brass rods to support the brake hangers, the hangers will fit to the wire with .8mm ID brass tubes which will be removable so that the wheels can be accessed.

The loco chassis made a ringing sound as I was working on it and I eventually tracked it down to one of the wheel bearings not fully soldered in- that's the one with the paint removed ready for re-soldering.

And all the other bits have been cleaned up ready for assembly- hangers, rods, wheel weights, loco brake blocks, and guard irons.

I have somehow misplaced two of the loco brake block which will have to be re-made!!

Eoin

Galteemore · January 21, 2021

Very nice Eoin - lots of scope for you to work your magic! Nice tip - I’d forgotten to look at Slaters for a Belpaire backhead so ended up fabricating my own this week.....should have looked !

Edited January 21, 2021 by Galteemore

murrayec · January 24, 2021

Tender brakes were next, 40mm long x .8mm brass wires with a 6mm .8mm id tubes where soldered into the chassis frames to make the brake hanger spigots. The dinky clips are there to hold the assembly in place while soldering.

Soldered on the inside with the iron held there until the solder wicks through and forms a silver seam around the tube- one then knows the tube is soldered on.

Brake assembly fitted to spigots, rods fitted and again dinky clips to hold in place while rods are soldered.

Done. The hangers are not soldered to the spigots so the brakes can be removed.

Next was the riveting to the loco brake hangers and guard irons.

Here is a tip for this riveting press- a piece of 12/16'' fish tank tube pushed over the handle which makes the riveting process a bit more comfortable.

With the rivets done its time to solder 2.5mm long x .8mm id brass tubes to the top n bottom of the hangers, jigged up with .8mm aluminium wires drilled into the hardwood base.

Done, requiring a bit of clean-up and adjustment of the Tufnol brake blocks to fit.

Wheel weights epoxied, brake blocks epoxied.

Time to fix that loose wheel bearing, the chassis was jigged up with the coupling rods just in case it may go off-line when being soldered.

Soldered on the inside and again the iron held there until the solder wicks through to the outside. M2 nuts were also soldered to the frame spacers to take the fixings for the electrical pick-up plate underneath.

Next is the mounting of the motor- as originally built the motor was laid flat and stuck into the cab, with our new backhead the motor will now be mounted up at and angle to clear the backhead space. Once the angle was determined the gears were fouling the boiler so some cutting was required here- hatched in pen on the boiler.

A motor cover plate was originally installed in the cab- so this was cut out at the same time.

Done.

A motor support plate was made up with .5mm brass sheet to hold the motor up at the angle, two holes were drilled in it to tie the motor in place with wire strap and then scored to fold the plate.

Plate folded and soldered in position between the frames.

Test fitting the brake parts, again 40mm long x .8mm brass wire and 4mm long x .8mm id brass tube was used for the support spigots.

Done for now.....

Eoin.

murrayec · January 28, 2021

Ready for soldering the brakes on the loco chassis.

Soldered with 145 deg solder hoping not to de-solder the tubes on the hangers- worked well!

Brakes removed.

Installing the motor and gearbox- a flat was milled on the axle for the gearwheel grub screw.

A brass tube spacer was made to space the gear wheel on centre of the motor, a .45mm brass washers installed between the gearbox frame and axle bearings both sides to hold the whole assembly on centre of the chassis.

Test fitting of the front guard irons to see if they need any mods, they fit fine, just need a few bends to line up with the wheels. These will be soldered on later.

The electrical pickup plate was fitted to the chassis frame spacers with M2 screws.

With the brakes back on, .4mm NS wire pickups were bent up and soldered onto the plate.

After soldering, the wires were adjusted, a little bend was formed on the ends to rub the back of the wheel threads.

Wired up and coupled up- some adjustments were done to the brake hangers and 12BA washers installed behind the crankpin bearings to make clearance so the coupling rods don't foul the brakes when running. The front and back axles have about 3mm side play.

And up n running. A few wobbly wheels will have to be looked at!

Checking the chassis fits the loco body- one wheel flange slightly rubs a splasher! a bit of packing between the chassis and body should sort that out.

Thats the two chassis complete, they will be stripped down for a spot of painting.

The new backhead will be next......

Eoin

murrayec · February 3, 2021

While sizing up the Slaters back-head I was reminded that that rear chassis mounting screw was way off centre and so was the boiler!

So I set about straightening things up- the boiler was fixed to the smoke-box with two screws into a captive yoke! inside, all the holes were off centre in the smokebox but the chassis holes were very close. After jigging about with pushing the boiler I had to come to a compromise- pushing the boiler to centre would twist the cab and the running plate- I settled for the mid position! At least I could straighten up the left side sandbox which was at an awful angle!

Once held in position I soldered the running plate to the smokebox rear, soldered in a BA chassis mounting screw with a washer to reinforce the join, and also soldered the top of the sandboxes to the smokebox sides from underneath it's not straight but a lot better.

The rear chassis mounting screw hole was dragged back to centre with a round file.

With the hole done I set up a drag beam from .5mm brass with some scoring and a few holes like the prototype.

A BA screw, a washer, and a bit of brass tube to fit the hole in the chassis frame spacer was clamped to the footplate and then soldered on.

Then the drag beam was soldered in.

Now a better chance in getting things lined up.

So back to the cab details - after playing with the backhead and looking at the prototype cab I decided to make a few more parts, the Slaters kit has different gauges, reverser hand wheel and fire box hole door! So I set up another drawing to cut out some parts- a backhead frame with gauge mountings, a top steam manifold, a prototypical fire hole door, a fireman side valve bracket (I think its the sander control?), some seats, splashers, reverser wheel, all cut from .35mm brass sheet. Also a cab floor and fall plate in .8mm PCB board.

More bits to clean up.......

Eoin

Galteemore · February 3, 2021

Lovely work Eoin. Levelling and centring boilers is tricky work and I’m sure you’re glad it’s sorted.

Noel · February 3, 2021

33 minutes ago, murrayec said:

While sizing up the Slaters back-head I was reminded that that rear chassis mounting screw was way off centre and so was the boiler!

So I set about straightening things up- the boiler was fixed to the smoke-box with two screws into a captive yoke! inside, all the holes were off centre in the smokebox but the chassis holes were very close. After jigging about with pushing the boiler I had to come to a compromise- pushing the boiler to centre would twist the cab and the running plate- I settled for the mid position! At least I could straighten up the left side sandbox which was at an awful angle!

Once held in position I soldered the running plate to the smokebox rear, soldered in a BA chassis mounting screw with a washer to reinforce the join, and also soldered the top of the sandboxes to the smokebox sides from underneath it's not straight but a lot better.

The rear chassis mounting screw hole was dragged back to centre with a round file.

With the hole done I set up a drag beam from .5mm brass with some scoring and a few holes like the prototype.

A BA screw, a washer, and a bit of brass tube to fit the hole in the chassis frame spacer was clamped to the footplate and then soldered on.

Then the drag beam was soldered in.

Now a better chance in getting things lined up.

So back to the cab details - after playing with the backhead and looking at the prototype cab I decided to make a few more parts, the Slaters kit has different gauges, reverser hand wheel and fire box hole door! So I set up another drawing to cut out some parts- a backhead frame with gauge mountings, a top steam manifold, a prototypical fire hole door, a fireman side valve bracket (I think its the sander control?), some seats, splashers, reverser wheel, all cut from .35mm brass sheet. Also a cab floor and fall plate in .8mm PCB board.

More bits to clean up.......

Eoin

Eoin, Stunning brass engineering. You are an absolute genius when it comes to model engineering and brass. Inspirational

murrayec · February 5, 2021

Cab bits cleaned up, I added the rear axle springs, left bottom, into the mix as they are so dominant in the prototype cab photos!

The springs are done with 3.2mm styrene tube and 3.2 x 2mm styrene rod for the frames, all bolted together with 14BA bars n nuts- these should be 16BA but I don't have any long enough. The tool in centre of the photo is for processing the BA screws, it has tapped holes from 16BA up to 7BA in steps of 2 until 8BA, the screw being cut is threaded in and locked with a nut, the screw is then cut to size, and the tool is now the holder to dress the end of the screw threads with a file.

A 5mm Tufnol spacer was cut out to pack out the backhead.

With the splasher riveting done and folded up, it's time to test fit and see what requires adjustment, the floor plate needs a bit of adjustment but it looks like it's all going to work.

The springs in- standing a bit high and going to need a little adjustment.

The backhead packer was drilled and tapped 8BA for screw fixing into the cab and a hole drilled in the cab front to receive it.

The Slaters casting will be epoxied to the packer when assembled.

Setting up for soldering the brass parts, .5mm brass domed rivets will be used to fix the gauge mountings to the backhead frame, also used to make up the fire hole door and levers.

The teapot shelf now needs to be soldered on to the backhead with 70deg lead solder so that the fire hole door operating lever can be sized for bending.

Shelf on and parts being sized up.

Eoin.

murrayec · February 7, 2021

All the bits 180deg soldered and needing the rivets to be trimmed off. The fire hole door handle had a piece of tracing paper fitted so that if the solder wicked through from the back the handle would not get stuck on and could be bent up to miss the teapot shelf!

The back of the boiler band was thinned with 180deg solder in readiness to 70deg lead solder it to the backhead.

And soldered on.

Next was time to fit some of the backhead fittings to set up the pipework, the parts were pierced from the sprew as these are cast brass and cutting them off with a snips can distort the bits. The holes were drilled out in the backhead- sized so that the parts are a push fit so that they will stay put while setting up. A .7mm brass wire was installed across the casting which will be soldered to the boiler frame at the sides rear.

There is only one boiler water level fitting in the Slaters kit- so 170 must have had an accident and its second fittings is in the shop being repaired!

While proceeding to set up the pipework and to fit some of the parts to the cab splashers- which is rather difficult to do in the model cab with everything loose and a roof in the way, so I made a jig out of mdf to hold all the bits which will make this task easier and will be able to get things more accurate.

The axle springs have been lowered and one of the cab seats is clamped onto the side so that the fittings to be soldered to the splashers can be assessed.

Position of the firebox door can now be determined and stuck on with epoxy and then the pipes can be done.

Eoin

Galteemore · February 7, 2021

Genius idea about the jig. Wish I’d thought of it yesterday....

murrayec · February 7, 2021

3 minutes ago, Galteemore said:

Genius idea about the jig. Wish I’d thought of it yesterday....

Yes, things were driving me nuts this morning- trying to hold everything within the model cab to mark and take measurements was so difficult, so I spent an hour setting up the jig! I reckon an hour well spent.......

Eoin

murrayec · February 8, 2021

The hinges for the fall plate, done with .35mm fb wire- one side bent in a 'U' the other bent in a 'U' with a twist and then 180deg soldered to the copper board.

Pipes bent up and ready to be epoxied on to the backhead- .5mm & 1mm soft copper wire that came with the Slaters kit. The steam brake system which is a brass casting designed for the right-hand side had its pipe sawn off to rotate it for the left-hand side mounting.

The reverser handwheel mounting bracket and the fireman side sanding valve bracket were soldered onto the splashers.

Backhead and cab stuff complete except for the gauges, a few more handwheels and painting of course.

Eoin.

murrayec · May 12, 2021

I finally got to the painting stage on this project.

Just a few small things to do first;-

Loco front guard irons were soldered onto the chassis and bent into shape.

The last bit of piping, for the steam gauges, needs to be glued onto the backhead so I turned up 2 gauges from 3.8mm brass rod on the lathe, here the gauges are being drilled to mount the pipes. The gauges are marked off on the bar in the lathe and its then transferred to the drill, always start the drilling with a centre drill- just a dent.....

and then finish with a .6mm drill bit. When done the bar goes back on the lathe for parting off the 2 gauges.....

Parted off and pipes bent up in .5mm soft copper wire, I'm going to leave the gaugesin brass finish so will be stuck on later, for now their used to position the pipes while gluing the pipes on.

All the bits.

Now ready for painting, chassis have been sand blasted and wheel tyres masked off and all stuck on sticks!

Etch primer done.

And these are the gauge faces n water glass, their covered in transpaseal to protect the paper, they will be cut out and stuck on later after painting is done.