Ironroad

I'm in the same boat but not worried. If IRM only got their allocation on Friday so I'd expect it will take till this week for them to arrive in Liverpool.

Hi DJ, the mathematics are not on your side of this debate. A few people with deep pockets bidding against each other for a few no longer in production items on E Bay is not indicative of a market for a re run of these items. As Wrenneire has pointed out the initial production runs were relatively small in the order of 6.000 items but that doesn't mean there were 6.000 customers, at best the likelihood is there were probably less than 3.000 customers because those that did buy them probably brought multiples. For example I bought 9 x 201's, 8 x 071's, 7 x 141's & 7 x 181's. Also consider how many people are serious enough to sign up on this forum, in the scheme of things it's a very small number. It's tempting to believe that because the tooling still exists that re runs are viable, but it is unlikely that there is a market for the the volumes needed to sell re-runs at the sort of price that would be affordable for most of us. Whoever undertook such a venture would have to be content with holding unsold stock filtering off the shelves slowly over many years and there is no return on investment in that. I'm more concerned with where we go from here. With the release of the A class next year all of the most ubiquitous diesel locomotives that ran on Irish rails from the late '50s to the present time will have been produced as RTR models and while that is quite amazing to me, I think there is a dilemma for IRM or any other producer as to where to go next. I say this because if my reading of comments on this forum generally are correct, there are sharp divisions as to preferences for period. That in itself further dilutes the market even more for any possible future offerings. If I were to hazard a guess we are more likely to see offerings of rolling stock rather than locomotive power because they sell in much greater multiples.

Basically correct, however I do not agree that a retailer should put the onus on the foreign mail order customer to ask for the VAT reduction, that should be automatically granted based on the foreign address the goods are being dispatched to. (no argument about VAT liability if delivery is taken at the shop or the possibility of recouping this on exiting the state assuming the facility exists). In fact a registered retailer should see this as a competitive advantage over an unregistered retailer. But it does seem to me that the fact a great many sellers are not open about this is grounds for suspicion.

Thank you, as I said I hadn't checked the limit recently and was going on memory. And you are correct in stating traders are obliged to declare their VAT registration number on invoices but some may not be in compliance. The purpose of displaying the registration number is to give legitimacy to the charging of VAT particularly to other traders who are also registered and can recoup that VAT. However, by law the full VAT inclusive price must be advertised to consumers without necessarily showing a breakdown, and this opens the door to simply declaring a price with no reference to as to whether it contains VAT or not. Accordingly my suggestion is that before ordering from any entity that does not make the basis of their pricing clear, ask whether the price is VAT inclusive. Take a look at the Olivia's Trains website, they are registered for VAT but are not exactly compliant with the concept of zero rating sales to non EU destinations.

Agree, but I don't think it is all doom and gloom. I'm old enough to remember how things were before the customs union. Back then while both Ireland and the UK were in the EU, export sales to another EU country were zero rated for the purposes of VAT. So being pre internet, I used to make mail order purchases from Hattons. (instead of a weekly e-mail they used to send a monthly listing of their offerings probably produced with a typewriter stencil and a Gestetner duplicating machine). I never had the experience of having any of these parcels stopped and assessed for Irish VAT. I'll grant that the Revenue and PO are now much more sophisticated and it is unlikely mail imports would now escape the net. But keep in mind in the worst case scenario of no agreement between the EU and UK, the likelihood is that UK export sales will not be subject to UK sales tax but subject to sales tax in the country of importation in the EU. One more or less offsets the other, the real additional cost being processing fees. The real problem is with purchases from small producers who are not registered for VAT. There will be no reduction by the deduction of UK VAT because it isn't (or shouldn't) be in the price to begin with and so this price will be inflated by the application of VAT at the prevailing rate in the country of importation. Note that while I have not checked recently from memory the threshold at which businesses in the UK are required to registered for VAT is about GBP 75k annual sales and I suspect there are some smaller outfits who say they are not registered but actually are and they may need to rethink this if they are to retain export sales. Regardless, as has been noted it will probably be prudent to consolidate purchases to the best extent possible to minimise import processing fees.

There is a new website, but I don't think there is anything in stock at present; https://www.ecwid.com/store/store1493122/

Thank you all this has been quite informative. Summing up so far:- live frogs are not necessary and using insulated frogs simplifies matters although there may be some risk (perhaps minimal) with short wheelbase locos. Thank you for the explanation of a "BUS", but from the depths of my memory I recollect something about care being required with the wire gauge, what should that be? Also appreciate the advise that reverse loops still need to be isolated, but to clarify does this mean a section of track within the loop (presumably sufficient to accommodate a full train?. The advise on the isolation of a programming track is also well noted. Beyond this what are the preferred or recommended control systems. I'm way out of touch but remember that the initial offerings such as Zero 1 and the Airfix systems were not compatible with each other and at least in the US the National Model Railroad Association (NMRA) established uniform standards which I presume all manufacturers now adhere to. But who are the preferred most popular producers and how do they compare, both on performance/features and price . I suspect there is a middle ground where the most expensive may not be full value for money and the least expensive while initially attractive may be a poor longer term choice. And of course since I like reverse loops do all producers facilitate them?

Hi DJ, the point of my question is to clarify that if all track section are live at all times in DCC, that points which isolate sections are unnecessary and as part of the process of transitioning to DCC it is preferable to install points with live frogs and if indeed insulfrog points are already installed it would be necessary to wire a feed across these points. Perhaps very basic but I'd like to be sure nothing is taken for granted.

This is a great topic and since I'm at a crossroads on taking the plunge into DCC and completely ignorant of what I may be getting into, I'm very interested in all and any contributions. So a couple of questions (which may seem silly to the informed), Noel, when you say Is it correct to assume that you were using points with live frogs rather that the isolated type? If using the latter you would have have tp provide a power feed to sections that would otherwise be isolated? Secondly, is there an issue with reverse loops? In DC since the polarity is reversed it is necessary to create a section of track that can be isolated to facilitate reversal of polarity. Dump questions perhaps but I'm dumb on this subject, Thanks

Did exactly the same and have the same sentiments

Thank you for all of that. Seems liker there is a good case for a full brake in Black n' Tan, and I'll certainly point that out. As a matter of curiosity if these ran with Cravens albeit for a short time what else did those Galway trains consist of? What a great picture, it expands the case.

Hi JHB, I have yet to follow up with Hatton's on my original communication with them and before doing so I have a few questions you may have the answers to. Given they they are offering quite a few options in these models and the fact they may view what we are asking for as very niche and impractical it seems to me that our best chance is to narrow down the options we would like to see on Irish liveried versions. Firstly do we need to see Irish livery on all four of the six wheelers. I note that one of these is a full brake and another is a brake 3rd. So the question is would one brake type suffice and if so which one? That would reduce the number of coaches in Irish livery to three and means that anyone making up a rake of at four would purchase a multiple of at least one of the composite coaches (which may make this more attractive to Hatton's). After that, the options offered are; Wheel type' Mansell or three hole. Roof furniture; Oil Gas or Electric Lower Footboards; Optional. So assuming we are considering CIE dark Green late '40s to '55 which of these options are appropriate? Would this be different for the light green livery? And for those interested in GSR Maroon what would be appropriate? And my final question, what running numbers would be appropriate? I bow to your superior knowledge in these matters, Thank you

All true but I was wryly thinking that ideally a model of these six wheelers should have this sign on a window or two, the incongruity being that we have models with no smoking signs on the windows.

Interesting detail visible at 1:45 in the video. A "smoking" sign on the coach window advertising Wills Gold Flake. How times have changed.

Also available RTR was the NCC "Jinty" 0-6-0 tank loco, thanks to Murphy Models/Bachmann.

Just the same a little dalliance* is permissible, as I think I've said before variety is the spice of life. *(I mean modelling nothing else)

You should expand your horizons, Given the slow pace of infrastructure change on Irish Railways over a long period of time it's possible (perhaps with a bit of license) to represent multiple periods on the same layout.

Thanks for the update

Just to advise that I also contacted them recently with the same question and while a got a very polite response you seem to have managed to get a bit further than I did. I will certainly follow up with Mr. Mylett and as you suggest would encourage anyone else that is interested to do likewise. If you don't ask !!!!!!!!!!!!!

We are risking the IRE of the moderators for drifting off topic. But I agree with you. An 800 would sell to collectors and to those of us that want to would run it and it would be particularly attractive packaged as a train set as you suggest. Unfortunately given the time frames we have witnessed on the production of Irish models over the past 15 years or so I may not be around to see this. But closer to the topic of this thread, I think it's a safer bet to expect a tank wagon from IRM in the nearer term. Your wife is right.

AEC Railcars and laminates, that brings a smile to my face and let's not forget Park Royals. But do you really believe we can hope for an 800?

Just wondering if there has been any further progress on this project, I'm very interested

You are to be commended for this. However, I have to admit while I completely understand the price it is at the limit of where I might be tempted to go. I would definitely go there (even plus a bit) for Maeve. I'm interested in virtually everything that ran in the period 1950 - 2000 but even in that I need to set some limits and accordingly basically ruled out Northern Steam but you are seriously tempting me to go there, for sure I would not be able to resist a model of No.4. I'll complete the survey for you. Wishing you the very best of luck with this.

Hattons are selling a modular system https://www.hattons.co.uk/newsdetail.aspx?id=900&utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=content&utm_campaign=mar-0729-hattonsprecisionbaseboardsrange&_ke=eyJrbF9lbWFpbCI6ICJ0aG9tYXNjYnJvbmFuQGdtYWlsLmNvbSIsICJrbF9jb21wYW55X2lkIjogIkpHUWVYaCJ9 Is this the same or is it compatible?

I concur. Symoba offer a short and a long NEM pocket, they provide a height gauge but most interestingly they produce a very neat kinematic mounting plate intended to be mounted to the underside of the body rather than to a bogie. Their products are also available from DCC Supplies. Hornby supply a 10 pack of their NEM pockets (product code X6354) which I believe are available from Peters Spares. Bachmann supply spare couplings complete with NEM pockets, they don't seem to sell the pockets separately. The product codes of those I know of are 36-027, 36030 and 36-061.