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jhb171achill
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When I did the Waterford greenway, I asked the folks in one of the bike rental shops if he cycles the greenway. He cycles often from Dungarvan to Waterford but still never uses the greenway 

 

turns out some of the Pro’s won’t use the greenway as it isn't seen as the same as cycling the road. It is the view of some cycles that greenways are a recreational space hence they need to constantly overtake slow recreational cyclists (how ironic is that!) particularly….if time can be saved by using the roads 

 

In my part of the world, this is a bit worrying as the road to kinsale is often a cyclist magnet and proposed greenway is not as direct as the road. There would be 3kms of a difference. It would make some difference but obviously the hardcore guys mightn’t use it….

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Try cycling on them - I haven't used any in Ireland, because there aren't any in the vicinity that I frequent, but most on the Big Island are useless and often actually dangerous, they give the impression of being done simply for 'effect', rather than with any intention of being useful.

I've never seen a bike on either of these - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.8065686,-2.0933096,3a,75y,120.28h,56.98t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sI7Oofzf6vbw0TiWNVL3uSw!2e0!6shttps:%2F%2Fstreetviewpixels-pa.googleapis.com%2Fv1%2Fthumbnail%3Fpanoid%3DI7Oofzf6vbw0TiWNVL3uSw%26cb_client%3Dsearch.revgeo_and_fetch.gps%26w%3D96%26h%3D64%26yaw%3D42.05714%26pitch%3D0%26thumbfov%3D100!7i16384!8i8192 - there would usually be more cars parked along there than in the picture - especially at weekends and in the evening - you won't last long, weaving in and out of that lot.

Also, cycle lanes to the side of a road tend, pretty much always, to remove the priority at every side-road. This is a classic example of that - https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.8307723,-2.1088423,3a,75y,285.18h,101.68t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sP9GQZGBuJOZVodUalXa6qg!2e0!7i16384!8i8192 - four Give Way/Yield situations in a few yards, with cars approaching from anywhere, instead of just cycling past...

Pretty much the only one that I would use in Stafford is, amusingly, a bit of the old Uttoxeter rail line, where the above issues hardly apply much.

 

 

I will say that the general motorist's attitude to cyclists in Ireland has been a revelation over the last couple of years. People in Ireland drive like maiden aunts compared to the homicidal maniacs I'm used to on the Big Island.

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1 hour ago, jhb171achill said:

Local authorities put in cycleways and cycle lanes, often at significant cost, often at the behest of cycling groups / cyclists.

THEN, once they’re built, these people insist on STILL cycling on the road!

WHY!!???

In Dublin I see cyclelanes used quite often on the trek from drumcondra station up to uni, albeit this is a lane mainly on the footpath rather than the road, if that makes sense. Those bloody scooters are the menace there, but its certainly used. All the same I still see cyclists in front of the busses...right in the middle of the bus lane like..

As for cyclelanes, I've used the Mullingar-Athlone greenway a good bit and I can sum up traffic as follows

Mullingar-Castletown: usually pretty busy with walkers, cyclists, runners, etc.

Castletown-Streamstown-Moate: Usually totally deserted. Streamstown station has seen major renovation though, playground there I think. The bank is falling away in places on the trackside coming into Moate.

Moate to Athlone: f*ck all once you're past Moate for miles, nobody at all until you pass the bridge carrying the main road into Athlone, then chock a block as you're going in. The recent extension with the tunnel was pretty underused in comparison. I found it a tortorously boring slog once past Moate.

What you see is 'hubs' of activity from the big towns and villages for maybe a mile or so, and then you could go on for ages without seeing anyone else. 

AIT is right there as you go into Athlone, really can't see how the greenway is justified when put against the loss of the ability to reopen it for commuter traffic.

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1 hour ago, Westcorkrailway said:

When I did the Waterford greenway, I asked the folks in one of the bike rental shops if he cycles the greenway. He cycles often from Dungarvan to Waterford but still never uses the greenway 

 

turns out some of the Pro’s won’t use the greenway as it isn't seen as the same as cycling the road. It is the view of some cycles that greenways are a recreational space hence they need to constantly overtake slow recreational cyclists (how ironic is that!) particularly….if time can be saved by using the roads 

 

In my part of the world, this is a bit worrying as the road to kinsale is often a cyclist magnet and proposed greenway is not as direct as the road. There would be 3kms of a difference. It would make some difference but obviously the hardcore guys mightn’t use it….

This is the issue here, they're planned by people who haven't cycled since they were in short pants and who expect ALL cyclists to flock to them. Urban routes especially begin and end at random and are more of a box-ticking exercise for councils. Like fast walkers and slow walkers on narrow footpaths, team lycra and the non lycra clad cyclists cannot coexist peacefully, with each other or with other users...walkers, dog walkers, runner, joggers, kids, and now scooters. The room simply isn't there for all comers to freely do as they wish. 

Whatever about motorist vs cyclist hate, I think we can agree on the fact that electric scooters are hated by pretty much everyone else.

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Sometime ago the Green party were proposing that people who wished to concrete or tarmac their drive way would need planning permission. They said all of these concrete/tarmac driveways were causing too much run off of rain water as the water was not able to soak into the ground. Yet they have no problem putting a hard, non porous surface for miles/kms on cycle lanes. Not much soakage there. As for digging up hillsides/bogland to put in windmills....What is that doing for soakage/runoff?

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23 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Local authorities put in cycleways and cycle lanes, often at significant cost, often at the behest of cycling groups / cyclists.

THEN, once they’re built, these people insist on STILL cycling on the road!

WHY!!???

Because the cycleways and lanes aren't built following any design standard and oftentimes are more dangerous to use then sticking to the road. 

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On 22/9/2022 at 5:08 PM, Broithe said:

...... People in Ireland drive like maiden aunts compared to the homicidal maniacs I'm used to on the Big Island.

Mmmm, many of the homicidal maniacs I see in the City of London are cyclists. Many think red lights don't apply to them and will brazenly ride through pedestrians who have the green man showing at crossings, whilst others insist on riding on the pavements rather than using the purpose-designed cycle lanes. You cannot design and build for those who want to be wilfully stupid.

And that's before we factor in e-scooter riders, all of whom are accidents waiting to happen and all of whom I think should be shot.

If you give people technological privilege, you can be sure it will be abused.

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8 hours ago, DoctorPan said:

Because the cycleways and lanes aren't built following any design standard and oftentimes are more dangerous to use then sticking to the road. 

Ok - though - first, the one I’m primarily thinking of (Baldoyle - Malahide) is parallel to the road, therefore ultra-safe; and (second) straighter, quicker and (albeit marginally) shorter, WAY safer …….

When I see the Lycra Taliban on THAT road………..hmmmm

 

Daughter-the-middle had a row with some of them one evening. They accused her of “taking over the road”.

I WISH  I had been with her. My comments would not have been best reported here………..

Thankfully, she suggested various private places where they might park their bikes …….. permanently; irrespective of potential physical lack of comfort……

AND their Lycra shorts, helmets - and - ye get the idea.

Rant over (for the moment) and goodnight.

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On 24/9/2022 at 1:05 AM, jhb171achill said:

Ok - though - first, the one I’m primarily thinking of (Baldoyle - Malahide) is parallel to the road, therefore ultra-safe; and (second) straighter, quicker and (albeit marginally) shorter, WAY safer …….

 

Ah that brings me to the 2nd point. That is a greenway and no-one can decide if a greenway is for commuting cycling or only for leisure.  Some greenways including the one mentioned above offically state that they are only for pedresians and leisure cyclists and those commuting should refrain from using. Then out of the other side of the mouth say that they are putting in cycling facilices and cyclists aren't using it. 

 

We've basically conditioned cyclists to not use the cycling infrastructure because we half arse it, can't decide if they should use it, actually design it correctly and keep cars off it.  End of the day though is bikes have as much right to be on the road as cars and most motorists need to remember that.  Plus every bike is one less car in traffic.

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