Steam livery help needed

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

Guys can anyone tell me if the K Class as modelled by Murphy Models ever ran in any other colour in real life other than the green or black on the Murphy Model. Did any of them ever run in the dark battleship grey or was it always green and black

[BosKonay]

The model came in matt grey/black, glossy black with red lining and green anyway.

 

http://irishrailmodels.com/2012/01/19/n-class-woolwich-matt-black/

http://irishrailmodels.com/2012/01/19/n-class-woolwich-black/

http://irishrailmodels.com/2012/01/19/n-class-woolwich/

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

Yes but did the real locos ever run in the dark battleship grey any photos I've looked at they all seem to be Matt black

[Garfield]

I don't think I've ever seen any photos of a Woolie in battleship grey. I'll be chatting to JHB later this evening so I'll get a definitive answer from him!

[Mayner]

They would have been dark grey in GSR days, re-painted into drak green in early CIE days, a few that were overhauled in the mid 50s may have been re-painted in grey.

 

I usually use Howes "Weathered Black" with a flat varnish to get the flat grey effect of a loco that has been in service for a while, or satin for a newly overhauled loco, the effect of the different vaarnishes are remarkibly different

[jhb171achill]

No GSR / CIE engine ever ran only in green or black except the 800 class, which were always green. All GSWR locos started being painted battleship grey all over about 1918, replacing the earlier lined black livery. When the GSR was born in 1925, the all over grey spread to every other loco they had from other companies, with the exception mentioned. CIE continued this unique but singularly dull livery, altering it only by gradually replacing the cast number plates on locomotives with painted numbers, and the addition of "flying snails" to most tender engines, but no tank engines.

 

Towards the end of steam, from about 1955 onwards (but NOT before), a small number of locomotives were painted black, and at least one J15 received the grey but with a black smokebox; this livery variation came from Cork shed, I believe, or possibly Limerick works.

 

Woolwich locos were all grey until some time about 1950 when most became green, but not all. One was repainted (like the model) in lined black. This was specially done for the Cork - Mallow - Rosslare express. Others were grey - but modellers can bear in mind that the grey varied occasionally in shade, and a few engines over the years looked almost black, especially after a period of being cleaned with oily rags. RPSI's 186 was painted grey some years ago. At the time, a number of people saw her close up, who would also have seen newly painted locos in Inchicore in the past, and their verdict was that the RPSI shade was exactly right. I think at least one other Woolwich was plain black, but I'd have to check.

 

Dirty engines could look black too. I do have a list of CIE locomotives somewhere which received actual black paint, but there were only (from memory) at best a couple of dozen; I had a look just now but can't put my hand to it. I'll post the list here when I can.

 

From memory, no class ALL received black - it was just odd locos here and there. I think there was black on at least one or two of the following: Bandon tanks, 400 class, Woolwichs, and i think a 60-class 4.4.0. No J15s were ever black, though one (as mentioned) had a black smokebox, though grey elsewhere.

 

The CIE green was applied in the same way - to whatever odd locos came in and out of the works, and often just a single member of a class (e.g. one 60 class - which must have looked amazing).

 

I must look out that list.

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

Thanks for the great info lads. I got one one the new Bachmann BR DCC ready locos which I want to reprint into an Irish livery. Seeing as the Murphy models were green and black I want to do something different so this is why I ask the question on the grey. One more quick question for those locos that ran in grey did they carry a flying snail and if so what colour was the flying snail and the number on the cab side. Once again thanks for all the info lads.

[Glenderg]

I think this is the type of grey, albeit neglected and workstained, you need ...

 

Well looked after loco

 

http://transportsofdelight.smugmug.com/RAILWAYS/IRISH-RAILWAYS/CORAS-IOMPAIR-EIREANN-STEAM/18279129_TbnP49#!i=1461158857&k=WzPtLJj

 

No clue on colours but asume badly stenciled and well faded! R.

[Mayner]

Thanks for the great info lads. I got one one the new Bachmann BR DCC ready locos which I want to reprint into an Irish livery. Seeing as the Murphy models were green and black I want to do something different so this is why I ask the question on the grey. One more quick question for those locos that ran in grey did they carry a flying snail and if so what colour was the flying snail and the number on the cab side. Once again thanks for all the info lads.

 

Green snail with yellow numerals, while most locos were painted overall gray, Cork is supposed to have re-painted a few locos including a Woolwich with grey used more or less as an livery colour with smokebox, running plate, cab roof painted in black

[jhb171achill]

Correct, Mayner; though grey was in fact the livery colour all along - albeit applied to not only the main parts of the loco, but also the smokebox, chimney, inside frames, inside cab and tender, roof inside and out, etc, etc; in fact, the only non-grey bit was the buffer beams. Cork did indeed paint some locos as you describe, probably no more than 2 or 3 though, but including at least one J15. Cork also painted one or two locos all-black, and Limerick may also have done.

 

The "snail" on tenders was a very faint green called "eau-de-nil" - same as the pale green applied to snails (and broad lining) on buses and carriages. However the cabside number was a dark cream colour, almost pale yellow.

 

In GSR days, when almost every loco had a standard Inchicore cabside numbeplate, the raised edges and numerals on these were usually just all painted over grey, but quite often they were rubbed smooth to bare metal, as on RPSI's 186. In CIE days, most plates were taken off and numerals painted, but quite a few locos entered the 1950s with the plates intact. By this stage, another variation was added - either the number only, or the number and rim, painted with the same pale yellow used on larger painted numerals. I have seen evidence of at least two locos which had the numbers on retained plates painted what looks like white; in one case number only, in the other number and rim.

 

If you are modelling a specific loco, if you can find a photo of what variation it had, all the better. If you can't, then others are unlikely to either, so you can paint the whole engine tartan and nobody can tell you off! :-)

 

Hope all of this helps.

[Broithe]

you can paint the whole engine tartan and nobody can tell you off!

 

That's a risky statement to make on here...

 

[heirflick]

QUOTE=Broithe;17017]That's a risky statement to make on here...

 

[ATTACH=CONFIG]4218[/ATTACH:puke:

[minister_for_hardship]

What in the name of Jaysus was that? A Crampton?

[Glenderg]

I'm having visions of the Titfield Thunderbolt! Nooooo

[BosKonay]

Absolutely Gorgeous :)

[jhb171achill]

Ha! As soon as O & K No. 1 reappears at Downpatrick, someone has to post up its new livery before it's even painted!!! :-)

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

Thanks for all the info guys. Ok so I'm going to paint her grey with eau-de-nil flying snail on the tender and light yellow numbers on the cab sides. I just hope I get the shade of grey right I want to portray the loco as if she ain't to long out of the paint shop

I will post some pics up when she is finished in a couple of weeks

[jhb171achill]

It'll be good to see it, Anthony. If the idea is to make it look recently painted, eyewitness accounts refer to brand-newly painted GSR / CIE grey as having a very subtle / vague "bluish" tint.... make of that what you will! Though I have to say I detected that on 186 - in certain lighting conditions - when newly painted. Good luck!

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

It'll be good to see it, Anthony. If the idea is to make it look recently painted, eyewitness accounts refer to brand-newly painted GSR / CIE grey as having a very subtle / vague "bluish" tint.... make of that what you will! Though I have to say I detected that on 186 - in certain lighting conditions - when newly painted. Good luck!

 

 

Decals ordered so should be here within the week eau-de-nil flying snails and pale yellow cab side numbers

[Kirley]

Thanks for all the info guys. Ok so I'm going to paint her grey with eau-de-nil flying snail on the tender and light yellow numbers on the cab sides. I just hope I get the shade of grey right I want to portray the loco as if she ain't to long out of the paint shop

I will post some pics up when she is finished in a couple of weeks

 

"I want to portray the loco as if she ain't to long out of the paint shop" -I hope this is not the start of mid life crises Anthony?

[Flying Scotsman 4472]

"I want to portray the loco as if she ain't to long out of the paint shop" -I hope this is not the start of mid life crises Anthony?

 

There will have to be a little dust somewhere

[Broithe]

"I want to portray the loco as if she ain't to long out of the paint shop" -I hope this is not the start of mid life crises Anthony?

 

Austerity measures - cutting back on the supply of brown paint..