Hornby 1:76 containers

[murphaph]

Hi all,

I just thought I'd post about my purchase of some of the Hornby 1:76 containers I picked up in Mark's while back home recently. They are a spot on fit on the IRM P42 flats and a perfect match size-wise to the excellent c-rail range. I found I couldn't get these containers (currently) from c-rail so took the opportunity to grab these Hornby ones. Might be of interest to anyone looking for these specific container liveries in 8'6 boxes. They have a few more due to come out in Spring I believe. Not pictured are the P&O ones, which are also nice.

For comparison the last 20' box on the right is from c-rail, the other three are Hornby. A very good match I think. The holes even line up with the IRM yellow lugs on the wagons!

They come in packs of 1x20' + 1x40' for example:

http://www.marksmodels.com/?pid=41605

 

[Sean]

got some myself last week they are super quality.

[johnfromoz]

I must confess an interest in this topic, from the point of view of building prototypical liner train liveries. I am trying to group my container liveries in two main periods:  1) circa 1993 Bell liners, giving way to some new shipping schemes like Genstar, CAST,  P&O etc and 2) 2016 - present.  Of those new Hornby releases, Evergreen and LYS LINE are obviously still doing the rounds, along with the the ever present MAERSK,  but I think that Nedlloyd livery as released by Hornby is from the 1990s.  Worth considering for the sake of accuracy…..

Edited February 8, 2022 by johnfromoz

[murphaph]

I think the P&O, LYS-LINE, Evergreen and Nedlloyd ones are definitely ok on a 1995 layout, which is what I'm aiming for. I am pretty sure I've seen all of these in photos or videos of Irish Rail liners from the period too.

[johnfromoz]

Indeed.  This whole are of box liveries is overlooked most of the time, but is an absolute minefield and a recipe for time travel on your layout if  not researched even to a basic level given that we spend huge amounts of time and effort in ensuring accuracy of passenger stock and loco liveries.  For example the bauxite GENSTAR livery was so widespread and around for 30 yrs globally, yet was replaced around the turn of this century by SeaCo. Similarly, the original P&O appears to be long gone, (unless you count 45’ boxes) as has CAST and many others, Hornby currently sell the 20ft box in ONE livery of reversed Magenta and white, but I have yet to find evidence of its use in UK, Ireland and possibly elsewhere. The 40ft version can rarely be seen.  The enduring liveries of Maersk, Triton, Tex and Evergreen are safe bets for covering a near 40 yr span, albeit with some subtle updates and modernised design of the boxes themselves.

[murphaph]

It's a great way to add significant variety and colour to a layout. I'm looking forward to the 47' and 62' flats some day to justify buying even more containers lol.

[dave182]

Also a subject of interest to me as a fan of the toothpaste livery era! My favourite reference point is this classic video from 1993 which pretty much covers all liners radiating out of Dublin, with the exception of the Northern line. 

It's the little details you can pick out that can in turn add operational detail to your layout if you are so inclined. 

Many Bell liners to Waterford always seem to have one or 2 green or brown containers through the mix. 

The 90s were very brown! Or shades thereof! Brownish orange, brownish white, brownish green. 40 shades of brown!

The Galway liner was interesting as it used the 61' bogies. 

A number of shorter formations are seen to, I guess to places like Longford or Mallow or as extras maybe?

Guinness and 2-axle wagons always placed on the rear of the train.

The only line not featured is the Northern line, which often had liners with interesting mixes of wagons, and containers not seen on the rest of the network. I know for a time there was a dispute between Sealink(?) And Dublin Port(?) or similar parties, that resulted in containers being shipped via Belfast for some reason. These liners often had Freightliner containers in the mix.

Finally, you don't see many B&I Lines containers recorded on a rail. I do remember them being quite a regular feature on Northern line liners in the 80s.

 

Edited February 9, 2022 by dave182
Spelling

[murphaph]

Yeah that video is great. The green containers scattered among the Bell unit trains were Consent Leasing. I guess leased from them by Bell due to a shortage of their own boxes at the time.

[dave182]

By coincidence, I've just got home and the postman has been today! I only placed this order with Arran at C-rail on Saturday evening! Well done Sir! It really is pot luck with the UK at the moment. Anyways, wanted to do a 90's liner and this is a good start!

Edited February 13, 2022 by dave182

[murphaph]

Cast Cuts Costs.....unless you can't stop buying them lol.

[Arran]

HI All

 

Nedloyd lines were about from the late 70s through to 1990 then the merged with P&O but like all fallen flags the boxs live on till they die .

The Hornby containers for livery are ok "some dodgy colours and the rib profile is mince " and they miss of the roof numbers , have moulded on locking bars and are more expensive the C RAIL ,   their tanks are very nice and are basses on one got info of at Felixstowe.

More OO this year and Nedlloyd is on the old style  20ft list of to do models .

 

Regards Arran

 

[murphaph]

Any chance of the old lovely garish YM LINE 40' ones @Arran ? They were regulars on Irish trains in the 90s. Sometimes several in a train. The plain green Consent Leasing also a big gap I'd say. Boring enough container but very prototypical in a Bell Lines block train. Also be nice to see the 20' Bell reefers and tanks make a reappearance some time

[Rob]

Surely @Arran, the BLS 20ft is an absolute must at this stage..... !!!

[Arran]

HI All

Even WSI who i think is the model pic have printed all that over a std 20ft container with all those prints in the wrong place .

I've only seen those on lorry's over in the UK but that's not to say they never have been on rail.

whats the load ?

 

Regards Arran

 

 

 

 

[Rob]

That is why we need you @Arran to make them, to get the container 100% right!!!!

They are regularly on the liner trains here-  have been for a decade at least, (probably longer) and transport bulk food commodities as far as l know.

Look forward to the next OO offerings!

(Picture below from 'quality-freight.com').

 

[MOGUL]

23 hours ago, Rob said:

That is why we need you @Arran to make them, to get the container 100% right!!!!

They are regularly on the liner trains here-  have been for a decade at least, (probably longer) and transport bulk food commodities as far as l know.

Look forward to the next OO offerings!

(Picture below from 'quality-freight.com').

 

Around since about 2012 I think, will check tomorrow.. They carry powdered ingredients in a big bag inside the box.. Not all of them have the BLS livery, some are still marked as unit 20, the lessor https://unit45.com/en/products/unit45-specials/20ft-bulk-25/

And there are some with 6 roof hatches instead of 4, just for a tooling variation!

Also they are a bit unusual that they are 9ft high, so that WSI model is even 4in too short! It does mean that the Bachmann 20ft is a decent starting place to kit bash one, I made some progress on this a few years back before it went in the spares box.. 

They are regulars on rail in Ireland and mainland Europe, not so much in the U.K..

IWT also had a small fleet of 20ft bulk boxes for a few years, but they never got livery stickers and stayed in cronos livery.. Could be a nice what if model if someone was going to tool them though! 

[Rob]

Thanks- very interesting and knowledgeable as always.

They were around in 2012 for sure- spot on

 

[MOGUL]

On 9/2/2022 at 10:15 AM, johnfromoz said:

Indeed.  This whole are of box liveries is overlooked most of the time, but is an absolute minefield and a recipe for time travel on your layout if  not researched even to a basic level given that we spend huge amounts of time and effort in ensuring accuracy of passenger stock and loco liveries.  For example the bauxite GENSTAR livery was so widespread and around for 30 yrs globally, yet was replaced around the turn of this century by SeaCo. Similarly, the original P&O appears to be long gone, (unless you count 45’ boxes) as has CAST and many others, Hornby currently sell the 20ft box in ONE livery of reversed Magenta and white, but I have yet to find evidence of its use in UK, Ireland and possibly elsewhere. The 40ft version can rarely be seen.  The enduring liveries of Maersk, Triton, Tex and Evergreen are safe bets for covering a near 40 yr span, albeit with some subtle updates and modernised design of the boxes themselves.

100%, I know it's not everyones cup of tea, but for a modern era layout having a train with the right containers on it is as important as having the right rolling stock.. They might not be as glamourous as a Pullman, clerestory or even a MK3 but that doesn't mean they arent interesting and it's a while subject in its own right.. 

The Hornby white ONE box is a dry box tooling masquerading as a 20ft reefer box(reefers are normally always white, OOCL excepted!).. So based on the wrong prototype to begin with but alright for non-rivet counters trying to fill out 7 or 8 bogies

 

 

On 13/2/2022 at 11:02 PM, murphaph said:

Any chance of the old lovely garish YM LINE 40' ones @Arran ? They were regulars on Irish trains in the 90s. Sometimes several in a train. The plain green Consent Leasing also a big gap I'd say. Boring enough container but very prototypical in a Bell Lines block train. Also be nice to see the 20' Bell reefers and tanks make a reappearance some time

Bachmann did a consent leasing using the 13.6m swap body tooling, but they are hard to get now as they were released about 15 years ago now..

https://www.hattons.co.uk/498596/bachmann_branchline_37_300a_po12_2_intermodal_bogie_wagons_with_2_45ft_containers_consent_leasing_pre_owned_wea/stockdetail

The consent boxes were around for a long time, from the early 1990s to the mid 2010s, we used to move them on the IWT until about 2017.. 

But for 45fts dapols tooling is the best so far, as Bachmanns is too low and not quite right for the later LEG1 boxes and is more like a 13.6m European swap body than a 45ft short sea box

 

Edited February 16, 2022 by MOGUL

[johnfromoz]

On 17/2/2022 at 4:01 AM, MOGUL said:

100%, I know it's not everyones cup of tea, but for a modern era layout having a train with the right containers on it is as important as having the right rolling stock.. They might not be as glamourous as a Pullman, clerestory or even a MK3 but that doesn't mean they arent interesting and it's a while subject in its own right.. 

The Hornby white ONE box is a dry box tooling masquerading as a 20ft reefer box(reefers are normally always white, OOCL excepted!).. So based on the wrong prototype to begin with but alright for non-rivet counters trying to fill out 7 or 8 bogies

 

 

Bachmann did a consent leasing using the 13.6m swap body tooling, but they are hard to get now as they were released about 15 years ago now..

https://www.hattons.co.uk/498596/bachmann_branchline_37_300a_po12_2_intermodal_bogie_wagons_with_2_45ft_containers_consent_leasing_pre_owned_wea/stockdetail

The consent boxes were around for a long time, from the early 1990s to the mid 2010s, we used to move them on the IWT until about 2017.. 

But for 45fts dapols tooling is the best so far, as Bachmanns is too low and not quite right for the later LEG1 boxes and is more like a 13.6m European swap body than a 45ft short sea box

 

Thank you Mogul, that was interesting information  about the ONE reversed livery.  Am I right in my assertion that the 20’ magenta on white has never been seen on UK/Irish rails?  The 40’ reefer appears occasionally.  Might just respray the hornby 20’.

[MOGUL]

23 minutes ago, johnfromoz said:

Thank you Mogul, that was interesting information  about the ONE reversed livery.  Am I right in my assertion that the 20’ magenta on white has never been seen on UK/Irish rails?  The 40’ reefer appears occasionally.  Might just respray the hornby 20’.

The colours are reversed so the 20ft livery is wrong.. A reefer has smooth sides like the image below.. 

ONE line is relatively new, it has only existed since 2017. I can't even find images of 20ft ONE reefers online, and have never handled a shipment using one.. So definitely there has never been a 20ft ONE line reefer on rail in this country..  40ft Reefer and 40ft Dry vans yes, we move 2-4 ONE 40ft dry boxes a week to/from Ballina.. https://www.linkedin.com/posts/anfaulkner_iwt-one-activity-6601039549139419137-v3US/

 

Edited February 18, 2022 by MOGUL

[Rob]

On 16/2/2022 at 5:01 PM, MOGUL said:

 I know it's not everyones cup of tea, but for a modern era layout having a train with the right containers on it is as important as having the right rolling stock.. 

 

Soooo true!

@MOGUL information about containers is so great to hear- brilliant!   

[Arran]

[MOGUL]

On 20/2/2022 at 1:35 PM, Arran said:

Only pic I could find too Arran.. have you seen one in the flesh yet?

[DJ Dangerous]

I saw two lovely CMA CGM babies sitting outside Decathlon in La Laguna earlier...

Are these in a revised livery with Seaco and Seacell added?

They are slightly different to my C-Rail CMA CGM HC's.

Is this the guise in which they currently run in Ireland?

Maybe @ttc0169 or @MOGUL could confirm?

If so, do you have any plans for a run of them, @Arran?

 

 

Edited March 8, 2022 by DJ Dangerous

[Arran]

HI All 

 

as these not pallet wide thingy's !!!!  i think the ribs interlock on ships so they fit in the available space . Oh and the answer is NO .

 

[popeye]

Here is another ONE, not in Ireland ONE, but it is a Reefer ONE.

 

[popeye]

Not much use to us if they are not transported here.

Something that crossed my mind one day was, why does C-rail not do 45s?

[DJ Dangerous]

16 minutes ago, popeye said:

Not much use to us if they are not transported here.

Something that crossed my mind one day was, why does C-rail not do 45s?

Because IRM are holding back their P47!

[jhb171achill]

On 16/2/2022 at 5:01 PM, MOGUL said:

…… I know it's not everyones cup of tea, but for a modern era layout having a train with the right containers on it is as important as having the right rolling stock……

Not within my modelling era preference, and something I confess to knowing less than zero about, but totally right. Your info on this thread is invaluable.

[MOGUL]

On 8/3/2022 at 5:27 PM, DJ Dangerous said:

I saw two lovely CMA CGM babies sitting outside Decathlon in La Laguna earlier...

Are these in a revised livery with Seaco and Seacell added?

They are slightly different to my C-Rail CMA CGM HC's.

Is this the guise in which they currently run in Ireland?

Maybe @ttc0169 or @MOGUL could confirm?

If so, do you have any plans for a run of them, @Arran?

 

 

As Arran said already, its a Pallet wide 40ft.. They are inter-EU and related area(North Africa, Canaries) only.. In my time in shipping they have only been associated with the Iberian market, OPDR(Canaries Specialists), McAndrews(Spain to Ireland/UK and NW Europe) and also containerships to/from the Baltic, all of those were bought by CMA CGM and merged into their Containerships European Short sea operations.. We used to have about 1 per week to/from Ballina until about 2018, however due to their limited usage for export lanes we stopped that and changed to using standard deep sea 40ft containers instead.. The OPDR Red ones were one of the better looking containers IMO http://www.matts-place.com/intermodal/part4/opdu4111478.jpg

In the mid 90s and early 2000s they would likely have been more common as they were the predecessors to the 45ft containers we use now.. I would imagine the containerships units *might* have travelled on liners as containerships seemed to ship into Waterford with BELL Lines, certainly I have seen containerships units(Orange and Green Livery) mixed in with Bells on liners, whether these were 4EG1 pallet wides or standard 40fts I don't know, I was 4 when BELL lines shut!

They aren't a millions miles different from the 4CG1 types also, those are also 40ft Pallet wides for the European Markets but seem to have different bottom rails and corrugations.. Seawheel being the most notable operator of that type in an Irish Railways context..

 

 

Edited March 9, 2022 by MOGUL

[Arran]

 

HI All

 

Just to wet your lips with some reefers in OO which will be going into production very soon.

 

The P&O is the mid 90s to about 2010 and the ONE in bang up to date 

 

Regards Arran

 

 

 

 

 

[Rob]

Great news-  look forward to them

[murphaph]

They're both hi-cubes, right?

[Arran]

57 minutes ago, murphaph said:

They're both hi-cubes, right?

Yes Both HC reefers

[Sean]

Just noticed that these Hornby containers have moving doors.

They kept that well hidden!