Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 What is this 'triangular underframe' malarkey? I hear it was one of Uncle Oliver's 'innovations'. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broithe Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 I'm sure I recall it from a Playtex advert in the 60s. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flange lubricator Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 https://patents.google.com/patent/US2533485 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NIR Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 Here is a good picture, hosted elsewhere on this site Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted October 22, 2019 Author Share Posted October 22, 2019 Thanks chaps, now I can see what was going on. Those tin bath wagons! Now, what's this arrangement called? It seems a very distinctive feature on CIE four wheel wagons of a certain vintage, and the only British Railways wagon I've come across with a similar arrangement is the Perstwin Cement wagon. I used one of the old Airfix kits to provide such an underframe on a recent kitbash. I think Gloucester Cemflos also had this arrangement originally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRich Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 J hangers. Rich, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leslie10646 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 (edited) 5 hours ago, NIR said: Here is a good picture, hosted elsewhere on this site Faithfully represented on the Provincial Wagons kit of this wagon. And the 1953 van ("H" van) and our Ballast flat ..... Oh, and maybe our PalVan. Thanks to the four of you who got in touch! Come along at the weekend and buy one! You'll love how Michael has fashioned that delicate brake gear! Edited October 22, 2019 by leslie10646 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leslie10646 Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 5 hours ago, flange lubricator said: https://patents.google.com/patent/US2533485 To quote my website, re the corrugated open - "The illustration is of the prototype wagon which clearly shows the unusual triangulated chassis, patented by Oliver Bulleid and his chief draughtsman at the Southern Railway - Lionel Lynes. " I notice from your link that the application was made in Oliver's name only and note the date! The day BEFORE nationalisation of the Railways. Oliver wasn't in favour - was his application that day a last blast of the trumpet for the old Southern? I wonder what Lionel thought of his boss doing this? Much the same as "George B" attaching his name to the Howden-Meredith wheel, when, I understand, it was Mr M who thought up the idea! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhb171achill Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 I can’t remember where I took that pic above, but modellers might note a few details. The chassis is roughly painted the standard brown. This was actually rare - very rare - which is why I took the pic. Secondly, modellers might like to note that until “doubled” in height, the bodies were never brown - just the dirty unpainted metal as when built. Chassis originally grey, of course. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted October 22, 2019 Author Share Posted October 22, 2019 5 hours ago, RedRich said: J hangers. Rich, I was at art school with her 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayner Posted October 22, 2019 Share Posted October 22, 2019 The Irish Model Railway Company (Herbert Richards) H van drawing showing Bulleid triangulated underframe construction. The triangulated design was intended as a cheaper/stronger alternative to conventional underframe construction. The J hanger arrangement in combination with laminated springs provides an element of dampening to allow wagons and coaches to run at higher speed without de-railing . 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevieB Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Is there a similar drawing of the Bulleid open wagon anywhere? It would a great help to those of us striving to make accurate models, which is not to say that there is anything wrong with Leslie’s model. Stephen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iarnrod Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Is this drawing from a publication or what's the origin of it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mayner Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 5 hours ago, iarnrod said: Is this drawing from a publication or what's the origin of it? The drawing was produced by Herbert Richards a railway photographer and modeler a member of the Irish Railway Record Society and Transport Research Associates who was basically the "go to" person in Dublin during the 1960s & 70s for photos of CIE stations, rolling stock and wagon drawings. The IRRS may be able to assist in contacting Herbert or on accessing his collection of drawings and photographs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iarnrod Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 Thanks Mayner. I think Herbert still volunteers in the IRRS archives on Tues nights. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jhb171achill Posted October 23, 2019 Share Posted October 23, 2019 1 hour ago, iarnrod said: Thanks Mayner. I think Herbert still volunteers in the IRRS archives on Tues nights. Yes, he does. Usually to be found in the archival section (downstairs). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevieB Posted October 25, 2019 Share Posted October 25, 2019 The H van was mounted on both Bulleid’s triangular underframe and the earlier version with the long brake lever. Leslie’s kit is if the former version, so is there any possibility of a second version to add variety? Stephen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJEB Posted June 28, 2020 Share Posted June 28, 2020 Photo and Patent details most welcome. Bulleid had triangulated underftame steel bodied open and 17T mineral wagon built as well as an underframe during his late Southern Railway days. There might have also been a 14T wooden bodied merchandiase wagon with 2'9" BFB wheels - I only have the SR daigram 1391. How does one post images in the conversations? Does anyone have the CIE weight diagrams for the traingulated underframe wagons? Rob Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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