jhb171achill

A36 rattles and coughs along the main line somewhere with a mail train. Reasonably new CIE TPO still in silver (yes, INCLUDING that filthy roof AND ends!), followed by a GSR bogie mail van, as far as I can make out, and Bredins and laminates. I think I saw another black and white pic of this train - if it’s the same one, a wooden bogie and several tin vans took up the rear.

Anyone remember the very last of the steam doing that long haul up?

I've identified that six-wheeler I posted earlier. Obviously of GSWR parentage, it is no. 601, one of a pair of 3rd class saloons built in 1896, and withdrawn in 1957. The other was withdrawn in early 1955, just before the "A" class entered traffic, apparently. It had a toilet, which makes me think it was probably originally a first, but my GSWR notes do not confirm this. Internally it had two 18-seat compartments, each with a bench seat along the end, and side benches (note the window layout).They were seperated by a vestibule, on one side of which was the toilet, a wash hand basin on the other. There were all manner of oddities like this well into the 1960s, though only of bogie variety after March 1963, when the last passenger-carrying six-wheelers in traffic were withdrawn in Cork, boy. If anyone buys the Hattons six-wheelers, note that while most British six-wheelers seem to have only one footstep, two were fitted to almost every single Irish six-wheeler, on all company's lines.

Ghost trains.............. whooo whooooo Delving into the Catacombs, aka the most disorganised study even I have ever had, in 1977 we have NORTHBOUND (passing times at Howth Junction): 2133 Limerick - Kingscourt Empty gypsum 2248 North Wall - Platin Empty cement 0023 Cabra - Platin empty cement 0103 Tara empties 0238 Path for North Wall - Platin empty cement 0337 Connolly - Dundalk Newspaper train 0437 North Wall - Belfast Liner 0607 Connolly - Belfast Mail train 0821 Enterprise SOUTHBOUND 2216 Belfast - Dublin liner (left Belfast 1445, had 3 hour layover in Dundalk) 2323 Dundalk - Dublin Mail (Monday - Friday) 0002 Platin - Foynes empty Oil 0048 Path - Platin to EITHER Sligo or Wexford cement 0231 Kingscourt - limerick gypsum Tuesday & Thursday 0332 Platin - Midlands bagged cement path 0421 Dundalk (Barrack St) - North Wall Liner (Tuesday & Saturday) 0529 Tara Mines to Alexandra Road 0552 Platin - North Wall cement 0611 Platin - Cabra Bulk Cement 0930 Platin - Cabra Bulk Cement 1007 Enterprise This is the NOCTURNAL stuff - you should see what else passed in daylight! Fast forward to 2021, and we've three Taras in daytime, unphotogenic due to the graffiti scribblings of the mouth-breathers of society, and various brightly coloured tubes with people in them. Since goods trains are all but a thing of the past, and railways don't seem to have "passengers" any more, are these silver or green tubes "customer trains"? Going back to nocturnal stuff, if you examine the Cork line in those days, there are multiples of what's above. Living close to the railway line near Kildare, for example, would have you kept awake by some twenty train movements per night, none passenger obviously. Even the Limerick - Claremorris line, with not a passenger train to its name day or night, had up to seven trains a day, though 4 of these only ran if required. And almost all was "Supertrain"-liveried....... I think that this was the year when the very last black'n'tan loco was repainted..... Foynes had four regular trains per day, with EIGHT extra paths if required; thus it was theoretically possible for 12 trains a day on that line. The so-called "Runs of Goods" from Cork to North Esk went on all day long. Cherryville Junction - Waterford - Ballinacourty had twelve freight movements per day in each direction, from the through goods to the dolomite and other short workings. And today we get flustered over an 071 trailing a single standard bogie wagon with some yellow thing on it!

Obviously when quite new, 1955. But look to the left; an 1890s GSWR 6-wheeled first class saloon, possibly now downgraded, with a much newer bogie behind it. Such was the contrast readily and regularly available.

"........The fleet of 90 fertilizer wagons ran in that livery from when until when? I remember earlier in this thread, somebody was saying that the fertilizer wagons also ran in a different livery?......." The only liveries the ferts ever had were both initially all brown - every single detail, bogies, couplings, the lot - typical sheep-dip style, so time-honiured with most CIE (and many other Irish) wagons. Quite simply, up to 1987 they were outshopped with a CIE roundel on the second panel from the left, and after 1987 without any roundel. Numerals and other markings stayed the same, and bogies were never black. Now - disclaimer time. The above is how a newly-painted one would look. But, as you'll see on the IRM models, panels got swopped about to the Nth degree; the panel with the roundel would end up appearing anywhere, sometimes two to a side if doors were swopped, sometimes none, and often in later days not only the second from left, but ANY panel could end up being replaced by one with a logo. Many got so filthy and worn that the paint was almost all peeled off one panel or more (and the one beside it painted quite new!). Brake dust covering and weathering could make the logo or number look brownish - IRM have cleverly produced one variant with a badly weathered "roundel" but pristine white number! Nice move..... So, two liveries, but CIE logos all over the place in practice due to door-swopping.

Yes, it was - sorry, that’s the one I thought you meant. I missed the word “brickworks”!

Yes, this was a siding off a short length of the erstwhile Athy - Ballylinan / Deerpark Collieries line, which never had a passenger service, only being built by the British government in the 1910s.

Out on the main line, A25. The photographer seems to have either followed this train, or been on it, yet in a position to take a shot like this en route. in typical style, the first three carriages are of three different types.....

Polloxfen’s Mill sidings at Ballysodare is as perfect a modelling subject as you’d get. Extremely short on space and compact, it lends itself perfectly to a small shunting layout. It had tight enough curves, and three-way points to assist. And operated by normal main line locos....

Yes, EXACTLY. I've been banging on about this for years (as those in the model railway trade who know me will testify)! Naturally, many of these items may not ever be commercially viable, so self-build for much of it will remain the only show in town - at least for a very long time. I am hoping at some stage to produce as complete a list as I can of appropriate "off-the-shelf" and kits which would be suitable for a 1955-65 period, interest in which is obviously growing, and not before time, as this period had the single greatest variety of stuff on wheels in all of Irish railway history; brand new stock AND locos operating alongside some items 70 and 80 years old - and everything in between. I would add some "off the shelf" British stuff which with a repaint would just about pass a "2-foot rule" for those on lesser budgets, or less concerned about absolute technical accuracy. For example, some of the "bought" SECR coaches (one anyway) would have a passing resemblance to a certain class of MGWR bogie, at least one example of which survived the grey & green era to get a clean coat of black'n'tan. I think it survived to about 1965. With "bought" six-wheelers now appearing, and at a reasonable price, that's one ticked off. JM Design and Silverfox do kits of tin vans, though a RTR one is needed. A wooden bogie - ideally GSWR origin (of 1910-20 design) is another must. Many another thing too, of course, VERY many - goods stock of all types included - would be needed.

I have become aware, lately, of where BOTH plates off one of the D16 "Achill Bogies" (No. 532) are.............. Being ex-MGWR, they are inscribed: G S R 532 .........and nothing else.

I was wondering how it got there, Jimmy! Didn't know that this vehicle had ever been anywhere other than Witham Street or Cultra post-1959........

VERY nice. I wish I had kept the 560 one I had.... That 184 one would be one of the originals, as the preserved loco (like 186 AND 461) has replicas. The green is off that one-off livery the thing had for some late 1950s open day in Inchicore. Original grey underneath, by the look of it..........

Not the greatest original pic to work with, but the pic shows then-newish laminates with a green “A” + stripe. Unusually, coaches 2, 3 & (out of view) 4 are the same type, so this is possibly a special train intended to impress someone..... Recent comments elsewhere about accurate weathering may be interested in where the oil stains were on these Crossley beasts. Additional comments - now that I see this pic in a larger screen, the carriages carry the name boards used on the principal expresses, which I think dates it to the early 60s. As this train passes, Inchicore Works is probably performing its Unboxing Dance with brand new 121s, ready-fitted with kadees, 21mm gauge axles and sound chips.

Dunno what they did IN the factory all year (played cards & drank tea?), but in terms of railway traffic, nothing. Trucks all parked up, and until the mid 1970s used for general goods elsewhere.

That would be right, Angus! Looking forward to seeing the result.... An ex-GSWR loco might have: G S W R number INCHICORE WORKS 1884 ....while an ex-MGWR loco would typically be: G S R number (just)!

Yes, you're right - most with a grey background (which, strangely, the manufacturer doesn't do) - but only because most engines were grey right until almost the end. By the time they started painting any engines black or green, the numberplates were replaced by painted numbers, so that with the exception of the 800 class, grey is the only show in town for numberplates - with only a very few exceptions which (a) kept numberplates into the late 50s, AND got painted black. The wording "Inchicore Works" and the build date varied from engine to engine after the amalgamation, though all GSWR locos had both. An ex-DSER, Midland, West Cork or narrow gauge engine might have "G S R" (and a handful had "C I E" later, but it varied. Colours: If the loco is grey, the numberplate is grey. Black or red backed numberplates on grey locos are simply as wrong as lime green CIE roundels. But, of course, a few exceptions! This one, "A few had the backgrounds painted black with the lettering and borders picked in red...." is not at all certain, and if there is any substance in it would certainly not have been in late GSR or CIE times - possibly early GSR (late 20s). 1. The 800 class. Initially, all three had dark blue backgrounds, uniquely. No. 800 retained these always. Nos 801 and 802 - again, uniquely - had theirs repainted red background sometime in the early 50s, and retained these to the end. 2. Ex-MGWR "E" / J26 No. 560. This engine appears to have been painted black in the late 50s, but kept its cast numberplates. However, in the early 1990s I owned one of its numberplates (wish I had kept it) and whoever the previous owner was, had scrubbed it back to the grey paint. There were a very small number of other locos like this, but once an engine was repainted by CIE, off went the plates. 3. CIE repaints. Between 1945 and 1962, CIE repainted some engines green: numberplates ALL removed, except the 800s, in place of light green painted numbers. Some grey: numberplates replaced by light yellow painted numbers. Some black: ditto - yellow painted numerals. So there is a fundamental error in a number of manufactured plates I've seen, in that the backgrounds are BLACK; this incorrect - if the loco still has a numberplate, it means it's still in GSR guise, thus grey ONLY. The raised edges and numbers on cast plates was normally outlined in pale yellow, but occasionally just painted over plain grey, sometimes *(as Senior observed) polished bare metal (which would have just got filthy!) and possibly (unconfirmed) other variations. However, if you want a red-backed plate, or a black-backed one, you're way back into GSWR times. Up to about 1900, when GSWR locos were green, numberplates were black-backed, and between then and about 1915, when GSWR locos were lined black, they were red. Perhaps the manufacturer might do them grey? Black or red would only be of use to GSWR modellers.

In response to a question, the stock in the train above is typical of the period; this train containing green laminates, a Park Royal, and (out of sight) at least one Bredin, more laminates of several types and what looked like a dirty silver tin van at the rear. I focussed in on the loco, as I will in the coming days. Today's picture, sticking with the "A" class, this at Mallow. The light green paint on the line along the side, and the "snail", have worn off - many photos show this line weathering badly, even when the main body colour was still smart enough. Mail van attached, still in "silver". Modeller's details: Water column on left, still very dirty / weathered green. Note the roof of the TPO. It looks black. It is important to note that like domes on blue GNR engines, or red Donegal engines, although these often LOOKED black, this was 100% dirt, and in all three cases were NEVER actually painted black. Similarly, silver coaching stock and locos never had black bogies - always also silver - but covered in gunge, gunk, oil and brake dust. Silver (unpainted) stock, despite being new, would on occasion still be steam hauled. Good luck with a clean roof on that one! This pic is the Kerry mail, so it will have about three passenger-carrying coaches behind it, plus one or two - or being a mail train maybe more - tin vans. More tomorrow.

From the P Dillon / C Fry collection, I’ve fished out a few guess which I’ll post over the coming days to illustrate the “A” (and, for good measure, the B101s) in the 1958-64 period. I do jig have to hand exact dates for each individual one. These are cropped to show maximum detail on the loco and what “goes with them”. I hope this is of interest. Firstly; A7. The copyright for ALL of these that I will post in the coming days belongs to Hassard Stacpoole or Patricia Dillon.

Indeed - not great. The grey one has the “wrong dirt in the wrong places”, perhaps; are these things “factory-done”? In real life, with a livery as impractical as pale grey and yellow for a locomotive (and initially still surrounded by steam engines!), this livery got filthy quickly.

No idea - probably the same reason but maybe different locations.

Yes, they were - only a few cars (for all I'm aware maybe only one) got them. And it did run in West Cork on some occasions, as I've seem pics of it at Bantry and Albert Quay. However in the above pic, that's a shadow of telegraph wires - you'll see it goes right along the roof. Roofs were normally black. Yes, arrival 2.30pm in Cork. Tail lamp on railcar. The AEC cars were given a trial on the Valentina branch (though never used there). They needed the wider buffers for sharp curves. Some bogie coaches were fitted with them too.

A guy I met in a pub told me............

It will indeed, Robert - many congratulations!