jhb171achill

I see it was daubed as being preserved by the RPSI... as one of the RPSI carriage brigade at the time, that's the first I ever heard of it! It would have been a worthy mate for a DCDR "G" these days.... G613, at Downpatrick, was actually one of the most regular "G"'s on the Loughrea branch.

Jawfin, the refurbished sets had the now-familiar red seating in them, and cream walls originally with some decorative vinyls on them. Prior to that, they had what in 1974 was standard British Rail checked blue upholstery and mock-woodgrain effect walls up to luggage rack level, with an off-white ceiling. Externally, they received the same maroon and blue livery at first repaint, but with a white "diamond" instead of an upturned "v". Later - I'd guess about 1981 - they got the all-grey with maroon band under window level. Those on loan to IE retained that livery much longer, as by the time the last car painted that way (69, I think), came back to NIR, everything was beginning to be "intercity" blue and grey. Next up was the "suburban" red and cream with orange stripe: I think this was about the time the "Castles" were introduced into traffic - 1986. Some 80 class sets were thus painted, but others got the original (and best looking) blue and grey, with the following: from bottom up, a darker grey band at the bottom of the bodyside, main below-window area light grey, then a yellow / white / black / white band, then blue round windows, light grey line above, and dark grey roof. The red and cream livery, which did not suit 80 class cars at all, didn't last and railcars painted this way were gradually put into the intercity version. To separate intercity and suburban "fleets" on a tiny system such as NIR was clearly impractical. Later livery variations (approx 2001 onwards) saw the acquamarine band replace the yellow, black and white below window level, along with the continuation of the blue up to roof level (i.e. no grey band above windows). Then, latterly, we had the quite ghastly re-incarnation of these sets in "red bull" livery - quite the most stomach churning match of livery and vehicle I've ever seen. Oh no, that's the sandpit (sorry, sandite) yellow.....

That's absolutely correct, Mayner; it was long gone at the closure. I think, but am not certain, that several different brake standards were used within the last year or longer. I've a photo of the second last day somewhere - must look it out - but it certainly wasn't the "Loughrea Coach" as you say. It had seats clad in the standard mid-brown upholstery used on many older Dublin buses, though not bus seats. I was the only passenger. On the seat opposite me, in black biro, it said: "FAREWELL TO THE DUNSANDLE EXPRESS"! Anyone remember that?

NIR had three varieties of white lining which might have escaped attention: 1. The old gold-coloured "upright" NIR logo had white lining; see the last few steam engines and any maroon and grey, or acquamarine blue and maroon railcars. 2. The Hunslets when maroon. The yellow bits had white lining. (This is missing in Cultra). 3. Post 1987, just as IE simply added the "tippex" lines to standard orange and black locos and carriages, NIR added white lining to either side of the light blue bands on the otherwise light grey "Enterprise" coaching stock.

The make-up of that goods train at New Ross is worthy of note; a standard "H" van, three GSR goods vans and five cattle trucks!

That shot at New Ross is an enthusiast special; regular passenger finished on the Waterford - Macmine in 1963. Groups like the IRRS were, in those days, able to arrange for a coach to be added to a goods train in order to traverse a line not open to passenger traffic.

Correct re the Loughrea coach. It was entirely different internally as it was fitted with bus seats, and (from memory) about 6 first class seats! It also had a storage heater which was plugged into a land line at Loughrea at night to recharge it, because it didn't run with a heating van, and a "G" class loco was hardly going to provide train heating! Externally, 1910 appears to have been repainted from green to black'n'tan about 1965 or 1966.

Utterly stunning, Ernie. I'm speechless!

Absolutely dreadful. I know the location - my late mother's family were from that neck of the woods. Terrible for these young people's families. RIP.

That is a lovely job. I always thought the silver and black would have suited a 201 better than an 071!

So, a Pratt with a bottom, and badgers, well... Wow! The mind boggles.... :-)

The W & L one ended up, as far as I remember, derelict at Mullingar where it attracted the attention of the RPSI with a view to preservation. But it was sadly too far gone, and had started to fall apart, thus both of the last two coaches from the W & L never saw preservation.

That's a superb layout overall - it's easy to forget that all-black "C"'s, "A"'s and B101s would have rubbed shoulders with grey 121s - as well as all sorts of other things - in those days. I'll report back with findings re snails on them once I find a particular photo I'm looking for! I'd almost swear the lining was white, though.

Really superb, very realistic!

The stencilled version of the snail was the norm after, I'd say, the mid 50s, but was only seen in this "non-filled-in" form on wagons. By the late sixties, while most wagons wore CIE "roundels", almost all remaining with snails - and there were lots - almost all had the stencilled snail. That's a fantastic looking 121, Railwayman, first time I've seen a model in light grey. I'm not 100% sure on black lining on the "snail", though, will have a delve and see what I can find.

There were two (at least), Hunslet. The red and cream one was one of the last two surviving W & L bogie coaches, the number of which escapes me at the moment. One more, former GSWR stock, was standard wagon brown. This was ex GSWR 837 of 1902, identical to the DCDR's preserved sister coach, 836 of the same year.

Post 1950, Jawfin, they became more and more common for a few years, as they were the official livery, but by 1960 many steam locomotives either had snails entirely obscured by dirt, or none! A quick "straw poll" could be done of pictures of tender engines in the various books that cover the period - I'd guess 50 / 50 by then.

Apologies for any confusion, Garfield. Summary: Both snails and numerals on all green locos: all "e-d-n", lined gold; nothing yellow ever. 800-2 only had numberplates; no other green locos had numberplates. Grey or black locos: all snails "edn", all numerals yellow. One thing also worth mentioning is that many loco tenders carried no snail at all. This was for two reasons. Firstly, pre-1945 it was GSR days, and many plain grey tenders last painted by the GSR lasted well into CIE days before a re-acquaintance with the Big Grey Paint Pot. Secondly, in the late fifties many of the few steam locos repainted simply had no snails applied. This, as photos will bear out, was especially true of the few turned out in black.

Had a look, gents..... Any snails shown appear to come from the transfers mentioned by Minister; as far as I am aware, all "snails" were applied by transfer. There's an exception to every rule, and with regard to "snails" I know of one - a former T & D loco on the Cavan and Leitrim carried a very small white painted one for a while. (In addition, one had chalked ones on it!). This would be the only exception I'm aware of to the notion that (a) no tank locos - broad or narrow - ever carried one, and (b) no snails were white! I'm always interested in exceptions, but I would suggest that any "yellow-looking" snails were discoloured or faded standard transfers. As of numerals, apologies if my post misled; none of these were eau-de-nil except on green locos where all were.

Garfield / Old Blarney All loco numerals on grey or black locos were pale yellow. Numerals on green logos were "eau-de-nil". I was particularly referring to the "snails", which were "eau". When faded, they often looked a pale yellowish, and on a dirty or faded loco both the yellow number and the snail would have faded to a nondescript yellowish shade. When newly restored about 1990, the RPSI's 461 carried a yellow snail for a while, and being newly restored was much photographed thus. This may have given rise to perceptions of yellow snails - if so, it amplifies the points made elsewhere that preservation liveries - in this country anyway - should never be relied on, as a numerical majority of all preserved locos and coaches, and (from the top of my head) all goods stock, are incorrect in livery details. I'll have a look at that book and report back....!

That's looking very good. It seems to run very smoothly.

Someone asked me recently about colours of the 1945-62 CIE logo and accompanying lettering. Firstly, the "Flying Snail". On all steam locos (green, the very few black, or the vast majority grey) - Pale green (eau-de-nil). Never white or yellow. Always lined in gold. On early diesels of B113 and D classes - same until repainted light green. On all other diesels, namely the above in light green and all others later, including the very few paintings of "A" class locos in dark green, the "snails" were unlined light green. A note, in relation to DCDR's G611: no "G" ever carried a snail. Carriages: light green again, lined in almost all cases when dark green (exceptions being a handful of vehicles repainted at Albert Quay); and unlined with lighter green livery. I suspect there were a few cases of lined snails on light green six wheelers, though! No silver coaching stock ever carried the logo. Wagons: White was used from the outset, but in the early 50s, some of the darker grey goods stock had light green snails and numerals. Numbering was always the same colour as the "snail" on diesel locomotives, goods and passenger stock in any livery, but confusion often reigns with regard to steam engines. While the cabside plates had grey (not black) backgrounds on grey engines, and black backgrounds on black engines, there were only three green locos with plates; the 800s. All initially had dark blue backgrounds, as on 800 in Cultra, but 801 and 802 ended up with red backgrounds, as seen on the RPSI's 461 now. (461 was never green in traffic). Raised numerals on plates were painted white or cream, or polished metal. Once plates were replaced by numerals, these were always painted in light yellow. The numerals were never lined. Thus, a typical grey or black painted CIE locomotive had an unlined yellow cabside number and a lined "eau-de-nil" snail. Snails were thus never yellow. I hope the above is of interest and use.

UTA ex GNR had, concurrently.... UTA green. Some railcars plain green ends, some wasp striped. Both versions of UTA crests. UTA blue / cream; two variations with broad or narrow cream bands. GNR navy and cream with overlaid UTA "red hand" crests. NIR maroon and grey. Carriage stock in GNR brown, UTA green, and post-'67, early NIR maroon with thin grey stripe. CIE lighter green coaches Black n tan coaches Silver tin vans Silver, green, black or black'n'tan CIE diesels, with the odd grey 121 thrown in. Steam engines in lined UTA black or badly faded GNR blue, with of without GNR markings on tenders. Freight stock - where does one start! CIE - all grey, quite uniform. Brown hadn't started yet. Mostly (white*) snails, some tan and white roundels. UTA wagons had a mixture of (much darker) grey, many ex-GNR markings still, some bauxite brown (some ex GNR vans and ex-NCC (but not ex GNR) open wagons). Red Inglis containers. GREY CIE cement bubbles. Orange appeared about 1970/1, as far as I recall. Doubtless more....... The visiting CIE weedspray was painted black, but the chemicals had it heavily weathered (stained!) light grey over a lot of it. The crew coach was faded red and cream, leaving a pre-adolescent me to wonder if it was a re-gauged CDRJC coach! (* Prior to about 1960, some snails painted on older wooden wagons were light green. Others, and all after that, were white).

Now that you mention it; they were indeed silver to start! But brake dust made them brown.....

It was certainly brown flats on that train.