Stored Oil Tank wagons

[JasonB]

15 minutes ago, ttc0169 said:

 

Fantastic shots, Noel. 

[murphaph]

On 28/12/2021 at 3:55 PM, warb said:

Texaco/Caltex loose coupled Class A Tank wagon 114

Warb

 

Any idea where this was taken?

[warb]

22/11/1996

warb

[murphaph]

Cheers @warb, and the location if you know it?

[warb]

rear of the running shed Inchicore

warb

[murphaph]

Nice! Thx.

[bufferstop]

Back in a previous life, I used to discharge oil cars and refuel 071's and 201's. 

I'm not joking when I say the discharge process was complicated. It all involved the correct turning of valves in a sequence that wasn't straightforward. There was also a big wrench involved. 

I got one practical demonstration on it, with a warning to write it all down. The wisest advice ever, and that became a very valued piece of paper.

So, that was it, I was trained, and the next oil car that came down was my responsibility. One of the first thing to do was climb up and partially jam open the lid and let the air in. Than start  to hook up the hose. open the valves in the correct order, and then and only then, open the main valve on the oil car. If you hadn't the line set up and the diesel started flowing, it wasn't going to be pretty... 

Anyway, tank replenished, you could refuel the locos. The 071's had a basic nozzle like in a forecourt. It had a cut off like a car as far as I remember, but you couldn't leave it unattended.

The 201's had a different bespoke system. They had a hose that locked onto the fuel tank, you locked it on, turned on the pump and it fed away until it hit the cut off point automatically.

Now, normally, I never had to put more than 1000-1500 litres into one, before they cut off, as they had been already fuelled In Inchicore that morning, an odd time , maybe around 2000l. I'd usually hop up into the loco, have the craic with the driver, he was waiting to drop it up to the shed, there was a fuel gauge up between the windows. It might take 5-10 minutes.

One night we were watching it go up and up, so much so that I thought it was misreading and went down to shut it off.. I don't know whether the limiter was broke, but there was 3300 litres pumped into it.  Now I know the tank capacity was nominally 4,500l, but it was limited well below that. It must have waddled out the next morning. 3300 litres is over 3.5 ton of fuel.......

Then it went over to being serviced by road, and another bit of the old railway evaporated.

[murphaph]

Where was that @bufferstop?

[bufferstop]

30 year old rule, Murph, state records get revealed before railway (redacted) ones....

[murphaph]

Before the refuelling facilities were added in Heuston, how often would a loco need to visit Inchicore for refuelling roughly? Daily? After every turn?

[johnfromoz]

On 29/12/2021 at 1:02 AM, seagoebox said:

A couple of pictures of the fuel oil train from the Alexander Road depot at the oil siding at Inchicore

007 on 5th March 1990, note the health & safety conscious guard has lit the stove in his van next the engine!

181 on 1st July 1992 with the fuel tanks behind the loco, by this time the guards van ceased to be used, the guard travelled in the  loco cab.

The first picture (of 007) is, I think significant in itself, portraying an A in original Supertrain livery well into 1990.  Thanks. Great pics.

[DJ Dangerous]

On 28/12/2021 at 2:02 PM, seagoebox said:

A couple of pictures of the fuel oil train from the Alexander Road depot at the oil siding at Inchicore

007 on 5th March 1990, note the health & safety conscious guard has lit the stove in his van next the engine!

181 on 1st July 1992 with the fuel tanks behind the loco, by this time the guards van ceased to be used, the guard travelled in the  loco cab.

 

When did 007 get the IR logos and the "S" suffix?

https://irishrailwaymodels.com/collections/locomotives/products/007-a-class-locomotive

[seagoebox]

I came across these while trawling through my files.... Limerick 9.6.1988

[flange lubricator]

Great pictures the First two are ESSO? ( Frist one class A ,second on class B possibly) wagons built by Charles Roberts and brought in Ex UK in 1969/1970.

 

Edited January 2, 2022 by flange lubricator

[Vlak]

Great pictures! The two photos above show two different types of oil wagons. The first wagon (grey & red) was formerly class A(?) oil wagons imported from Britain for use on the Esso Oil traffic from Dublin to Sligo Quay and Claremorris. As far as I’m aware they retained their original chassis and were simply re-gauged, and were therefore longer than most other 2-axle wagons in Ireland. 

The lower photo of the Burmah Oil wagons is interesting. There were several series of tank wagons built by CIE to two different designs. The ones depicted below had longer tanks extended the length of the wagon frame, while the one shown in ttc0169’s photo is the other variety with a shorter tank. These wagons were all mounted on 12ft wheelbase flats, same as the cement bubbles, and both varieties of wagons were used by Irish Rail up until 2006 for internal movements of fuel oil. 

Anyone have any information on the Burmah Oil oil flows, where did they run to / from and when did they cease?

It always occurred to me that IRM could easily replicate at least one variety of the fuel oil wagons by using their existing cement bubble ‘flat’ and modifying their weed spray tanks to sit on top with some minor adjustments and tweaks, although perhaps easier said than done!  

[JasonB]

27 minutes ago, Vlak said:

It always occurred to me that IRM could easily replicate at least one variety of the fuel oil wagons by using their existing cement bubble ‘flat’ and modifying their weed spray tanks to sit on top with some minor adjustments and tweaks, although perhaps easier said than done!  

I like your thinking. Sounds very good to me  

[flange lubricator]

28 minutes ago, Vlak said:

 These wagons were all mounted on 12ft wheelbase flats, same as the cement bubbles, and both varieties of wagons were used by Irish Rail up until 2006 for internal movements of fuel oil. 

 

Yes and in the picture you can clearly see the spigots for mounting containers on.

[murphaph]

Those Burmah ones look great. 

[flange lubricator]

Allegedly the ESSO wagons being imported from the UK in the early 1970's came complete with overhead wire warning plates thus being the first rolling stock in Ireland to carry them even though we didnt get our first overhead wires until 1981!

Edited January 2, 2022 by flange lubricator

[warb]

another oil tank at inchicore

[Mayner]

2 hours ago, Vlak said:

Anyone have any information on the Burmah Oil oil flows, where did they run to / from and when did they cease?

 

Wagon Numbers 26723-26728 Texaco Siding Tivoli Cork to Limerick.

4 Wagons were introduced in Dark Blue for Class B (heavy oil) and 2 Wagons Class A Traffic in light grey and red. 

I haven't been able to find a photo of the Class A wagons on line, but there is a photo of a Class A wagon in an IRRS journal from 1972-3.

The arrangement of the Class A markings was unusual rather that a silver or dove grey barrel with a horizontal red stripe or red solebars, the upper section of the tank was painted grey and the lower section painted red.

Traffic started 1972 ceased by early 1990s when the wagons were re-purposed for Mollasses traffic from Foynes to different destinations.

The ESSO tank wagons were simply re-gauged ESSO UK tank wagons some of which initially ran with the ESSO logo.

ESSO tank wagon barrels was stored in a compound outside Inchacore  works for most of the 1970s, I don't know if these were retained as spares for the ESSO Teo wagons or whether the tanks were used in 2673-26740 CIEs final batch of tank wagons introduced in 1978 which appear to have used redundant 12' wb flat wagon chassis which were also used for the Bagged Cement and Beet Doubles.

[murphaph]

9 hours ago, seagoebox said:

I came across these while trawling through my files.... Limerick 9.6.1988

Anyone able to identify the logos on these wagons?

The left hand wagon looks like it has the lower half of a badly painted Chevron logo on the end of the barrel but I doubt that's it.

What's that under the grime on the right hand wagon? Almost looks like a train hauled by a cab first 121.

 

[flange lubricator]

2 hours ago, murphaph said:

Anyone able to identify the logos on these wagons?

The left hand wagon looks like it has the lower half of a badly painted Chevron logo on the end of the barrel but I doubt that's it.

What's that under the grime on the right hand wagon? Almost looks like a train hauled by a cab first 121.

 

The chevron is actually a trailer  end/rear chevron as fitted to a road trailer the running on the road at Dublin port .

[h gricer]

On 29/12/2021 at 10:38 PM, murphaph said:

Any idea where this was taken?

There was 4 of these stored in Dardinell sidings North Wall for many years 113 115 116 118, they were loose coupled and dated back to 1925 according to the plates on them, I remember taking photos of them at the Stonebank there week they were removed in October 1997, that's an interesting photo of 114 at Inchicore, the 4 in North Wall were sold to a farmer I recall.

[warb]

A few other photos

[Mayner]

On 3/1/2022 at 10:01 AM, seagoebox said:

I came across these while trawling through my files.... Limerick 9.6.1988

The two tank wagons appear to be different variants of the ESSO tank wagons.

The wagon on the left is a re-gauged ESSO UK Class A Tank wagon similar to the Heljan model https://fromemodelcentre.com/heljan-oo-gauge-4-wheel-a-tank-4089-in-esso-grey-with-esso-logo.html, the wagon on the right appears to have the shorter Class B barrel https://www.hattons.co.uk/203072/heljan_1102_4_wheel_b_tank_3328_in_esso_black_with_esso_petroleum_lettering/stockdetail but set up to handle Class A Traffic.

The end chevron s were replaced with self adhesive marker strip used on trucks and trailers at some stage during the 1990s most likely to improve visibility to road users on the Alexandra Road Tramway. The tank wagons were shunted on the Tramway using Port and Docks Board Tractors (Big purpose built 4w drive). The laden ESSO oil trains were made up ready for collection by an IE loco late just inside the Port Gates on Alexandra Road.

[murphaph]

The yellow stripes on the sides look very American, although they are vertically applied in the US. Or are the faded side vehicle warning stickers too?

[flange lubricator]

3 hours ago, murphaph said:

The yellow stripes on the sides look very American, although they are vertically applied in the US. Or are the faded side vehicle warning stickers too?

They used standard trailer markings for the sides yellow / green and for the rear red both come in right/ left as used on HGV's in Ireland.

Edited January 4, 2022 by flange lubricator

[Ironroad]

On 2/1/2022 at 4:01 PM, seagoebox said:

I came across these while trawling through my files.... Limerick 9.6.1988

 

16 hours ago, Mayner said:

The two tank wagons appear to be different variants of the ESSO tank wagons.

The wagon on the left is a re-gauged ESSO UK Class A Tank wagon similar to the Heljan model https://fromemodelcentre.com/heljan-oo-gauge-4-wheel-a-tank-4089-in-esso-grey-with-esso-logo.html, the wagon on the right appears to have the shorter Class B barrel https://www.hattons.co.uk/203072/heljan_1102_4_wheel_b_tank_3328_in_esso_black_with_esso_petroleum_lettering/stockdetail but set up to handle Class A Traffic.

The end chevron s were replaced with self adhesive marker strip used on trucks and trailers at some stage during the 1990s most likely to improve visibility to road users on the Alexandra Road Tramway. The tank wagons were shunted on the Tramway using Port and Docks Board Tractors (Big purpose built 4w drive). The laden ESSO oil trains were made up ready for collection by an IE loco late just inside the Port Gates on Alexandra Road.

Does anyone know the Irish running numbers of the Esso UK class A tank wagons? The  Heljan model represents them as they were when imported,  I recollect seeing a picture elsewhere on the site of one being unloaded I believe at Nth Wall . The picture above indicates the tank supports were modified at some point does anyone know when this occurred?

[Mayner]

16 hours ago, Ironroad said:

 

Does anyone know the Irish running numbers of the Esso UK class A tank wagons? The  Heljan model represents them as they were when imported,  I recollect seeing a picture elsewhere on the site of one being unloaded I believe at Nth Wall . The picture above indicates the tank supports were modified at some point does anyone know when this occurred?

971-1013. The wagons originally ran with the ESSO shields similar to the UK wagons, the shields were removed and the  redesigned tank supports fitted by the mid 1980s

There is a good selection of colour photos of these wagons in the IRRS Photo Archive Wagon Album  https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/

The IRRS subscription is worth it for access to the photo archive alone.

[flange lubricator]

41 minutes ago, Mayner said:

971-1013. The wagons originally ran with the ESSO shields similar to the UK wagons, the shields were removed and the  redesigned tank supports fitted by the mid 1980s

There is a good selection of colour photos of these wagons in the IRRS Photo Archive Wagon Album  https://www.flickr.com/photos/irishrailwayarchive/

The IRRS subscription is worth it for access to the photo archive alone.

Yes there is a wealth of pictures on the IRRS flickr without doubt a fablous resource there also some in the O'Dea Collection .

https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000307735

Including a grain wagon in this one 

https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000307730

 

 

Edited January 5, 2022 by flange lubricator

[Ironroad]

Thank you John

[Mayner]

14 hours ago, flange lubricator said:

Yes there is a wealth of pictures on the IRRS flickr without doubt a fablous resource there also some in the O'Dea Collection .

https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000307735

Including a grain wagon in this one 

https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000307730

 

 

The 46 Mile Box de-railment photos is a great illustration of the mixed nature of rolling stock in use during the transition from the wagon load to the Liner Train era with modern and traditional rolling stock running in loose coupled goods trains.

CIE had started to introduce "modern" vacuum braked wagons capable of running at 50mph, keg traffic had recenly been palletised with open containers on standard 20T flats and ESSO had introduced redundant tank wagons from the UK to modernise its fleet. 

There seems to have been an interesting mix of "new" and traditional tank wagons in the train and a CIE truck and 20' container taking part in the recovery operation. https://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000307729

CIE was still transporting grain to Polloxfen's  Mill in GSR bulk grains wagons built in the mid 1930s some of which were still running with the flying snail logo and at least one with the wheel emblem and GSR style solid lettering. The GSR used rust resistant steel in the grain wagons so painting these wagons was a fairly low priority compared to timber and ply bodied wagons.

Derailments and runaways seems to have been an accepted part of loose coupled goods operation, there was a mid 1970s newspaper (The Indo?) report of a loose coupled goods dividing and de-railing at it departed a station on the Mayo Line, the driving arriving at the next station without noticing anything until the signal man asked what happened to the rest of his train. (Ballyhaunis-Claremorris?).

Apparently an axle broke on a wagon in the middle of the train causing the coupler to break and other wagons to pile up and de-rail behind the wagon with the broken axle meanwhile the driver continues to the next station with the front part of the train not realising what happened. The article included a photo of de-railed H Vans and Pallet Wagons.

 

[seagoebox]

A few more random pictures of tank wagons...

10 molasses wagons at Enfield, 2nd July 1995

072 on the up Sligo empty oil train at Boyle 11th August 1995

The same train waiting for the staff after crossing the 18.30 from Connolly at Killucan

Part of the spray train at Drogheda10th May 1996

[murphaph]

When did the molasses traffic cease?