Noel

EDIT: CROSSED with post above - OUCH! Web photos, light, camera, scanners, white balance, JPG colour tone, etc, all leave room for colour tonal differences. Examining a pair of old and new in the flesh is the only way to make a sound judgement, or a well taken photo of a pair of MM Mk2s, one earlier orange roofed IE/IR livery above one of the new supertrain livery coach. Side by side the supertrain coaches should and may have a different colour to the later IE/IR coaches, but only the mk1 eyeball can tell for sure. Despite the photos on this thread suggesting otherwise, I would be really surprised if they were the exact same colour. Have a look in a retail store to be sure and compare them side by side in the flesh!

That's a great bit of history. I knew they had a railway but never realised how extensive it was. I am familiar with the so called 'Guinness' GCC barges known as M-Boats that shipped guinness to Limerick and the west of Ireland via the grand canal to the Shannon. Many of these GCC (Grand canal company) barges were restored as pleasure vessels on the Shannon lakes and Grand canal. The picture below of 68M is a broad beam barge that used to be operated as part of CIE's canal fleet until about 1960. Ironically it was the onset of railways that killed commercial traffic on the Grand and Royal canals. Luckily they weren't filled in and converted to motorways during the 60s after CIE ceased canal operations. More info here: http://www.heritageboatassociation.ie 68M in Limerick - Used to deliver Guinness from Dublin to ports on the Shannon navigation via the Grand Canal.

Wow how did I miss this. Only just spotted this layout video now after reading of Kirleys gradient wheel slip. Another wonderful layout that looks incredible fun to operate. I like the long runs and industrial feel. An amazing layout. The connection to the other room is really clever. Looks like you could almost operate as two separate layouts or one long one as per the video.

Enjoyable video. Your layout and scenery is excellent. We have a 3.3% gradient transitioning from the lower layout to the upper level which is rarely used. So far MM diesels have had no problem, but I blew a tcs decoder on an older Bachmann 0-6-0 steam loco hauling a goods train up the hill a few months ago, lots of smoke! I guess the current load exceeded the decoders capability despite being rated for 1.3amp. The motors and gearing in older models can draw a lot more current than modern kit like Bachmann and MM which have better gearing than the toys of yesteryear.

It's all in the eye of the beholder. 35 years ago I could not stomach the bright orange plastic on the Hornby CIE Hymek loco so hand painted it a darker shade, but never got around to the mk2a coaches. That photo represents nearly all the Irish passenger rolling stock I had back in 1978. Lima mk1s, and Hornby mk2s in horrible day-glo orange plastic, but they were the best one could get RTR back then. Pretty poor by todays standards. However, thanks to Paddy Murphy's business, I am now delighted to have a fleet of superb GM locos, rakes of superb Craven coaches and even a few Mk2d's to tarnish our layouts rails, combined with IFMs park royals and SF GSVs. Happy days, all my dreams for irish model railways have come true. MM have raised the bar so high our expectations have grown to new heights, perhaps unfairly so, but at €56 each it is a pity the colour seems slightly off the mark with the new coaches.

Off topic, but that must be one of the best photos of an MM loco. Super pic.

Enjoy Eoin. They look fine models. So which colour is correct? I know this is a mk3 but the darker colour seems more correct through the distant haze of my memory. I thought only the later IR/IE livery mk3/mk2 coaches used the brighter orange. The new ST coaches look an almost identical shade of orange to the earlier MM mk2d's.

Interesting question. Wonder if the EGVs were produced in the same proportionate quantity as the other coach types in each of the former Mk2d production runs? They may have been introduced later. Btw, does anybody know if all MM Mk2d's were specially tooled for MM (i.e. new moulds) or were existing bachmann BR Mk2e injection moulds painted in IE/IR liveries? The EGVs and Restaurants must have been new tooling.

The Galway EGVs make good donors for respray into IE/IR orange or black roof Mk2d's. If the shade of orange on the super train coaches is the same as the IE/IR Mk2's then the ST EGVs may make even better donors for respray into IE/IR orange or black roof.

PM sent

Stunning and being N scale warrants even more superlatives.

I will try and post a video in next day or so of the two different locos pulling coaches. Pictures can be better than words. Cheers all. MODS: Please feel free to close this if you wish

Forgive me gentlemen, but that sounds just a little bit condescending. I scratch build my model aircraft but I 'choose' to buy RTR model rail stock simple because generally RTR is of a far higher quality, and I don't have the time. I have never seen a scratch built, Q kit or MIR kit build of a CIE GM loco that looks remotely as good as a high quality Bachmann or Murphy model. Close up none of the best I've seen measure up against high quality mass produced RTR models. There are enough botched looking hand built, modified or repainted models out there. I did it myself 40 years ago and admit most of what I built back then was awful looking junk by todays standards. As for the A class I have just bought (with a cheque book), it is just fine for now and good enough for my personal taste, until and if a higher quality injection moulded plastic model becomes available at some stage in the future, or perhaps even a 3D model that does not have dappled orange peel effect on flat surfaces and has fine scale details. I make no apologies for being an 'out of the box' modeller. I choose to spend my time on layout construction, layout scenery, and most importantly of all - running trains. We are all different and are drawn by different aspects of the hobby, all are valid interests, but please don't slag off those that do not build their own model locos or suggest we are not 'real modellers'. We all have choice and valid reasons behind our choices. Now it is not my intention to cause a row or any bad feeling on this thread, I am sure no real offence was intended. So lets remain modelling pals, some of the layouts and models on this forum are awesome and inspiring. I am full of admiration for those who choose to build models to such high standards, and have both the skills and time to do so. Best regards Noel

Thanks, that makes more sense the SAR needs.

Hi Folks If one is building up layers of plasticard to form complex compound curves what glue do folks use so that the joints cut easily, file and sand easily? I'm fairly ok on this with wooden model aircraft materials (e.g. balsa and lite ply), but I've only ever used polystyrene cement with plasticard before, or white PVA glue to stick plasticard to balsa structural beams on buildings. Many thanks. Also is there a plastic or similar filler glue folks use with plasticard? Noel

Eurostar and TGV the two fastest trains in Europe don't have coloured doors! Neither do Belmond luxury trains, so I suspect nor will the Hibernian express. Or is it the typical Irish state thing to lift the EU carpet in search of as many daft regulations hidden underneath we could comply with to be 'good Europeans'. Doors on passenger jets aren't either. Another example of H&S PCness gone mad. The French have the strenght to ignore daft EU regs.

What really suits passenger trains is horizontally linear colour schemes and no vertical colour breaks, like silly doors on Irish Rails plastic rail buses, or wavey patterns.

I tend to agree.

Hi George No I used to be a member of SRFC in Wicklow. Most of my old flying pals now operate out of a club up in Roundwood. It's been a while since I was on that scene. Well spotted, the canopy in the box behind belongs to an AT-6 Texan/Harvard which is also about 102" scratch built from plans. And yes the bomb bay will have operating doors and working bomb releases (micro parachute types for recovery and flower bombs for target competitions). The cockpit panel beside the MM loco actually belongs to the AT-6. Also used to fly choppers and pattern aerobatics many moons ago, but once I got used to petrol motors I never wanted to hear the screech of a high revving glo motors ever again! That end of the hobby has pretty much gone electric now anyway, and quad copters have ruined flying. Noel

Another side of my modelling hobby is RC model aircraft B25 Mitchell of 'Dolittle Raiders' fame. The MM 141 loco on bottom of pic gives a sense of scale. Construction is spruce spars, lite ply formers and carved balsa planked sheeting. Its a Nick Ziroli plan, about 101 inch wingspan. Part of the tail plane. When finished she will be covered with a very thin layer of fibreglass cloth (i.e. instead of dope and tissue as used on smaller models) and then painted. She will have a pair of Zenoah 38cc petrol engines and controlled by Multiplex radio kit. Have an 80% completed AT6 Texan/Harvard ready for spraying which will have a Zenoah 60cc petrol motor. But the RC scale hobby is being parked now for a long break while I get working on the layout.

Agree, the euro has gone south against all major currencies and labour costs have increased in the far east. These products are targeted at a collectors market, not the toy train segment. None of us like price increases at a time of deflation in the eurozone, but its just economics as these models are manufactured outside the eurozone. Its €6 extra per coach, so for a rake of six it will cost an additional €36 which is what one will save on petrol/diesel in only two or three weeks with dropping oil prices.

Forgive late post on this old thread, catching up on some interesting reading. While the livery is a little dull, it's not bad looking and has that essential horizontal linear consistency needed for trains. No silly wavey shapes or vertical colour changes. It seems to matter little anyway as rail cars, ICRs, and DMUs look hideous plastic buses on rails. All changed, changed utterly, the most boring looking railway since Black and Tan days.

Thanks. Well back in 1979 the Lima was the only way one could have a vaguely looking CIE diesel loco on a layout. Things change, standards ever rise. But at least the SF passes the duck test whereas the Lima fails the 1st test. It doesn't look remotely like a duck! Before the advent of MM quality I'd have been ecstatic with the SF, but now I am merely pleased with it. It'll do for now cause I don't see an MM one on the horizon and I'm not sure if 3D in the short term could compare with injection moulded plastic for fine scale detail and quality. But here is hoping and things are every changing. I'd speculate if MM did ever produce an A class they could probably outsell 121 by a factor of 3 to 1 in popularity. Anyway I just put the pics up so folks could see them side by side and make their own mind up either way.

Just received a Silverfox A class from SF direct. Overall very pleased, especially when compared with my Lima so called A class which is really a BR class 33 painted in super train livery. Glad I decided not to bother cannibalising the Lima as the chassis is a hideous runner. I will tweak a few things on the SF like correcting the white splash above the cab windows and lowering the tan band along the sides, but even as it stands I'm very happy with it compared to my Lima. May add some of the SSM detailing parts. Obviously being a resin body its not up to the same level of detail as injection moulded plastic bodies like MM models, but for a low volume manufacturer it ticks my boxes for now and am very pleased with it. The chassis is a nice runner too. Silverfox A class near Lima A class (BR class 33) Side by side SF above, Lima below. The light weathering greatly helps the look of the SF. One above the other

Hi Alan. Yes it is an SF purchased direct as an RTR. Delivery was about 8 weeks as promised. The gentle weathering was included for the list price, and the Hornby decoder was fitted for an extra £20 to the Hornby chassis during build by John in SF. I haven't had time to play around with CVs yet as it's just out of the box, so only changed its address to 20 for a quick test run, but I expect to reduce CV5 to reduce the top speed, and also give a little more inertia using CV3 & CV4 so make it less responsive to throttle changes. Initial test run last night was it ran well on the Hornby class 55 chassis running slowly over Peco code 100 insulfrog points without any stalling. Over all I am pleased with the model which is a vast improvement on my Lima 'A class' locos which were repainted BR class 33s. Its not up to MM standards of detail, but for a resin body it ticks all my boxes for now and looks well with my CIE coaching stock. All the best. Noel. PS: I also ordered a weathered Dutch GSV in Black and Tan livery which looks great with Cravens or Park Royals.