David's Workbench

[Mol_PMB]

New Accurascale Invisilock:

 

[David Holman]

Hmm... not sure to be honest. Might just need a bit of getting used to. Wonder what a whole train of these will look like alongside the black ones? Rather emphasises how big a tension lock is compared to three/screw links.

 If only the world had standardised on the buckeye! Life would be a lot simpler as we'd all be using Kadees.

[Horsetan]

2 hours ago, David Holman said:

.... If only the world had standardised on the buckeye! Life would be a lot simpler as we'd all be using Kadees.

For coaching stock, yes. For freight, it might be a bit different.

The Accurascale semi-transparent couplings could have gone further, and been made fully-transparent. Maybe something could also have been done to reduce the massive gap between coupled vehicles.

[Galteemore]

Reminds me of an idea that briefly blazed a trail when I was a British N gauge modeller. In some ways this worked because the whole thing was transparent. 

[David Holman]

That makes sense, because N gauge couplers are a real eyesore, especially in smaller stock. Terriers, 03 shunters and the like seem dwarfed by them.

[jhb171achill]

The Hattons Genesis stock have gaps between them which must be about 8 scale feet.....

[Horsetan]

13 hours ago, David Holman said:

That makes sense, because N gauge couplers are a real eyesore, especially in smaller stock. Terriers, 03 shunters and the like seem dwarfed by them.

I also saw a suggestion that the N gauge couplings be replaced with the much less-obtrusive Märklin Z-gauge/miniclub ones.

[David Holman]

 After a bit of a pause, while I had some louvres 3D printed, the Swilly bogie brake now nears completion. My first experience of such things, they look the part, though I soon found out they needed filing to shape, rather than cutting with a craft knife - far too brittle.

 While waiting for the prints to arrive, I made a start on another Swilly brake third, which will go with the bogie brake for the train for a Kerr Stuart 4-6-2T. Progress has been pretty good - enough to pose the two vehicles together, albeit with final details still needed.

 The brake third is pretty convention - a 40 thou plasticard shell, overlaid with micro strip for the outside strapping and frames. Bogies are from Alphagraphix, while took an idea from Tullygrainy for the roof vents, which are wooden dowel, shaped with files in an electric drill.

 As for that 4-6-2T, heard from Allen Doherty [Worsley Works], that the etches are done and should be with me next week, which is nice as I was wondering what I might do next!

[Mol_PMB]

5 minutes ago, David Holman said:

 After a bit of a pause, while I had some louvres 3D printed, the Swilly bogie brake now nears completion. My first experience of such things, they look the part, though I soon found out they needed filing to shape, rather than cutting with a craft knife - far too brittle.

 While waiting for the prints to arrive, I made a start on another Swilly brake third, which will go with the bogie brake for the train for a Kerr Stuart 4-6-2T. Progress has been pretty good - enough to pose the two vehicles together, albeit with final details still needed.

 The brake third is pretty convention - a 40 thou plasticard shell, overlaid with micro strip for the outside strapping and frames. Bogies are from Alphagraphix, while took an idea from Tullygrainy for the roof vents, which are wooden dowel, shaped with files in an electric drill.

 As for that 4-6-2T, heard from Allen Doherty [Worsley Works], that the etches are done and should be with me next week, which is nice as I was wondering what I might do next!

Very nice indeed! Looking forward to seeing these completed and the loco started

[Tullygrainey]

12 hours ago, David Holman said:

 After a bit of a pause, while I had some louvres 3D printed, the Swilly bogie brake now nears completion. My first experience of such things, they look the part, though I soon found out they needed filing to shape, rather than cutting with a craft knife - far too brittle.

 While waiting for the prints to arrive, I made a start on another Swilly brake third, which will go with the bogie brake for the train for a Kerr Stuart 4-6-2T. Progress has been pretty good - enough to pose the two vehicles together, albeit with final details still needed.

 The brake third is pretty convention - a 40 thou plasticard shell, overlaid with micro strip for the outside strapping and frames. Bogies are from Alphagraphix, while took an idea from Tullygrainy for the roof vents, which are wooden dowel, shaped with files in an electric drill.

 As for that 4-6-2T, heard from Allen Doherty [Worsley Works], that the etches are done and should be with me next week, which is nice as I was wondering what I might do next!

I've come to the computer to get a better look at these on a bigger screen. Great coach work as always, David. Crisp and with lovely attention to detail in the panelling and metalwork. These look the business even in grey primer.

 

[Galteemore]

Absolutely gorgeous work. Looking forward to seeing this develop !

[David Holman]

A short pause on the Swilly bogies, because the Worsley Works etches for my next loco arrived today. Much as I would like to dive in and get started, the first thing you always need to do with Worsley stuff is to work out what all the etches represent and then make a list of all the other things you need, so for anyone interested in Worsley products, hopefully the following might help.

 First, the loco itself. This will be a Lough Swilly 4-6-2T, built by Kerr Stuart, as shown below.

  Unlike my previous Barclay 4-6-0T, this set of etches includes the chassis - or most of it anyway.

 First lets look at the frames:

  Nickel silver - nice - for all the etches, although unfortunately the holes for the axle bearings are 3/16" [0 gauge] and I'm using Gibson wheels on 1/8" axles, because, as far as I can tell the correct 3'6 wheels are not available to go with the extended axles needed for outside frames. Hence, am thinking I will need to plate over & fill the current holes somehow so I can fit 1/8 bearings.

 Next we have the frame spacers and etches for the rear pony truck and front bogie. Mostly ok, though the spacers are 4'3 wide and [after several rebuilds] those on my Barclay are now 3'9, so looks like things will need cutting down a bit here.

 Always nice to have the coupling and connecting rods. Also on this fret is a one piece etch for the cylinder/motion bracket, plus the slide bars too. Real timer savers here, compared to making things from scratch.

 The fourth chassis etch has overlays for the outside frames [driving wheels] and what I think is the pony truck, along with the brakes. 

 So far, so good. What you don't get are:

• Wheels - the aforementioned Gibsons, including bogie and pony
• Motor & gear box, from High Level
• Outside cranks from Slaters
• Slater's 0 gauge wagon axles for the driving wheels - see the section on the Barclay as to why.
• Axles box castings for the bogie. Ideas welcome here!

 Now for the bodywork:

 First is the footplate etch, which also contains the buffer beams, a couple of etches for the firebox inside the cab, along with cylinder ends and a pair of steps.

 The main body etches are the cab/tank sides, cab front/rear, smoke box frame & wrapper, bunker rails and a sand box. We also have some useful beading for the cab and tank tops, plus rings for the spectacle plates - though quite what the two square etches, top left, are I'm not sure. Suggestions welcome!

 Finally we have a bit of a mystery etch. Cab roof and bunker rear, plus the other sandbox are fairly obvious, as are the two front frame extensions, top right. No idea what the two rectangles below these are for, while I fear the large rectangle on the left is a bit of a bodge, posing as a filler between the tanks, as per the Barclay.

 You may have noticed there is no sign of a boiler! This will probably be rolled from a piece of flat sheet, though it may be possible to use a piece of tube.  Also needed is  the following:

• Smoke box door & 'dart'
• Chimney, dome, safety valves & whistle
• Tank filler caps
• Lamp irons
• Vacuum pipes
• Tool box
• Jack
• Brake cylinder
• Cab detail, including brake standard, reversing lever, gauges etc
• Builders plates

 No doubt I'll find more! However, while it may look like a lot, these etches take away an awful lot of measuring and cutting, though I must get those two bogie vehicles finished first!

[Mol_PMB]

Thanks, this is really useful to get an idea of what the etches comprise.

I don’t feel so guilty about forgetting the windscreen wipers on my E401 etch now! At least they’re readily available elsewhere. 

Cheers

Mol

[David Holman]

Still a bit more titivating needed, but the two Swilly bogies have made good progress.

  Hand lettering [white gel pen] and a few transfers, plus some weathering [enamels and powders], completes the scene, so have paired them up with the Barclay, below:

 Have also decided to have another go at trying to fabricate a cosmetic addition to the tension lock couplings to make them look a bit more like narrow gauge choppers. 

 Just bits and pieces of plasticard, arranged to go on the inside of the buffing plate. A bit crude, but once stuck in place, with a bit of judicious filing and painted black, they are a reasonable upgrade. That said, in the latest Gauge 0 Guild Gazette, EDM Models have announced they are taking on production of the Zamzoodle Chopper couplings, which are much more accurate and can be made to work automatically too. If they are not too expensive, I could be tempted.
 

[Galteemore]

Looks fabulous David. Very different to the CVR tanks and clerestorys that used to populate Fintonagh. Funny enough I thought of you when I saw the Zamzoodles in the Gazette! 

[David Holman]

Kerr Stuart 4-6-2T

 Couldn't resist the thought of a new project any longer, so this morning sat down to evaluate what I need to do to get started. Having a set of parts is nice, but without any instructions, in effect you need to devise your own and as already mentioned in a previous post, work out what else you need.

 Found a scale drawing from the 7mm Narrow Gauge Society, though unfortunately not all the dimensions agree with the etchings. Nothing too drastic though, so guess I'll stick with what arrived.

 Those of you familiar with my Barclay Tank adventure will know the chassis caused me a LOT of grief, so decided I really needed a better plan of attack this time, starting with an oversized drawing to check clearances and so on:

 A good two hours was spent with ruler and vernier gauge checking parts and materials, from which I discovered, among other things that:

• The frame spacers at 29.2mm wide exactly match standard 0 gauge wheel back to backs. This is interesting, because the 0 gauge wagon axles I use with the Gibson driving wheels have nice extensions on them that will take square section brass tube to fit in the Slater's outside cranks, which helps with quartering the wheels. It is also a bit of a shame, because I discovered some Slater's 1/8" 0 gauge axles which fit nicely in the cranks and would have given perfect quartering with zero effort. Unfortunately, they are shorter than the wagon axles and would have made clearances far too tight.
• I really can't go through the hassle of  trying to fit the Gibson drivers inside the frames as per the Barclay. Hence have sent off to High Level Kits for a set of horn blocks, so wheels and axles can be dropped out of the frames for painting etc. This does mean though that I need to find a way to make those dratted underslung dummy springs removable. A further point here is that talking to Dart Castings at the Tonbridge Show yesterday, it seems High Level could be the only supplier left for 4mm scale horn blocks. Dart can't get the square brass bearings, while Markits future is very much in doubt following the recent death of the proprietor...

• I fear the cylinder etching is too narrow. As the photo shows, it comes out as about 45mm, whereas the footplate is 54mm wide and the cylinders go right to the edge. They need to as well, to give space for the slide bars and con rods as can be seen from my drawing above.

 

 Without doing all this preparation, building the chassis would be fraught to say the least - been there and got the T shirts [plural] after all. However, it has helped me get my head round things and while I'm waiting for the horn blocks to arrive, I can get on with some of the bodywork, not least the footplate where it is important to find out where some of the spacers on the etch might fit and how they relate to where the motor/gearbox, body fixing points, bogie and pony wheels etc fit.

 As ever, life is complicated - which is why it is fun. Allegedly...

 

 

[Mol_PMB]

You are rightly demonstrating why all these things need to be thought through at the start!

Best of luck with the build, I look forward to seeing it come together.

[Galteemore]

Most interesting David. Reading threads like this is instructive for all of us. I agree, early planning in a project saves some pain later on. Apparently all this problem solving is good for our brains as we age, too…

[Tullygrainey]

On 16/2/2025 at 5:33 PM, David Holman said:

A further point here is that talking to Dart Castings at the Tonbridge Show yesterday, it seems High Level could be the only supplier left for 4mm scale horn blocks. Dart can't get the square brass bearings, while Markits future is very much in doubt following the recent death of the proprietor...

David, Alan Gibson still lists 4mm hornblocks,  both for 1/8" (4M60 or 4M60A) and 2mm (4M61 or 4M61A) axles. I have a set though I've never used them. They have integral springing.

London Road Models also list their version, also for both sizes of axle.

Edited Tuesday at 13:54 by Tullygrainey

[David Holman]

 Thanks Alan, should have remembered about them, though right now suffering from serious brain ache after grappling with the basics of the chassis.

 As I've already said, many times, there are numerous issues when building an outside framed chassis, the main one being able to remove the wheels and motor/gearbox, both as part of ongoing construction and future maintenance. With the Barclay          4-6-0T, these are locked in and were a right pain too, especially trying to fit the wheels inside the frames. Therefore, resolved to dot better this time.

 The obvious way seemed to be to make  cut outs in the frames, to take High Level horn blocks. The brain ache came from investigating whether I could incorporate suspension/compensation as well - given that is what these things are made for. The High Level beam springs are very clever, but would make removing the wheels very difficult. Sharman style compensation would probably have worked except for the fact that I needed to put the motor on the middle axle because mounting it on the rear one gets in the way on the pony truck.

 Geoff Kent's books offered other options, while in the course of my investigations I came across the CLAG papers. These cover the whole science of springing and compensation, but as I don't have A Level physics, most of it went straight over my head!

 So, in the end, the chassis is unsprung, with the horn blocks there simply to allow easy removal of the wheels.

 After deciding which of the half dozen frame spacers to use, I first tack soldered the frames together, so I could cut out rectangles for the horn blocks. These are 6mm wide and extend 4mm above the centre line of the axles. Once the frames were separated and cleaned up, I assembled them with spacers at each end with another in the centre, though this may need moving as other bits are added.

 The axles came next, Slater's coach/wagon ones, to which I added square section brass tube, which was then filed down to fit in the outside cranks. This nicely takes care of the all important quartering.

  High Level horn blocks are neat, if rather fiddly for a 7mm scale modeller like me, while fitting them needed much thought too. Rightly or wrongly, I used my Poppies Woodtech jig to set up the middle axle, then used two springs to hold the outer horn blocks in place, while I fitted the coupling rods. These were held with hair clips and [after checking multiple times to everything was square] soldered the remaining four horn blocks in place.

 I could then take out the square, brass bearings and fit the wheels, which go inside them. With the wheels back in the chassis, I then held my breath as I put the chassis on the track to find that all the wheels were turning - meaning everything was level. Phew!

 Crank pins and their bearings could now be added, along with the coupling rods, followed by another test on the track with happily, no signs of any binding. Double phew!!

 There's still lots more challenges, with the cylinder/crosshead/conrod unit to add, plus the bogie and pony wheels, all of which have the potential to cause me pain. However, it has been good to get this part done and while waiting for the horn blocks to arrive, I got the basics of the bodywork started, so I have a reasonable idea of how this will fit with the chassis.

 

[Tullygrainey]

Neat! That's coming along very nicely David. I like your jig for lining up the square tubing on the axles. Simple but effective. I'm going to wait till you've solved all the problems of building chassis with outside frames and cranks before I tackle one!

That High Level gearbox looks minuscule in there - I'm used to them taking up half the space in the boiler.

 

[Horsetan]

On 18/2/2025 at 1:46 PM, Tullygrainey said:

David, Alan Gibson still lists 4mm hornblocks,  both for 1/8" (4M60 or 4M60A) and 2mm (4M61 or 4M61A) axles. I have a set though I've never used them. They have integral springing.

London Road Models also list their version, also for both sizes of axle.

Not all hornblock bearings are alike.

AGW and LRM bearings are similar, but AGW has the sliding groove running down the centre of the sliding surface, whereas LRM is biased to one side.

I've used AGW bearings in an experimental LMS Duchess chassis, but I didn't use the 0.45mm guide wire supplied as this makes the bearings too loose in the guides. I found 0.6 or 0.7mm wire to give much better sliding characteristics.

High Level bearings are smaller, as are the guides.

Then there's the rectangular Brassmasters/Comet bearings which are designed to slot into the frames directly without needing separate guides.