jhb171achill

Interesting. Plain wagon grey was standard up to about 1970 for PW as well as everything else (except newly-orange bubbles!), and plain wagon brown after that. I saw many, many PW trains myself, and wandered freely in the mid-70s around Port Laoise PW yard, and never saw a single red vehicle. Thus, I can be certain there was never any sort of "official red PW livery" as such. The half-dozen vehicles you mention must have been painted like that for some sort of specific pupose, and it would be interesting to know what that was. The vehicles you mention which show up in photos in red must have been - a bit like the handful of green H vans in the early 60s, or plain tan tin vans in the 1980s, some sort of effort for one specific use. I'd be interested to see these photos. What I find interesting is that there are several instances in the past regarding livery deetails here and there which as read, end up being misleading. Two examples that spring to mind relate to the grey GSR / CIE livery, and the green tin vans. A contemporary report about the latter, possibly in the IRN or IRRS Journal (can't remember) suggest that fifty or 100 of the H vans were turned out in green. This is not the case. A handful were, and very short lived indeed. Reason - the livery changed away from green and snails when these were only in production, so the batch would have been finished in grey. The brown colour used from the late 1980s for all stock (I know this is well out of the period referred to here) had a distinctly more reddish hue than before. Regarding these red-painted wagons, any pics?

SO realistic!!!

Indeed. We look at 90, 184 & 186; while they technically date from 1875, 1880 and 1879 respectively, they're classic Trigger's brushes. There is virtually nothing on any of the trio much before 1915, and later in some cases.

Note the old MGWR six-wheeled brake third (or brake compo?) immediately behind the engine - Cusack 1905-ish design!

Nostalgia aside; this very true. Sheer luxury, mind you, compared to an old MED on the Bangor line or a "Castle" 450. Both were saunas in summer and fridges in winter. For good measure, the MEDs were filled with diesel fumes and the 450s had only two speeds - stop and go; and seats built for leprechauns. In all reality, most modern trains are far more comfortable than the first and secnod generation railcars, with the exception of the AECs in original form. These had very comfortable main line style seating, though they were noisy. 70 and 80 class power cars, as well as 450s, were truly awful things to travel in. The rattling and severe vibration of the windows was the most deafening I've ever heard in any train anywhere. Way better in the trailing cars, in which I always made a point of travelling.

There are a number of choices. Several types of ex-BR vans, on account of not all of the original BR full brakes being of the same initial design. Then you've the 4 and 6 wheeled CIE "tin van" types, though there were only a few of the 6-whelers, they were limited in where they went, and they were short lived. Then you've the "Dutch" vans and the several detail-different types of 32XX series brake standard gennies. Either way, ANY CIE train needs a genny of some sort, as much as it needs a locomotive.

And the Bessbrook & Newry Tramway had its own road / rail convertible wagons. The short-lived small 1.5 mile Portstewart Tramway even carried light goods in one van!

The things people got up to on trains in those days……….! Actually, a heating van of SOME sort is an absolute must….

Having seen them in the flesh at the show……… WOW! Guaranteed winner, and deservedly so, as always with IRM. I’m hoping mine will have authentic cigarette butts on the floor and chewing gum stuck to exactly 12 of its internal seats. Yes, I sat in one once, when a mid-day train to Cork was exceptionally busy and they stuck three on the end of it. I think it was that train, or the same service another day around then, which was the last time I saw a Bredin in traffic….

The thing about a shunting layout like that is that it can be anything. Switch to MGWR-livery 0.6.0s and it’s a goods yard in Mayo in 1915. Stick a few “supertrain” livery 071s there, and IRM beet wagons, and it’s somewhere in South Wexford in 1997. If you use ordinary Peco track, the world’s your oyster. Put the right locos and rolling stock on it, and if could literally be almost anywhere in Ireland or Britain, any time from 1890 to the 1990s. It could even pass for a location in certain other countries, maybe.

A worthy equal!

is it just me, or were those things by far the ugliest and most unwieldy looking things ever to take to the rails in Ireland!

Despite being a driver, I'd love to see that!

Well wrapped consignment of raw materials for Kutch, Hinahan & Co. (Chemical Importers), Dublin & Limerick.

The odd coach and loco had it until 1963 or 4 - a handful of vehicles went straight from that to black'n'tan. They had stopped turning anything out fresh in silver after only a few years, 1955-57. By 1958, the last "C" class locos entered service in green. Obviously not everything was repainted overnight, hence the above. Same with the green; while it was superceded in late 1962, there were still a handful of green coaches to be seen as late as 1967. And as I've mentioned before, you'd still see the odd "H" van with a snail on it right to the end of loose-coupled goods in 1976.

Tinier loading gauge and narrower track gauge - but - the Dublin United Tramways Co. used to take goods wagons off the Dublin & Blessington Tramway at night, bringing them through the streets hauled by an electric locomotive to the south-side river bank area. This was sand from out beyond a country village called Tallaght....! So nothing's without a precedent. But the Luas would be entirely unsuiatble for Dublin Port traffic, unfortunately. That said, a passenger extension down to the port would facilitate foot passengers on the ferry (all three of them!) and port workers.

This would explain the almost impossibility of finding someone with the skills, willingness and availability to make up brass kits. I’ve a few, but my eyesight and nimbleness aren’t what they were. I wish I’d never bought them……!

They’d be first generation, as despite not operating since early 1963, a number of steam engines were technically on the books when they were being introduced. It’s reasonable to say they were the last of the first generation, while the 181s were the first of the second generation. Then in the 071s we’ve the only other 2nd gen, and the 201s, I suppose, are the only examples of any 3rd generation? Will there be a 4th? In passenger terms, probably not. Will there be any goods in the future to warrant a 4th gen of freight locos, powered not by diesel but by vegan compliant broccoli juice and zero-emission water?

Driver's keys from 121 / 141 / 181s.

I hope you spanked them thoroughly....

That's what I'd be thinking. If they are, it would be good if the owner donated them, as being proper replicas they would look a lot better. That said, the ones it now carries will in time have their own historic significance as having been cast in Inchicore Works, eighty years after the loco they adorn was built there! Plus, non-standard as they may be, they're the last loco numberplates ever cast in the works. The tradition goes back a century or so, prior to the closure of the foundry. And the raw materials - the brass - came from among the last of the retired first-generation diesels....

The lining suggests the livery above, though no clue as to the coach part - probably varnished wood or maroon of some sort.

Very true. The originals have to kicking about somewhere - but - beware! The ACTUAL (1915) originals were scrapped when it was last repainted in the very late 1950s, after which, in keeping with CIE policy of the day, it got painted numerals. The plates on it in Fermoy and later Mallow were 1960s replicas, albeit authentically cast by CIE - probably, in fact, the last steam numberplates of standard Inchicore design ever cast. And indeed, as Castleisland Railway "C", it is possible it had no markings at all in its original state. However, having been built at inchicore for the CR, it very probably had the GSWR green livery as shown above from new.

That model shown above is actually where the livery for 90 was copied from. It is in the Institute of Mechanical Engineers offices in London, and was built in the 1870s by Inchicore apprentices. As for that no. 60 plate, and Wheeltappers, and genuine Irish railwayana as well as fakes.....well, we all know..... less said about that the better!!

Yes, it is.