Jawfin Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 Well done, the cab looks amazing! Way more recognisable as railcar B than the real one already! Quote
David Holman Posted January 25, 2014 Author Posted January 25, 2014 Thankyou kind sir. Appreciate B is currently somewhat undressed and unwell, to say the least. The cab controls on my model are very much a guestimate of what might be there, based on the preserved Walker Railcar at the Finn Valley in Donegal. Not sure now if I want to know how accurate I've been, though could always call my model Railcar C and assume a second one was built later! The photo link goes to some mouth watering pictures. If you ever come across any pre-CIE wagons, I for one would be very interested. Quote
Train model Posted January 25, 2014 Posted January 25, 2014 It looks fantastic id love to see it in oo gauge Quote
jhb171achill Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 The curve below window level on the front is very slight, presumably? (Looking at drawings and photos of real thing)... Quote
David Holman Posted January 26, 2014 Author Posted January 26, 2014 Hear what you say John - getting the subtle curves right is what makes diesels and the like difficult. Have just had a look at the colour albums and think the waist beading may be too wide. I used 60 x20 strip and maybe 40 would have been better. Am also increasing the tumble home on the bottom corners, with a bit more off the sides too. The dark green top coat may well make a difference as well. Will do a bit more fretting before that, but would not like to be making such adjustments in a smaller scale. Only goes to show how much effort goes into getting 4mm modern diesels right. Quote
jhb171achill Posted January 26, 2014 Posted January 26, 2014 Absolutely, David. Over the years, many a model has appeared on various layouts of the 80 class, and until the spectacularly excellent examples seen in recent months on IRM looked at all convincing - and as for AEC's! Your own stuff is top notch as we all can see. I know from my own experience trying to make an AEC car many years ago, it was an absolute and total mess and ended up in the only suitable place for it - the bin! The SLNCR railcar would have a slight curve on the front rather than a flat front... but I have great faith in your finished product - it will be a worthy addition to your layout. Quote
David Holman Posted January 27, 2014 Author Posted January 27, 2014 Following John’s gentle [& entirely justified] comments on the railcar’s front end, have been trying to improve matters. The slight curve he mentions is there, but hardly shows. I’d used a piece of 40 thou to pack out the centre [as you can see from the pics] & at the time wondered if 60 or even 80 thou would have been better, but decided that was too much. Space now for rude words… Short of a complete rebuild have tried to fettle it up a little by sanding down the corners and feathering this towards the centre – hence adding about another millimetre to the curve. Have also thinned the waist beading and that round the grille, all with the aim of telling the eye there is more to it than it thinks. Could still do with a bit more, but that is as far as I dare go for now. At least the pics against a gridline show that there IS a curve, even if it is not so apparent away from them. Just goes to show that total accuracy doesn’t always work & some things need exaggerating to show up well – something weathering guru Martyn Welch often mentions. Ho hum – have begun work on the trailer, so will endeavour to make the curve more apparent. Could well be that with the waist beading being straight at that end, things will look better anyway. A couple of pics of the sides to show what I’ve been up to. Quote
jhb171achill Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 That really looks superb, David! As I said, I can't wait to see this beast finished! My parents were very familiar with it 1950-7.... Quote
Train model Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 Hi David would you consider getting it copied by means of a 3d printer in oo scale Quote
Garfield Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 Hi David would you consider getting it copied by means of a 3d printer in oo scale 3D printers require a CAD drawing to work from. Quote
Weshty Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 David, I'm in absolute awe to your attention to detail and how straightforward you make it look. A great design philosophy. I will certainly use your thread as inspiration for the AEC railcar, if I ever get around to attempting it. At least I have a blueprint approach now! Quote
heirflick Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 this thread just keeps getting better - stunning work....as usual! Quote
Train model Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 3D printers require a CAD drawing to work from. Well is it possible to get a cad drawing from all the fantastic work that has being done Quote
David Holman Posted January 27, 2014 Author Posted January 27, 2014 Tis great to be giving a bit of inspiration to others. The basics of this model (and indeed the railbus and coach number nine), is David Jenkinson's Carriage Modeliing Made Easy, from Wild Swan. Sadly no longer with us, he writes and illustrates in a very easy to understand way. Along with the Art of Weathering and Iain Rice's books on layout design, it is one of my most used guides. Plus Gordon Gravett's ones on scenery of course. While all are more aimed at 7mm scale, there is so much that is transferable and most of all, you are given a clear feeling that their ideas are achieve able by the average modeller. More than anything else, these books have helped immensely in developing my skills and I really cannot recommend them highly enough Quote
Train model Posted January 27, 2014 Posted January 27, 2014 David all the books in the world won't make a model maker out of me Quote
David Holman Posted January 27, 2014 Author Posted January 27, 2014 As the old saying goes, every journey begins with the first step... With so many stunning rtr models now available, I am convinced that a good model railway is within the reach of anyone. The trick is knowing where to start. For me it was making buildings. These have the distinct advantage of just needing to look good, with no need to run well! The same can be said of scenery. What really got me going was 7mm narrow gauge, where freelance modelling meant I did not have to worry about total accuracy. Good fun too, making my own loco and coach or wagon bodies to run on commercial chassis. Start simple and make haste slowly - too many people getup off by trying kits that are too complex. As for scratch building, it is only a kit where you make the parts yourself and plastikard is very quick to get going with. Ordinary card too. I have been doing this for25 years now and have built up a range of skills in that time. For me that is the great joy of model making. Quote
David Holman Posted January 30, 2014 Author Posted January 30, 2014 Have been making good progress on the passenger trailer to 'B' Using the Jenkinson method, cut out an inner shell from 40thou plastic sheet and an outer skin from 20 thou. 40 thou square microstrip at waist and top of windows enable the tumblehome to be formed. However, left gaps above the windows, which will enable 30thou glazing pieces to be slipped between the two made sheets. The floor is 80thou, while the ends are layers of 40thou, which will be sanded to shape later. The roof is planned to be laminated plastic sheet and will sit above the window line. Included the central partition to help keep the sides in shape. The partition to the luggage compartment does the same thing. The only ticklish bit was the cut outs for the sliding doors, which made that bit of the sides quite week until all the bits were stuck together. So far, what is most noticeable is the size of the thing. The saloon is quite a bit longer than the bogie coach and at 9' 6 wide had me checking it would not foul the platforms. for once my luck has held! Quote
Lough Erne Posted January 30, 2014 Posted January 30, 2014 As JB says fantastic and inspirational work. The method used for the body and tumblehome forming especially. Once I finish a few other projects, I feel a WCR railcar trailer for the garden might be just the thing! Quote
David Holman Posted February 1, 2014 Author Posted February 1, 2014 The railcar is coming together now, with the trailer-saloon interior fitted out, which has enabled glazing to be fitted and the roof added. The latter always a bit of a worrying time, because I could not think of a way to make it easily removable, so if anything comes loose now, those of you over the water will undoubtedly pick up the cries of anguish. Am also having to be careful to keep dust [from sanding] out of the interior, because I’ve modelled some of the toplights in the open position… Meanwhile, the tractor unit really is almost there. Sprayed the main [green] body colour, so could then add the buffing gear and guard irons. This was made in a single unit, from brass strip, bent to shape, with a few rivets put in using my GW Models press. The has earned its purchase price many times over & is a lovely tool to use. The actual buffer heads are from some old ABS buffers I had in the spares box. In other words, they are small drawing pins [yes, really], but seem the ideal size for the purpose. Now, the main body colour… Roof is easy – white. Upper and lower body are more difficult. The best colour pictures I have are two from Irish Railways in Colour, which show the railcar in bright sunshine. The lower body ‘green’ shows as an olive shade, to my eyes not dissimilar to that used by the Southern Railway in England. The upper body is decidedly cream in one picture, but more like a pale green [light olive oil?] in the other. However, in Irish Traction in Colour, B is pictured in somewhat ‘softer’ weather and while the upper body is again a light olive oil green shade, the lower body is much darker – more like Brunswick green. Now, all three pictures were taken in May 1957, so the paintwork should be the same in all cases. Hence, it just goes to show what the effect of light can have & then if we factor in the type of film used & exposure on the camera & it all gets very complicated… At the moment, the lower body is sprayed Brunswick green, while the upper body is brush painted with Humbrol acrylic light olive, toned down with more white. I bought a Humbrol spray can of a more olive green shade, but this [to my wife’s eyes, as well as mine] looks too green and maybe a bit too light. Tried a test spray on top of the Brunswick green [on a bit of grey card], which is closer to the ‘bright sunshine’ photo, but am not completely convinced. Add in the fact that models themselves can look very different under varying lighting conditions [ALWAYS paint your models under the same type of light as you intend displaying them] and you can begin to appreciate my uncertainty. Comments most welcome, though note that the weather on Arigna Town is deemed to be permanently ‘mainly cloudy, with a high chance of showers’. My exhibition lights are Clipspots, with bulbs that give a slightly yellow light. Still at least the tractor seems to run well. Have given it an hour in each direction on my rolling road - far more than it will ever get on my layout! Quote
Garfield Posted February 1, 2014 Posted February 1, 2014 Looks so good you could be mistaken for thinking it's the real thing! Quote
jhb171achill Posted February 1, 2014 Posted February 1, 2014 David, your doubts about the livery look unnecessary to me. I have seen good quality colour slides of it, which eye witnesses who were very familiar with it say are accurately reproduced. Your colours look the part, very definitely. You are right about the upper colour - it was indeed pale green. I will show the pics to one who knew it well, and report back! Awe inspiring work indeed - as always! Quote
Dunluce Castle Posted February 1, 2014 Posted February 1, 2014 Absolutely amazing, 100% inspirational, superb work. Quote
Mayner Posted February 1, 2014 Posted February 1, 2014 Brilliant work David, an interesting and challenging prototype with its combination of complex curves, large windows and recessed doorways. Quote
heirflick Posted February 1, 2014 Posted February 1, 2014 beautiful work - cant wait till shes finished and running! Quote
David Holman Posted February 4, 2014 Author Posted February 4, 2014 What's this? A bare workbench? Not quite, but the clear space is because Railcar B has moved to the layout. Hence go there to see pictures of it in its proper environment. What you can see here is my cheap and cheerful rolling road. Bought it several years ago from I forget who. however, as you can see, it is any gauge, because the L shaped brass angle sets that, while the rolling bit is catered for by little fold up etches into which go some small TT wheel, on which sits you loco or whatever. Have enough of these for a six wheeled loco, plus non-running carriers for pony and bogie. In 7mm scale you need a very big space for a roundy roundy and though my local club has one, have not persuaded them to put in a broad gauge line yet. Hence the rolling road is very useful for testing and running in. Quote
Jawfin Posted February 16, 2014 Posted February 16, 2014 Looking great, David Sorry if I'm going OT, but the wind blew the tarp off the real railcar B, revealing much of the driving end Railcar B by Jawfin110, on Flickr I have some interior shots if you want them, but there isn't much left! Quote
heirflick Posted February 16, 2014 Posted February 16, 2014 great pic Jawfin ...good to see the old girl having a look at the world! Quote
Colin R Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 Hi Guys I know it is a few year ago but I was wondering if any better plans have turned up for this railcar yet? Colin Quote
DiveController Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 In my 25+ years involved in the financial side of both the RPSI and DCDR, there was a perpetual chorus of "why don't you restore X" and "it's a scandal that Y has been left to rot in a siding at Downwhiteheadpatrick". Worse still, "the DCDRPSITG says they're into preservation, so they have a duty to rescue the last Hunsletcraven". It got to the stage where I could barely contain my thoughts at AGMs, while sitting at the top table fielding questions. The answers - the printable ones anyway - which I might have given would include.... Are YOU going to pay for it? Where will the money come from, given that it isn't currently eligible for grant aid? Will YOU spend every weekend, a fair portion of your days off and annual leave, plus you own petrol money, on working on this in all weathers? Don't you think that a hard-pressed, necessarily under-resourced volunteer workforce have enough to do? .....and so on. The reality is, people across this island have very little interest in industrial heritage compared to other places. Hi Guys I know it is a few year ago but I was wondering if any better plans have turned up for this railcar yet? Colin Tread softly because you tread on dreams WBY Quote
Colin R Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 Tread softly because you tread on dreamsWBY Is this in the right Thread? Quote
jhb171achill Posted June 14, 2017 Posted June 14, 2017 "B" appeared on the DCDR as part of the deal to acquire GSWR No. 90, though the aim was always that she would be ideal for off-peak trains like, say, midweek, New Year's Day, or visiting small groups or school parties. I applied for funding for the then £160,000 stg required to fully restore her. Luckily, as fate would turn out, this was declined; had the funds been made available she was headed for Rail Restorations North East in England, the very firm which went bust when 171 was there! She could have ended up being siezed for scrap over there! Thankfully she survived. Further attempts to find funding for her after that have not yet been fruitful. It may be assumed that today £200k woukd be what's required. I hope it happens some day. 6111 as a push pull vehicle with C231, plus SLNCR "B", would make a nice duo there. Subject to suitable funding all is feasible - but for the pair you're looking at half a million sterling, and with the north brexiting out of EU funding, it might take a while! Incidentally, over the last thirty years, the sums of money which have flowed into Whitehead and Downpatrick from Brussels have been such that the survival of the former was greatly enhanced if not saved; of the latter I can state with certainty it would not have survived.... But that's another story! Quote
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