jhb171achill

1963 Concluded Back from the tropics now, so back to delving, and we're now in 1963. With steam finally dying on CIE this year, it was a truly momentous year in Irish railway history, and this huge change in motive power over the previous decade was now focussing minds on the strengths and weaknesses of the new forms of propulsion. Over the past decade, we had seen a shift from the general rule, like this: 1950-2 Steam everywhere. 1952-5 AEC on almost all secondary passenger services, and many main line ones. Steam everywhere else. 1955-60 AEC and A class on main line, secondary and suburban passenger, and A, B101 and C joining steam on goods. Steam still on many branches and pilot working. The B101 class are seen as "southern engines", being based in Cork, Limerick & Waterford. Unlike other diesels, they are not to be seen all over the system. B101s are mainly active on Rosslare - Waterford - Mallow - Cork, Waterford - Limerick, and Cork - Tralee, but make more than a few appearances on the North Kerry (normally AEC on passenger and "A" on goods) and Limerick - Sligo less often. The B101 class are also occasionally to be seen on the DSER but rarely on the ex-GN lines, and almost unheard of on the Midland. This will remain their lifetime habits. 1960-3 AEC graduate towards Dublin suburban mostly, with A taking the lead on other passenger trains for a very short time until the B121s and B141s are in use. C's on remaining branches as they close. A, C and B101 on goods. Steam on a few branch duties and pilot work, very occasional goods e.g. beet and cattle specials. 1964-7 The "Yanks" take over passenger work very substantially. The increasingly unreliable A class are largely on goods now, and the even more disastrously unreliable C class are mostly on pilot work now, with rare appearances on passengers trains. AEC cars now in Dublin. Steam gone. In 1963, it is noted that on average only 12 of the 34 "C" class are in traffic at any one time. With their branch lines (e.g. Birr, West Cork) gone, they do little but pilot work. The rest await on the Tiresome Long Term Illness Siding at Inchicore for their next appointment with the long-suffering fitters. Then somebody suggests new engines for them! It was noted, though, that with the B121 and B141 class spread thinly all over the system, while many opportunities presented themselves where double-heading would be beneficial, rarely were there two of these classes in the same place, at the same time, and available for such duty. Thus, their 950hp power was an operational limitation. However, the C class, even when working, were worse - it was noted that five bogies was as much as one could deal with in realistic terms. The newer E class had proven unstable at speed, and were thus confined to shunting around Dublin, though two were allocated to Cork and one to Limerick. A G was in Tralee to handle the Castleisland goods and shunt. Another G had for just a couple of months dealt with the daily Foynes mixed - in between the end of (J15) steam there, and the end of passenger services in '63. With all the new locos, especially the B121 / B141 classes, plus further closures of smaller intermediate stations, many passenger services were considerably speeded up. The Dublin - Galway service had a full half an hour knocked off it.The final trains on the Sligo - Claremorris and Tralee - Limerick sections were, as usual, AEC railcar sets of three cars. The "Burma Road" one trailed a tin van - AEC sets were often seen towing all manner of items - from six wheel coaches to tin vans to having Park Royals or even older wooden corridor stock as intermediates. Now, the Limerick - Ballina service, bereft of its railcar, would switch to a 141 and coaches - a pattern maintained until passenger services ceased in 1976. Naturally, many many steam engines were now lined up for scrap, including old GNR types. On 10th June, J15 151 was steamed and went from Amiens Street to Bray and back, the purpose for which being unclear. Prior to that, 184, 111, 187 and 151 had all been in steam for filming purposes in the spring, but this jaunt to Bray does appear to be the last time any locomotive was used by CIE for any sort of normal use, even if apparently it didn't haul anything. I say "normal" use; two weeks later the old Cork gantry vertical boiler locomotive "Pat" was steamed for an IRRS group. This left locos in store at various locations, but the vast majority in Inchicore. Elsewhere, lifting of closed lines continued in the vicinities of West Cork (with a C class on lifting trains), Port Laoise - Kilkenny, Birr, Ballaghaderreen, Mountmellick and Banagher. Other lines slumbered, the cutting torch hanging over their heads; now weeds would gather, soon the track would be removed. Not quite yet, so Newmarket slept, as did Ballylinan, Oldcastle, Edenderry, North Wexford, and Bagenalstown - Palace East. I remember the eerie sense of an abandoned Palace East when jhb171Snr took me there just after the track had been lifted. A farmer with a shotgun, to whom I assume the land had just been sold, kindly advised us where we ought to go, and how quickly we ought to go there. The UTA was still whinging about how much money it was losing. Paltry by todays standards, at £438,000, but not really all that enormous by the standards of the day either. Some creative accounting ensured that the road services showed up as best as they could, while the railway showed as financially bad as possible. However, some stations on the Derry Road were being smartly painted up and renovated; obviously, closure couldn't be far away! Victoria Bridge, Pomeroy and Sion Mills all won best-kept station prizes. Yet, they increased their steam fleet. Loco shortages on the ex-GNR section meant that three S class and one Vs (170, 171, 174 and 207) were now being bought from CIE, who had inherited them in 1958 but with the end of steam had no use for them. The blue livery, albeit so filthy that it could barely be seen, would grace the Derry Road once more, as buoyant passenger traffic meant that steam hauled passenger trains would not entirely be displaced by AEC and BUT cars on the Derry line. In contrast to what CIE were doing, it's interesting to see what was working on the UTA. The last ex-NCC 0.6.0, No. 13, wasn't doing much and would be withdrawn soon, but was noted shunting York Road, despite having been out of use for a while. York Road (or Duncrue Street, as they now called it) had recently overhauled "Jeeps" 2, 51 and 57, with 10 under repair. Alongside 10, "W" class 2.6.0 No. 97 (possibly the last of these in traffic?) and two GNR 0.6.0s were also under heavy repair. Eleven more steam engines of both NCC and GNR origin were advertised for scrap, while W class 95 and 98 were hauled dead to be stored at Whitehead, never to run again. The Derry Road had seen little steam on passenger work in recent years, the majority of trains being AEC railcars, but the summer of '63 saw what might be seen as an Indian summer. The three S class locos recently acquired from CIE, and the busy summer traffic, saw up to 50% of the trains on the line in the summer being steam. As well as the S class trio, the remaining U / UG types put in appearances, especially the Posrtadown - Dungannon local. And this was to be the season that on several occasions, CIE B141 class diesels would grace this line as far as Omagh on Lough Derg pilgrimage trains. I believe, but I am not certain, that a CIE AEC railcar set did this duty at least once. On the NCC, steam took a further step backwards, with a noticeable increase in specials being formed of the various types of MPD railcars. From normal passenger service, steam was almost extinct on the NCC. On 27th May 1963, an MPD set ventured off the NCC for the first time with a 5-piece passenger special from Portrush to Dublin and back, while a couple of weeks later B165 took a CIE set on a Dublin - Portrush excursion. The MPD jaunt south was repeated a week after that. Steam activity on specials in the summer of '63 saw W class 91 do fourteen specials, ex-GNR 4.4.0s 58 and 60, "Jeep" 50 and W 104 also seeing action. With Warrenpoint and Derry still working, this might be seen as an Indian Summer for UTA steam, even as the fires went out on CIE. The official roster - bearing in mind that some locos officially in traffic were not actually so - was as follows: NCC "WT" Class 2.6.4T "Jeep": 1-10, 50-57 (18 - the entire fleet of them) NCC "W" class 2.6.0: 91-9, 104 (8, though 95 and 98 had been out of use for a long time) NCC "V" class 0.6.0: No. 13 (1; saw little use, shunting only) SLNCR "Lough" Class 0.6.4T: 26 "Lough Melvin" and 27 "Lough Erne". Shunting only at York Road; 26 rarely used. (2) GNR "SG3" 0.6.0: 32-32-7 (6) GNR "SG2" 0.6.0: 38, 39 (2) GNR "SG" 0.6.0: 43, 44 (2) GNR "UG" 0.6.0: 45, 47-9 (4) GNR "Vs" 4.4.0: 58, 207 (2) GNR "S" 4.4.0: 60, 61*, 170, 171, 174 (5) (* out of use for some time; GNR numbers still on recent ex-CIE purchases, UTA numbers on others) GNR "S2" 4.4.0: 62, 63 (2) GNR "U" 4.4.0: 66-8 (3) GNR "T2" 4.4.2T: 5X (Not much in use - shunting at Gt. Vic. St) The "X" after the number meant that it was to be set aside for scrap if even the slightest fault developed, i.e. zero budget for maintenance. (1) GNR "T1" 4.4.2T: 187X As above (1). Of the above 57 locomotives, 18 were of one type, but the remaining 39 engines were of no less than thirteen types! Look at the GNR stock for example - no ex-GNR type had more than six members, and many were a class of 1 or 2. The summer Rosslare set was noted as being an AEC set (that much was typical) but with an old GSWR wooden dining car included. A cameo of workings on the Sligo - Limerick route in June 1963 saw a two-car AEC as the normal passenger set; that on Limerick - Tralee was the same formation. Single B121s were on the goods on this route, and on the main line to Sligo. The ballina branch train, however, had a C, usually hauling an old wooden bogie and a tin van. G615 was shunting in Ballina, while a C often handled the branch goods. In these times the Nenagh branch still was seen as the main line into Limerick. One typical train is recorded: B144 hauling a train of a Bredin, a Park Royal, three laminates, a dining car and a tin van. The ex-SLNCR railcar, now clad in CIE green, was working Limerick - Nenagh locals. The summer of 1963 saw busy traffic on weekend summer excursions from Castleieland to Fenit and back. AEC railcars dealt with this traffic. As autumn fell, the GAA's All Ireland Football Final would produce some interesting traffic as it has done from time immemorial to recent years. Nobody can convince me that there's anything even remotely interesting about getting a camera out for a Kerry supporter's special in these days - ehhh, oh, it's a 4 car ICR. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz. ALL the normal trains on that line are ICRs. But we're not talking about the glorified LUAS that passes for a railway today, all the way from Londonstrokederrybrexitcityderry to Cobh. It's September 1963, and no less than seven special s would leave Waterford for Dublin on All Ireland Day. But - with the recent closure of the Kilkenny - Port Laoise line, section occupancy was impossible on the main line for the normal service plus six specials all leaving within half an hour of each other. The solution was to send them up to New Ross - still open for goods, and beyond; the New Ross - Palace East - Macmine line had been closed since April but was not lifted. Thus began and ended 141 class operation over this line, as another remarkable feature of these trains is that they were all 141 hauled.B176 was first, then B147 left at 07:00, followed by B177, B158, B160 and a double-headed B148/B170! Autumn saw G615 alternating with a C on the Loughrea line, with its unique one coach train. Meanwhile, Inchicore's last two wholly-built coaches, two firsts of laminate stock, and the first Cravens, were out on test. Steam and Cravens had just missed each other; while all steam was gone months earlier, no Craven was yet in traffic. The first Craven was 1504, the rest numbered numerically after that. G617, the Tralee shunter / Castleisland goods engine, managed a rare passenger feat in September, when it took a two-coach special for an IRRS group on a rare non-stop run through Tralee, as it travelled from Castleisland to Fenit and back. One of the old GNR articulated Gardner railcars, No. 105 (ex railcar G) was still working on the Warrenpoint branch, but a single BUT car, 129, was also working on its own on off-peak Belfast - Portadown services. Every year, when the Orangemen and Apprentice Boys came out of the woodwork, many interesting railway workings would result. While 1962 had seen ex-GNR 0.6.0s predominate on the GNR section, now, with the recent purchases of a trio of S class from CIE, now-neglected filthy 4.4.0s were to the fore again. The last NCC "W" class 2.6.0, No. 104, did take a train from Sion Mills to Belfast, however. Passenger workings on the GNR by these locos was rare. As the year ended, a new dawn was about to break. If the railway hadn't been run down enough, the lowest ebb of the dark clouds of the Benson Report was about to appear. This would result in first, almost halving what little was left of the UTA network, followed by a new renaissance of the rest. All goods would go, along with the Derry Road and the Warrenpoint branch. But, out of the ashes, the new 70 class railcars would come, along with - at long last - the North's first ever main line diesel locomotives being planned. But that's for another day; 1963 is hereby put to bed, as will I quite shortly. Goodnight all; we awaken to 1964 when I'm in the mood.

Good price....... could make a CIE K if the blinkers were amputated..............

Yes, the D & D ones wouldn't have had the hallmark Inchicore cabs and chimneys, thus in all reality it's a bit far fetched. However, as I said, poetic licence allows anything! On another forum someone raised the idea of painting a J15 in lined CIE green....while none ever were, who's to say it wouldn't look well! To give an idea of just how immeasurably important these engines were, and how they are absolutely essential to ANY layout on CIE (bar the Midland section!) in CIE times, I gleaned from Leslie McAllister's excellent book on these engines that NO LESS THAN 72 were STILL in traffic (technically at least) in 1958; most of these lasting until the end of steam during 1962. Go back just a few years earlier, to 1955, and we find that there are NINETY-NINE J15s on the books. That's MOST of them. Other classes came and went, but the standard J15s were the absolute backbone of the southern system for years. The only GSR / CIE areas they never went to were the West Cork system (where none ever ventured at all), the Tramore line and so on. As well as the ex-GSWR system, they became staples on the WLWR & DSER lines. However, with the MGWR having their own equivalent in the forms of the J18s, they were very rare visitors to the Midland section, and apart from the Limerick - Sligo line having been built, might never have seen Sligo at all. In the very short few years (about 1959-62), there were low single figures instances of them appearing round Amiens Street, and possibly a ballast or something to Drogheda. Now - before modellers get excited about buying 99 models, bear in mind that by 1960 there were numerous variations in boilers, smokeboxes, cabs, and so on. Only so many looked exactly like the 00 Works model. If I can find out a definitive list of what locos corresponded exactly to the model I'll post it; maybe Roderick or Leslie can throw light on this? For those interested, the locomotives on the books in 1958 were as follows, most remaining until 1961-3: 101 105 106 108 109-11 114 116 118 119 121-8 130-134 136-9 140 141 143 149 152 154 156 157 161-2 164 166-8 170-2 176 179 181-6 188 190 193-8 200 223 229 232 253-6

Static displays will rotate much of his collection. Many of the post-Fry models which ran in Malahide were, apart from being 0 gauge, very crude indeed by any standards. I am not sure what will happen to them but I wouldn’t think they’d be disposed of.

Depends on their budget! Yes, the Fry stuff will be mostly in glass cases. The new layout will be 00 scale, thus the Fry stuff of a larger scale wouldn’t be able to operate on it anyway. Careful wording in marketing materials will therefore be of great importance!

It’s as good as certain that 186 was the first of the class in Portadown. Any visit of a southern engine to the GNR was never going to be likely. The BCDR managed to have a GSR (ex DSER) loco on loan at one stage, and the NCC and GNR swooped 4.4.0s at another time. I think that in that short window at the end of the 1950s, the GNR and steam, a J15 may have got to Drogheda or even Dundalk, but Portadown would have to be a stage too far in CIE times, let alone GNR days like 1956. However, poetic licence....... “something” has broken down, at the very time that a J has unusually got to Dundalk; there’s the excuse!

I think I recall seeing 018 about the time of my 18th birthday in newish supertrain livery.... Drogheda, I think....!

The loose coupled trains largely disappeared in 1975, though a few operations continued a little longer. Loco livery would be “supertrain” with an occasional black’n’tan still about. Wagon livery for 1973-5: Goods vans: about two thirds of them were brown all over, rest grey all over. A handful of the grey ones still with snails. Open wagons: no wooden sided ones left in traffic. Bullied opens all grey (and dirt!) all over. Brake vans: all brown. No grey ones left in traffic. Fitted container flats: all brown. Carriages: all black’n’tan except new Mk 2. Don’t forget: nothing ever had a black chassis or roof. Brown wagon - brown chassis. Grey wagon - grey chassis. If you go for 1971-3, fewer brown wagons, fewer supertrain liveried locos. Prior to 1972, all locos black’n’tan. Prior to 1970, no brown wagons, but a few wooden opens still about. Hope that’s helpful.

Gauge 1 would be easier to model simply because fiddly details are larger and more manageable! The smaller the gauge, the more unforgiving it is for anything but the finest high quality engineering, straight lines and clumsy painting! But of course it needs space.

Colours are absolutely SPOT on. Those curtains looked darker when clean.

What a beast!

Well, I believe he wasn't even there when he didn't do it.

"Tesco Special Horse Meat Van Box"! Three for 79p stg...... every little helps! Made out of genuine British Horse! 1.00% natural! (product of Zyxclistan) Contains: E342, E309, Cylohitsafgh Substitute, 190g genetically modified American sugar corn syrup, 890g salt, E443, monosodiumate glucosamine-glycol, petrol, desiccated rat proteins, horse extract, rabbit dropping, arsenic (tesco special recipe), horse meat, E1098, clarified granite extract, Trump extract, Brexit juice, Artificially inseminated jihobi seeds, extremist Islamic texts, MGWR modified ballast extract, paraquat, strawberry jam.

Post Brexit, Tesco will have their cheque book out......

Ah! It’ll have to be another time - I’m in Thailand.....

Repaint? Green or grey? Nice either way - the above green is too light. Nice model. Love to see an 0 gauge loco like this in action.

Interesting, Tony - that would have been during my dad’s time as District Engineer in Enniskillen.

Excellent news, Leslie! (awaits 803 and 804 being built!)

He'd be overqualified. I'd like to see one o'those Inchicore types produce finescale kits like he does!

I've a vague notion it was a dark bluish or grey colour at first, but (filthy!) brown at the end.

Norman Foster has some good logs of them - must ask when I see him.

It was an experimental beet container, and only the one was made. It only got about 2 or 3 seasons before beet finished.

Talking of which, J15s could dis turn at times. Senior wasn't a “timer” as such, but like me did it a small number of times just for the experience. He was out and about one day, and found himself at Port Laoise. The normal train he was due to get back to Dublin had a 400 class on it - he had been hoping for an 800. The signalman told him there was an extra following it. He decided to await the extra just to see what it had. The main train arrived, heavily laden, and departed. Then came the extra. It was a J15 with (I think) about six old maroon wooden bogies and maybe a six wheeler. “Wish I’d gone with the 400”, he thought. Up he hopped onto the footplate (as he often did; his solitary trip to Burtonport had been aboard a 4.8.0!), and off went the loco - reaching speeds of well over 60, and with very smart acceleration, as he recalled..... the crew seemed determined to flog it! It was probably between 1940 and 1943. Even then, the GSR could pull more than a few rabbits out of hats. Bob Clements also recalled some very smart performances from J15s on passenger trains.

If you look at the pics of my grandfather's model, from which the actual GSWR paint was matched, you'll notice that I deliberately took pictures of it in sunshine, natural light shade, and artificial light. In photos, the variation is remarkable. This also explains the variation in recollections of the real thing. If anything, the real thing looks slightly darker even than the above pic. Good to see the correct coloured "snail"; none were ever white, yellow or anything else. Cabside numbers pale yellow - I'm presuming that's what's on here. Eye witnesses said that when newly painted, the grey had "bluish" tint. This was evident when 186 was correctly painted grey by the RPSI about ten years ago (she still has it in Whitehead museum), and on the above model. In traffic, especially in CIE days, they got very dirty very quickly, and tended to stay that way. Thus, a heavy dose of weathering is a good thing to have! Wheels grey too, by the way, and buffer stocks. Easy to organise!

It is, Irishrail201. It’s an exact copy from actual Inchicore grey paint. I now have a problem! I am DROOLING so much, I’m having trouble sending the payment for my two of these beautiful beasts!!!!!