jhb171achill

Likewise! I never saw one of this trio..... so particularly interested in this info.

I couldn’t agree more!

There would still have been quite a few in brown GNR livery up to 1965, when the Derry & Warrenpoint lives shut. Must look at Derek’s book again.... I don’t have anything to hand, but I thought I had picked up somewhere that half a dozen or so became maroon. Irrespective, the UTA maroon was very short lived! It was probably inspired by the “from-new” maroon and grey of the (1966) 70 class railcars.

It would have been ro-ro by 1975....

That is a super piece of work, many congratulations. I hadn't heard of the DWWR or DSER using passenger vans until comparatively recently. Like Mayner, I find it surprising, though not impossible if they were built with this in mind. The T & D, LLSR and CDRJC all used passenger brakes as goods brakes, and although they were narrow gauge and therefore the weight of the trains WAY lighter, the gradients were vicious. Also, in places like South Africa, with gradients almost impossible to believe, such practices were common.

It'll be great to see your UG slowly pushing vans in and out of it!

Those were maroon rather than green. They used to store old carriages there from about 1966/7 onwards, ending with old MED railcars in the 1980s awaiting scrapping. In its last year of existence, the UTA introduced a new livery of plain maroon for steam stock, and no more than a few - maybe half a dozen or a dozen - of the best remaining stock werethis repainted. Within a year and a bit, NIR had appeared on the scene and they applied a 3 inch thick light grey below below window level, and their new logo. The short-lived UTA maroon was much the same shade as the NIR railcars would adopt. The UTA used their own straw-coloured (red edged) line to distinguish railcar stock from loco hauled. Worth adding that their earlier equally short-lived light bluish-green wasn't lined, nor was it put on strictly loco-hauled stock as far as I know.

That is quite correct. From memory the practice ended in the mid or late 1960s. The "wagons" were indeed the chassis of old six-wheelers of various origins, many ex-DSER I think.

In practice, anything they painted was destined (hypothetically at least!) for actual use.... hence all such stock actually did end up with the lining. Secondary stuff, like much ex-GNR stock, got scrapped before it was repainted. Early perusals of GV St sidings and Antrim (1964-70) failed, in my experience personally, to turn up anything without lining. I suspect that an unlined loco-hauled livery was more aspirational than real, like many bright ideas concocted by the UTA! It’s like the theoretical late UTA all-maroon loco coach livery; barely half a dozen coaches ever bore it - the rest remained in faded UTA green! The lining was a straw colour with red edges. The yellow is an RPSI modern version (and I have to admit, my idea; I can’t help wondering if I might have been better suggesting proper UTA lining....?) Very many thanks for your comments, Steve.

From my own memory, when I saw these things daily passing my school, the shade of grey is correct. The photos above appear to show a black chassis, though I have to say I can’t recall this. Every other CIE wagon of every type had, at that time, grey body and grey chassis, which makes me wonder why a black chassis for these yokes didn’t stick out in my mind as other one-offs did. I recall them new, and the grey bubble above is accurate. Naturally, they got dirty quickly, but in my recollection they kept them way cleaner than in later years.

I’m out gallivanting in Killarney. I’ll delve into the Catacombs when I get back on Wednesday. Pre-1960, the rule was basically no two wagons alike in goods trains, nor coaches in passenger trains. A lot of the pics in Rails Through the West will illustrate the 1968-90 period typically. Even the cement bubbles, when first introduced, would be strewn among other goods vans and open wagons, maybe 2 or 3 at a time.

Naturally, the post-1955 green (as applied to laminates and Park Royals and anything else painted after that) is a different lighter colour.

Worth making a note, for others following in your footsteps. I suspect, though, that while car paint is perfect for 0 gauge, for smaller scales it might look a bit shiny - perhaps others here might like to comment on that, as I'm not an expert on paint?

That is SPOT on. I spent the first 25 years of my life looking at an actual sample (with a flying snail on it; my "logo" here) on the wall in our house. That's exact, whatever shade it is.

It's not 100%, but it's not far off it either. Since a vehicle like this would rarely see a paintbrush, it would spend almost all of its life very weathered looking. Once you've applied the lining and "snails", I suspect it would look just right with mid to heavy weathering on it. The green you've used is fortuitously somewhat "flat" compared with what a newly painted vehicle would look like. That would fit very well with the above idea. Seeing it in daylight is the key to judging it. ....And you're quite correct in not using British SR green - it was nothing like the CIE shade!

While the photo shows a loco too dirty to be sure, I suspect that in UTA days it received the full lining - in such a guise, it must have looked very well. Naturally, in use, a liberal coat of filth as above is more authentic. Nice model, nice atmosphere!

Absolutely brilliant job!! Wish senior could have seen this - he got samples of the paint in the carriage shop in Inchicore for his coarse-scale 0 gauge models (long since disposed of, unfortunately...)

Your secret is entirely safe with all of us here......

It would depend on the track plan, NIR, and the use. If it was a busy passenger station, that’s one thing, but a goods yard could be a ground frame only with no signals.

The one with the 6-wheel coaches intrigues me, as the one extreme left appears to be one end of a DSER coach. The others are either Midland or GSWR. I don't think any DSER six wheelers were still about by 1960, so could that pic have been taken maybe about 1957? I don't think it's Inchicore either but I could be wrong.

Does the bird have kadees, and does it run on 21mm gauge track? The shade of orange is wrong, and the corridor connections aren't the right type........

The armoured RUC land rovers always add a very authentic touch to any northern-based layout of 1970-90!

Remember the republican and loyalist graffiti! I often imagined a 1980s-based NIR layout with one lot of graffiti on one side of the track and “themmuns” on the other!!

Jhb171Senior (whom you may remember) was a big 0 gauge man. All gone now, unfortunately, beautiful old coarse scale 1920s stuff. I could be tempted - but where to put it!

The Derry Road would be a great advantage now. The Donegal scheme though, like many similar proposals, is indeed a pipe dream, and one of the more unrealistic and unviable ones ever dreamed up!