A few from Malahide Model Railway Museum

[jhb171achill]

I’ve always been fascinated with brake vans, so here are a few of the very diverse range of narrow gauge ones which ran here - plus some Donegal and other beauties.

As an aside, a Midland six-wheeler in maroon livery (1918-25). Despite the vast, overwhelming majority of MGWR passenger stock remaining brown from the dawn of time to 1918, before the gradual livery change to maroon, and the fact that the blue and white livery was both very short-lived indeed, and only ever applied to a fraction of their stock, all of Cyril Fry’s MGWR models are either blue and white, Midland maroon, or GSR maroon.

Maybe he just didn’t care for the lined brown….

[Tullygrainey]

Wonderful stuff. That Donegal railcar is a gem.

[jhb171achill]

5 hours ago, Tullygrainey said:

Wonderful stuff. That Donegal railcar is a gem.

I’ll get you more pics of it tomorrow. I’ll be in there most of the afternoon.

[airfixfan]

Love the Donegal.stuff John

[jhb171achill]

A bit more of the railcar:

…

 

I’ve also a particular liking for this loco:

[Tullygrainey]

The workmanship and attention to detail in these models is just a joy. And all built long before the availability of all the materials, support and ready made bits we have access to these days. 

[jhb171achill]

Some northern stuff today.

First, Clogher Valley. The dark maroon carriage paint is not just authentic; it may be actual original paint. The CVR maroon was, in Senior’s opinion, slightly darker than the “standard” sort of maroon used by the NCC, BCDR & GSR. He was invited to tour the railway and works in 1940 when he had just joined the GSR, and a coach was in the middle of being painted in Aughnacloy Works, so he saw it fresh.

.

For our budding NCC narrow gauge modellers…..

.

 

Wagons - GNR. Buy yours now from Provincial McAllister!

Edited September 30, 2022 by jhb171achill

[jhb171achill]

.

We can’t leave out the SLNCR, of course, nor the BCDR….

[Niles]

On 24/9/2022 at 4:23 PM, jhb171achill said:

 

 

I’ve also a particular liking for this loco:

Always wondered by the GSR chose I for 0-6-2T when it otherwise followed the LNER convention (which would be N). I think, unless there were other examples. 
(Or did the LNER follow them?)

 

Edit: it occurs to me that G didn't follow LNER convention either.

Edited September 30, 2022 by Niles

[jhb171achill]

Actually, I should mention - if there’s anything in the Fry collection that anyone wants more pictures of at any time, ping me privately and I’ll take pics for you. 

2 minutes ago, Niles said:

Always wondered by the GSR chose I for 0-6-2T when it otherwise followed the LNER convention (which would be N). I think, unless there were other examples. 
(Or did the LNER follow them?)

Dunno the answer to that! The systems WERE similar, but not identical.

[Bob229]

Great to see, must visit is there parking on site?

[jhb171achill]

6 minutes ago, Bob229 said:

Great to see, must visit is there parking on site?

Parking directly across the road, first two hours free, and free all day Sunday. Within the museum grounds, disabled parking only.

[Bob229]

17 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

Parking directly across the road, first two hours free, and free all day Sunday. Within the museum grounds, disabled parking only.

Thank you for that  will visit 

[Rush and Lusk]

Fantastic photographs Jonathan, not to mention the amazing skill of Mr Fry.

For Bob229 - also lots of parking down around the Marina if full nearer the Museum and Castle park - unfortunately there are parking charges (as it seems almost everywhere now). Finally, there is always the train - the station is almost next door to the museum, very short walk.  

[jhb171achill]

In response to a request, these are Fry’s Blessington tramway models.

Edited October 4, 2022 by jhb171achill

[Horsetan]

Some of the flange profiles are remarkably fine for their day.....

[jhb171achill]

15 minutes ago, Horsetan said:

Some of the flange profiles are remarkably fine for their day.....

They certainly are! And he used coarse scale track!

[jhb171achill]

A little more from Fry. These are his two Waterford & Tramore locomotives. 

[Mayner]

On 1/10/2022 at 4:36 AM, Niles said:

Always wondered by the GSR chose I for 0-6-2T when it otherwise followed the LNER convention (which would be N). I think, unless there were other examples. 
(Or did the LNER follow them?)

 

Edit: it occurs to me that G didn't follow LNER convention either.

The LNER classification system seems to have originated on the Great Northern Railway (England!) under Henry Ivatt (ex-GSWR man) as CME.

GSWR introduced a similar "Inchacore Class" system in which the 213 Class 0-6-2T t received the classification "I"

It looks like the "Inchacore" system was introduced following J R Bazin's (an ex-Doncaster man) appointment as GSWR CME in 1920 his powerful 500 Class 4-6-0s are designated B1 while to older inside cylinder 362 Class 4-6-0s were classified as B3.

The 'Inchacore' system was modified following the 1925 amalgamation with some classes re-designated subject to reflect tractive effort 341 "Sir William Goulding" the GSRs most powerful 4-4-0 was re-classified from D3 to D1 and the 333 Class Rosslare Bogies re-classified from D1 to D2,3,4 and the two 213 Class Banking Tanks re-classified from "i" to I1. The tiny McDonnell 0-6-0T 90, 99,10 were re classified from J13 to J30.

The main theoretical benefit of the GSR system is that it would have allowed motive power planners who were unfamiliar with locos from different pre-amalgamation companies to identify and allocate locos to meet traffic requirements based on wheel arrangement and hauling power.

In practice the Southern, Midland, South Eastern and West Cork systems continued to operate as separate railways under common ownership, retaining pre-amalgamation motive power and operating practices to the end of steam. The main exceptions were GSWR D4 4-4-0s and MGWR G2 2-4-0s taking over passenger duties on the South Eastern as a result of Civil War casualties and the indigenous motive power wore out, occasional swapping of GSWR & MGWR 4-4-0s on Nenagh and Sligo Road passenger services and  the long term loan of ex-MGWR 0-6-0s for the Waterford Area Beet campaign.

 

Edited October 5, 2022 by Mayner

[Niles]

8 hours ago, Mayner said:

The LNER classification system seems to have originated on the Great Northern Railway (England!) under Henry Ivatt (ex-GSWR man) as CME.

GSWR introduced a similar "Inchacore Class" system in which the 213 Class 0-6-2T t received the classification "I"

It looks like the "Inchacore" system was introduced following J R Bazin's (an ex-Doncaster man) appointment as GSWR CME in 1920 his powerful 500 Class 4-6-0s are designated B1 while to older inside cylinder 362 Class 4-6-0s were classified as B3.

The 'Inchacore' system was modified following the 1925 amalgamation with some classes re-designated subject to reflect tractive effort 341 "Sir William Goulding" the GSRs most powerful 4-4-0 was re-classified from D3 to D1 and the 333 Class Rosslare Bogies re-classified from D1 to D2,3,4 and the two 213 Class Banking Tanks re-classified from "i" to I1. The tiny McDonnell 0-6-0T 90, 99,10 were re classified from J13 to J30.

The main theoretical benefit of the GSR system is that it would have allowed motive power planners who were unfamiliar with locos from different pre-amalgamation companies to identify and allocate locos to meet traffic requirements based on wheel arrangement and hauling power.

In practice the Southern, Midland, South Eastern and West Cork systems continued to operate as separate railways under common ownership, retaining pre-amalgamation motive power and operating practices to the end of steam. The main exceptions were GSWR D4 4-4-0s and MGWR G2 2-4-0s taking over passenger duties on the South Eastern as a result of Civil War casualties and the indigenous motive power wore out, occasional swapping of GSWR & MGWR 4-4-0s on Nenagh and Sligo Road passenger services and  the long term loan of ex-MGWR 0-6-0s for the Waterford Area Beet campaign.

 

Ah, didn't realise it predated the GSR itself. Interesting background there on the benefits for clerical staff.

[jhb171achill]

13 hours ago, Mayner said:

In practice the Southern, Midland, South Eastern and West Cork systems continued to operate as separate railways under common ownership, retaining pre-amalgamation motive power and operating practices to the end of steam. The main exceptions were GSWR D4 4-4-0s and MGWR G2 2-4-0s taking over passenger duties on the South Eastern as a result of Civil War casualties and the indigenous motive power wore out, occasional swapping of GSWR & MGWR 4-4-0s on Nenagh and Sligo Road passenger services and  the long term loan of ex-MGWR 0-6-0s for the Waterford Area Beet campaign.

Very true, yes - though you might add that many GSWR J15s ended up on the South Eastern too, and even one WLWR 2.4.0 ended up in Wexford! It's interesting to contrast this with carriages. GSWR bogie vehicles strayed deep into MGWR territory, with examples seen even on the Loughrea, Ballinrobe and Ballaghaderreen branches, and nat least one GSWR TPO being a regular on the Galway Mail. In return, the ubiquitous MGWR six-wheelers strayed even more - there was one on the waterford & Tramore at one stage, and Senior recalls an influx of them onto the Harcourt Street line about 1930-2. They ended up as far from Broadstone as you can get - on the North Wexford, West Cork, Valentia Harbour, Kenmare and gawwd knows where else - as well as Cork retaining a significant amount of them for Youghal excursions right up to 1963 - the last six-wheelers of any sort in use anywhere in Ireland.

In contrast, it is my understanding that not a single West Cork vehicle ever operated anywhere else - they'd have probably fallen to bits; and DSER vehicles rarely strayed from home, expecially after a CIE pogrom of them in the very late 1940s. By the 1950s, those services on the DSER which were not composed of AEC railcars seemed to be a mix of the remaining DSER stock, Bredins, new laminates and Park Royals, and quite a few GSWR bogies, as well as a few MGWR six-wheelers.

And now - the whole line appears to be operated by two ICRs. Better than a greenway or a station obliterated in favour of a block of gleaming A-rated identikit apartments, but.......................

I won't go into this here for fear of diverting the thread, but I was looking at a photo of a train on the Galway line in the 50s the other night. I counted eight different types of coach - in an 8-coach train! And it occurred to me - in the WHOLE of Ireland today, there are only eight different types of passenger train, and if we allow that 26s and 28s are broadly similar; NIR's 3ks and 4ks are similar, and two types of DARTs are too, that means we've really only about five clearly different types of passenger train, and two of loco - only one of which is in use on passenger - on only two services........... And no, I do not accept the "Wok-Fru" NIR sets to be different - they're simply six-car versions of a normal 3-car set. Move on, nothing to see. To be fair, today is a maintenance man's dream, while prior to 1970 must certainly have been a living nightmare for maintenance regimes, from budgeting to maintaining on the ground......

[Niles]

At least one DSER 2-4-2T tank seems to have wandered to West Cork in GSR days; a photo of same adorns the cover of Ernie Sheperd's book on the Cork, Bandon & South Coast Railway.

[Westcorkrailway]

51 minutes ago, Niles said:

At least one DSER 2-4-2T tank seems to have wandered to West Cork in GSR days; a photo of same adorns the cover of Ernie Sheperd's book on the Cork, Bandon & South Coast Railway.

A LOT of foreign loco power was used on the CBSC. The F6, J26 ect. Along with foreign vehicles. From midland coaches to GNR open wagons. I think the very last bandon coaches were withdrawn in the late 50s. Maybe even 1960 and they were only kept for the courtmacsherry excursions as the curves were challenging 

 

I know the CMDR purchased a tank engine of the the DSER. This had the funny effect of 2 identical locos being designated DIFFERENT classes under amalgamation. 
 

If you go further back the west cork purchased a lot of GSWR stock 2nd hand in the early days. An Ex L&LSR 5’3 engine was converted from 0-6-0 to 2-4-0 for the kinsale branch. 
 

on the opposite end of the spectrum. A few bandon tanks had a vacation on Dublin commuter trains. 1 or two never returning. This is when we got a Bandon tank in Green livery…something I’d love to see modelled accurately 

 

 

[jhb171achill]

More from Fry, for our SLNCR fans.

Fry has reproduced the rich maroon coach livery nicely, as this was rarely clean in traffic. In Senior’s time in Enniskillen, he only ever saw two coaches repainted and none cleaned. The two were six-wheel open brake 3rd No 4, shown by Fry here, and one of the bogies.

The others were so utterly woebegone looking that where the paint hadn’t actually peeled right off to bare wood, the vehicle was so caked in soot and brake dust that you’d never know what colour it was at all! 

All postwar repainted were plain dark red / maroon, none with lining.

With the locomotive, he has picked out what is believed to be the original livery the SLNCR used. At some stage at the start of the 20th century a very much darker green was used on at least a couple of locos, but by the time Senior first visited the line in the late 1930s, it seems that unlined black had taken over. Certainly, by 1950 all SLNCR locos were inclined black. On Lough Erne, the UTA added red connecting rods and their lining.

[jhb171achill]

Off to the Wisht now. The MGWR Directors’ Saloon was reckoned to be the single most luxurious railway carriage ever to run in Ireland.

[WRENNEIRE]

Found these bits today while doing a bit of clearing out,
Letter to C. Fry of W&R Jacob & Co Ltd, Bishop St.
It came from a Mr C Dwyer of Harrington & Goodlass Wall Ltd of Nassau St, Paint manufacturers I believe
It contained Frys list of required transfers and also some unused ones presumably from Nassau St?
If they are of any use to the Museum I would be glad to donate them.

 

 

 

Not sure about 2651 but 1442 was a Park Royal fitted with Storage Heaters for the Ballina Branch as there was no heating van on that route, an unusual coach.

 

[jhb171achill]

They’d be very gratefully received, Wrenneire. Over time more and more of his “bits and bobs” will be displayed.

[minister_for_hardship]

On 5/10/2022 at 4:36 PM, Westcorkrailway said:

A LOT of foreign loco power was used on the CBSC. The F6, J26 ect. Along with foreign vehicles. From midland coaches to GNR open wagons. I think the very last bandon coaches were withdrawn in the late 50s. Maybe even 1960 and they were only kept for the courtmacsherry excursions as the curves were challenging 

 

I know the CMDR purchased a tank engine of the the DSER. This had the funny effect of 2 identical locos being designated DIFFERENT classes under amalgamation. 
 

If you go further back the west cork purchased a lot of GSWR stock 2nd hand in the early days. An Ex L&LSR 5’3 engine was converted from 0-6-0 to 2-4-0 for the kinsale branch. 
 

on the opposite end of the spectrum. A few bandon tanks had a vacation on Dublin commuter trains. 1 or two never returning. This is when we got a Bandon tank in Green livery…something I’d love to see modelled accurately 

 

 

The Macroom purchased Ex GS&WR 266, which was inherited from the WL&WR (their No 13 Derry Castle)

Saw a pic of it once in C&MDR days, the numberplate (6) looked suspiciously like a GSWR plate with the '2' and the second '6' ground off!

6 was in turn renumbered GSR 491 and singleton of Class 491 but its erstwhile WL&WR classmate No 14 Lough Derg/GSR 267 became the sole member of Class 267.

Edited October 6, 2022 by minister_for_hardship

[BSGSV]

23 hours ago, WRENNEIRE said:

Not sure about 2651 but 1442 was a Park Royal fitted with Storage Heaters for the Ballina Branch as there was no heating van on that route, an unusual coach.

At the time Cyril Fry got those, 1442 would have been without the heaters, as they only came in the 1970's. 2651 is an AEC Railcar, one of the last of the "main line" ones.

[jhb171achill]

Despite coming from a decidedly steam background, Cyril Fry threw himself enthusiastically into making models of the new diesel era. Here are a few of his locos from the grey’n’green (and silver!) era.

For modellers, note the attention to detail; I particularly like the gangways on the tin vans - a detail not the most sophisticated on many models.

Lettering in pale green, looking as”weathered” as the real thing. These were the only models of well over 360 that he weathered. Simple reason was that (especially since ends, chassis and roofs were silver too) you never saw a pristine one in traffic. The shaded gold on the PO van and luggage van are incorrect.

Edited October 21, 2022 by jhb171achill

[Westcorkrailway]

4 minutes ago, jhb171achill said:

These were the only models of well over 360 that he weathered….

That’s probobly not a good sign! Although to be fair, I’ve seen 4 year old crossleys that look 40 years old

[jhb171achill]

52 minutes ago, Westcorkrailway said:

That’s probobly not a good sign! Although to be fair, I’ve seen 4 year old crossleys that look 40 years old

Well, that’s it in a nutshell. Nothing silver ever stayed that way more than a few days - or if steam-hauled maybe a few hours!

No wonder they started repainting them green after a couple of years.

[David Holman]

Quality!

[Auto-Train Original]

Cyril Fry really was something else. Incredible photos thanks.

[jhb171achill]

Ireland’s smallest passenger coach, 3ft gauge No. 6, of the Bessbrook & Newry Tramway. The body survived as a summerhouse in a convent, and is now at RPSI Whitehead. Fry caught it too…..

Officially a “brake van”, in reality it was a passenger-carrying vehicle with a handbrake.

Edited October 24, 2022 by jhb171achill