jhb171achill

Well spotted, you’re absolutely right - NCC (well, possibly BNCR) it is!

And he sells more 201s....

I'd be up for that, John. Put me down for a few.

Wow! Would love to see that! What era did it cover? 1980s to present?

I’ll try to put together a rough guide to what could be mostly expected to be seen in most places. With so many classes of loco having but one or two examples, the exceptions will far outweigh the norm, however few of us will have an example if every GSR loco in our possession. Obviously, the J15 being by FAR the most common loco, was in many ways the 141 of the past. Few West Cork locos ever left their area at all, even as one-offs, though of course one of the famous “Bandon Tanks” ended up on the DSE suburban. The J15’s and their neighbours, the MGWR J18s, tended to stick to their respective areas, though J15s were very common on Tralee - Limerick - Sligo after the W & L came into the GSWR fold. Most ex-Midland branchlines had J18s or G2 2.4.0s from opening to closure or dieselisation. Most ex-GSWR & WLWR branches ended up with J15s; many having them start to finish. Michael McMahon’s GSR loco “bible” fills in the many, many blanks and exceptions, describing the operational habits of the lesser classes. Certainly, just as any layout based on UTA simply can’t be realistic without a UG or a Jeep, anything NIR must have an 80-class or three, and CIE / IE from 1963 to 2000 simply won’t cut the mustard without at least one 141, nothing CIE 1945-63 looks right without a grubby J15. The forthcoming “Dugort Harbour”, despite being just a small shunting terminus, will have three J15s and three 141s.....plus a few Cs, as befits many branch termini on CIE between 1955 and 1963.

I think a lack of exposure is certainly evident. Perhaps, with such a bewildering array of locos, differing uses, and differing routes, confusion puts some people off.... but nowhere better for an Irish model layout than any station on the South Kerry, Mallow - Waterford, or the ex- W & L lines (Limerick to Tralee, Sligo & Waterford). A prototype of Cashel, or a station on the Thurles-Clonmel line would make nice layouts.

Any thoughts on production, folks?

Wire brush, yes, then decent black undercoat. Finish is correctly black with white lettering for GSWR, and most GNR. In GNR(B) days, some were white with red lettering, and station and lamp nameboards were yellow with black lettering. I actually had a very large collection of all sorts of signs years ago, but unfortunately had to sell them.

Wowww! drool worthy....!

Hard to see from the google image - have you inspected it close up? Looks early GN to me but I haven't seen it close up.

Thanks to some research by 00 Works, and comparison with what as far as I'm aware is the only surviving sample of original paint, the correct shade of grey has finally been identified / matched. My understanding is that Roderick will be able to supply it for anyone modelling steam.

Certainly is. There's another, more complete, near Banbridge on the main AI road in a field up on the right when travelling north. It's been there for fifty five years at least.

That's an absolute beauty of a layout. I like the realistic ground cover and backscenes especially.

Finally - a correct paint match for GSR / CIE locomotive grey Thanks mainly to Roderick of 00 Works, I think we can now be sure of the closest match to what as far as I am aware, is the only surviving original sample (from about 1925 or so) of the loco grey introduced by the GSWR about 1915/8 and continued through GSR days and into CIE, right to the end of steam days in 1963. A remarkable 45 years in use, more or less equalled by CIE's various variations or orange and black 1962-2006. The model, as many will know, was built in early GSR days (and is "0" coarse scale). The paint on it is original. Roderick sent me numerous samples of greys blended from this and that. The piece of plastic seen here against the model has been sprayed with what seems the closest match, and as you can see, it matches in daylight, artificial light, and half-and-half. Presumably Roderick will now be in a position to sell this paint to anyone who wants to paint a GSR / CIE model. Naturally, upside-down reproduction of images is a necessity.....! I understand that this will be used as a model for the eagerly-awaited RTR J15. I have been trying to find, for ages, the list I got from Bob Clements years and years ago of what classes of locomotive received all-black paint in the 1955-62 period. I just can't find it! Most remained grey, as we all know, but some got lined green or black.

To go back to the original topic, I am advised that due to the three layers of heading etc., it’s not as easy to do MGWR stuff as brass “scratch-aid” kits. Thus, it seems they could be exceptionally fiddly to produce and / or make. Currently on hold, but not forgotten about!

There would be major surgery required. In theory, a loco like this could be rebuilt to resemble (even vaguely) several GNR or CIE prototypes, though in this case the amount of work needed would just as easily be done as a new-build,

Bono? So there’s one for me and U2?

I didn't know that BR still used them that late. I think - but can't be sure - that the GNR(I) was the last to use them here, and that their practices ended some time between 1919 and the mid 1920s. Edenderry lost its passenger service very early, yes, 1931 I believe. It would seem that towards that date, slip working had ceased there. I didn't know that the "oul crate" had been a slip coach - interesting. So: quiz question: where else in Ireland were they used? The GNR used one on the up Belfast - Dublin (I think it was brake tri-compo No. 19) and it was slipped approaching Amiens Street so that it could cruise downhill into the LNWR North Wall terminal.

The speed van would look better being driven at speed itself - over the Cliffs of Moher!

Oooooh goody goody goody! Hope I can be there!

Former MGWR six-wheeled stock were to be seen in locations as diverse as West Cork, the Harcourt Street and Bray - Amiens St lines, every corner of the Midland, even in Enniskillen when borrowed by the SLNCR! In the 1910s, six or more spent a number of years on loan to the BCDR and would have covered all that system. The Sligo - Limerick - Tralee lines saw them too, as did the Foynes branch. I am quite sure that they were to be seen at many GSWR locations, even the main line. At least one went over the the Waterford & Tramore, I think. The last use of them, in summer 1963, was on the Cork - Youghal and Cobh lines. An IRRS excursion over to Albert Quay used one in early 1964. It was already officially withdrawn, and this trip marked the last passenger journey by a six-wheeled coach, as well as the last passenger working across the Cork City Railway and into Albert Quay. Wish I'd been on it - at my age, I would have clearly remembered it.........!

That oul crate of a thing they had on the Foynes branch in its last days was a MGWR brake 3rd.... Drawings sent to Worsley Works today. I still have to photocopy one and send it too. Allen is all ready to go once I get him whatever stuff I can.

That is an absolute work of art - very impressive.

VERY nice.

Seeing single "bubbles" in a goods train back in the day was commonplace. Seeing a uniform rake of ANYTHING was exceptional. I made a note once only, of a goods passing Lisburn northbound. It must have been about 1970. I can't find it now, but what I do recall is that it was mostly "H" vans and Bullied opens, a few vans, then maybe one open, then another couple of vans etc... and strung through this lot were Lancashire Flats with Guinness and THREE bubbles. There were 34 wagons in all, including - if I recall correctly - two brake vans, one at each end. I suspect the leading one was travelling "light". This was absolutely the norm. Block trains of a single type of wagon only became the norm after about 1975, when goods facilities nationwide were severely rationalised. The same with passenger trains. Someone asked me recently what sort of rakes Cravens first appeared in, and was surprised to learn that almost never did you get a train of Cravens only - in fact, with no Cravens being firsts or dining cars, and most main line services still offering two classes and many also having catering, a train of Cravens only was something that personally I NEVER saw, not once. Laminates of the various types, Park Royals, and the last few Bredins were all a common fleet with them, and a typical main line train was maybe three Cravens, two Laminate standard, a Park Royal, a laminate-like dining car*, and a genny van. (* None of the "laminate" dining cars were actually constructed with laminated frames, so technically they weren't "laminates". They had solid frames. The DESIGN was similar, though, of course.)