jhb171achill

I presume the RPSI has Fred's collection now?

Exactly. And if stone throwing scum WERE apprehended over there, one gets the impression that both police and judges would be a lot harder on them than here, where we hear how hard a life the poor vandal has had blah blah, to nauseating ad infinitum; an insult to those from less fortunate backgrounds who have tried to make a life for themselves.....

I suppose it depends, Roxy, on what end result you want. Austrian, German or some other mainland European theme, or Welsh narrow gauge (with or without slate mines) is easy - there's loads of RTR stuff. If you want to go Irish, unless you want to scratchbuild everything to a scale of 3mm to the foot, you're better off with 00n3 (12mm gauge) track. It's a bit bigger, but not much, so almost as versatile in confined spaces. As I said, 4mm Irish on 009 track looks plain ridiculous. Recent debates on this forum have examined the HO / OO / 21mm gauges for Irish models, and there's a clear advantage in 21mm from an appearance perspective, but practicalities and most people's skills, time and budgets heavily favour 00, even though it's not technically accurate. Using 009 to represent anything Irish (or Manx) in 4mm scale is way, way worse! It's like putting the Flying Scotsman on scale 3ft gauge track, proportionately. There are many Irish kits available - a very good selection in fact. They are all 4mm, thus making 00n3 track as good as obligatory. And now you can get Peco Streamline in 00n3, which you couldn't when I started narrow-gauging, years ago. Had it been available I'd have gone for it, and my dream of a complex Donegal or West Clare system in the attic would have come to pass....

I thought of using 009 track, which of course is scale 2ft gauge-ish, to accommodate British and mainland Europe interests, but building to a scale of 3mm, but eventually compromised. I got several Irish kits but for their scale they looked better on 00n3 track. 4mm SCALE Irish stuff on 009 track just looks totally wrong (hardly surprisingly; it is!) So I switched to German / Austrian narrow gauge, with the advantages of good quality Peco 009 track and high quality RTR stuff from the likes of Roco, Liliput and Bachman. This survived two house moves and just as I was about to set it all up here, along come Messrs Worsley, Provincial, SSM, JM Design and others. Thus, the last of it is being taken in a padded box to the post office in about half an hour, while meantime Messrs ECM Trains and Baseboard Dave are in communication! Here, of course, is the real advantage of 009. With Austrian, I can fit a continuous circuit with a sizeable terminus and junction station. With 00, which I'm returning to after an absence of about forty years, I can have a small fiddle yard to shunting terminus.

I've done a lot of 009 over the years, and sitting downstairs right now is a box of it going to the 009 Society for sale (circulated here some weeks ago and much already sold....). A satisfying gauge to work with.

If I was "they", I'd get someone with a little more knowledge, and someone LOCAL who would know what they are trying to recreate! There are personages on this very forum with at the very least the same skills, so perhaps "they" might take note! I'm sure Cedric Fry or Cyril Frog would agree.

While I had no recollection of silver "hot water bottles", as reminded by Eoin, a pic appears of one in a book. So both types were silver initially, all over. The heating vans tended to get dirtier roofs quicker, due to exhaust. Both types wore green coats, then black'n'tan. The green ones did not carry "snails", just the mid-body light green line. At a guess, I'd say the last ones in green probably lasted until about 1964/5.

Eoin I'll be on to you for a couple at time some stage, then! I think you mentioned them when we spoke a couple of weeks ago, but I had already ordered these two. By the time I'm done, I'll probably want about five, in the three liveries. While I'd need to check, I don't believe that the "hot water bottles" were ever silver (thus delivered in green), but only the "suitcases" were. Both types wore green coats, then black'n'tan. At a guess, I'd say the last ones in green probably lasted until about 1964/5.

Some excellent photos. Michael always had an eye for the rare, little seen, and unusual. You will note the emphasis on passenger trains. To our younger readers this may not be noticeable as the railways for many years now have had few, or zero, goods trains on any line. But in Michael's time this was not the case - few lines DIDN'T have goods trains. So where are they? Well, a wee birdy suggests that he may have a follow up at some stage with some of the freight GEMS he has...... Drooling welcome. ....and, I might add, the possibility (time allowing) is that Rails Through Somewhere Else might see the light of day....it's been discussed, but time is not plentiful......!

Hi Glover I did see a pic of a LV in green somewhere, but it was years ago, so I've no idea where it was. My own recollections of things green would not be clear enough to ascertain which type of van I saw in real life; most of my van recollections, by far, were black'n'tan. Many vans, also a handful of carriages, went straight from unpainted to black'n'tan. Come to think of it, it's the heating van I'm inclined to think wasn't green..... I must check that.

This is a good enough quality photo of an ACTUAL transfer, as used on steam locomotives whether green, black or normal grey; on buses, road vehicles and passenger carriages. The green paint is actual CIE green paint. Having seen the original daily for forty years hung on Senior's wall, I can confirm that this photo reproduces the colours accurately. Note the gold lining. For those modelling steam, it's important to note that the "snail" on tenders was this colour, and gold lined, always - never white, as Lima implied on their early and crude models by today's standards. Nor yellow as incorrectly applied by the RPSI to 184 and 461 in the 1990s. This darker shade of green, while seen on steam locos and buses to the end, was replaced on passenger stock and diesel locomotives by the lighter shade seen on RPSI heritage stock, and at Downpatrick on some stock, from 1955 onwards. The original may be seen in Headhunters Railway Museum in Enniskillen. Many of the other mounted coats of arms there (but not all) are mounted also on boards with original paint - Clogher Valley, CDRJC, NCC, GSR (but not GSWR), and Cork, Blackrock & Passage are original paint. So are DNGR, BCDR, and DSER (loco black). One of the GNR ones is, and one is in "works grey" as it was mount on its board in the 1940s when paint was either expensive or unavailable! Feel free to copy and use as you see fit.

Yes, Tony; and I was beginning to doubt that he existed until these two Mayner vans arrived today. I had not seen JM Design products up close and personal before. Photos suggested they were by good indeed; having seen these two (one "suitcase" and one "hot water bottle" ='luggage van and heating van), I wouldn't call them "good" any more; "excellent" is more appropriate. I await future Mayner stuff with great interest! By the way, I'm after another luggage van if anyone has one to spare - ideally filthy silver or green!

A nice parcel arrived today from Pettigo Fair, Frimley. That'll keep me busy for a while. Then another arrived with an old coach from Mr Ebay....

Yes, I re-read the original post and amended my initial response as just above! I incorrectly thought you meant that the eBay seller was implying the track plans were intended to represent 1970. In reality, lifting wasn't complete, so some locations probably still had some or all of their track.

Line closed '67, book published 1970.

Where would they operate it? The Irish market and financial feasibility for such projects is worlds apart from that in Britain. Such a project is highly unlikely to satisfy an economic feasibility study.

Close enough - it was PART of the GNR with the other two, and buses!

Ah! That's 72 pints. Here, they were 88 pints! First round of drink I ever bought, about 1976, was three pints and you had change from a £1 note. 32p a pint. A night out with £5 was quite feasible. 50p to get into a night club, 32p a pint, and a burger PLUS chips on the way home 36 or 38p....

Is the premises of N Johnston there possibly that of a well known railway book publisher? See you in the Tram - it's just sixpence a pint. Up the road in Omagh it's seven pence - ridiculous. How are you supposed to live on £3 a week with that sort of thing? Hornby coaches are now nine shillings* each! (* 45p / €0.50c)

That layout captures better than any, the exact type of rural setting on so many lines in the latter half of the 20th century; perfect. Quite the atmosphere, i have to say, that I will be attempting to emulate with my current project. I'm expecting parcels from Provincial Leslie and several other eminent gentlemen shortly....

Was the old WLWR Director's Saloon (934 or 935) used as such at one time? She ended her days falling apart at Mullingar.

I think if it was me, I'd probably get a trio of LMS 0.6.0s and alter them. At a later date I'd try to add whatever I could best convert to a 4-coach AEC set.

Had I youth's blood And thoughtful mood. And heart of fire once more........

Stupid money. and it's not even steam......

Beautiful scene - the fact that they're great models is reason enough to run them anywhere!