Further 22000 nonsense

[DERAILED]

According to IE's latest Facebook post: https://www.facebook.com/iarnrodeireann

Inter-city trains are to become even ridiculous - see image. Hot on the heels of this comes more speculation about terminating Rosslare trains at Wicklow or Greystones....and it's not even April 1st.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/wexford/news/works-to-help-improve-rosslare-to-dublin-railway-service-are-ongoing/a2134218808.html

 

[hurricanemk1c]

Don't go to Europe then where there's half a vehicle in a similar layout in many Intercity trains crossing countries. It's a good balance of requirements

[DoctorPan]

What makes it nonsense? 

[GSR 800]

On 20/2/2024 at 9:35 PM, DERAILED said:

According to IE's latest Facebook post: https://www.facebook.com/iarnrodeireann

Inter-city trains are to become even ridiculous - see image. Hot on the heels of this comes more speculation about terminating Rosslare trains at Wicklow or Greystones....and it's not even April 1st.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/wexford/news/works-to-help-improve-rosslare-to-dublin-railway-service-are-ongoing/a2134218808.html

 

Nothing ridiculous about it. Badly needed additional bike space + standing room, and likely to be added to consists so another car per train.

Edited February 22 by GSR 800

[Westcorkrailway]

The greystones thing is a little ridiculous though 

[DERAILED]

The 2200s are a horrible experience to travel on - airless, noisy internally from underfloor engines, noisy from lack of any internal partitions, tiny toilets apart from the wheelchair ones, no buffet car and no catering at all.. Having got rid of loco haulage and the associated vans they are now reinventing the wheel. Train travel is now an endurance which I partake of as infrequently as possible.

[jhb171achill]

I have to say I don't mind ICRs.... they're less noisy than 29s or 26s, though I agree with them being airless, which always leads to the toilets being less than pleasant. We can't blame the ICR itself for the lack of catering....

In terms of comfort, the AECs back in the day (before the survivors got plastic seats) were by FAR the most comfortable railcrs ever to run here - but they were noisy too - like a 29 full of marbles in an echo chamber, going down a tin staircase......

AEC railcar seats in the 1950s, with yours truly in it, on the Harkitstreet Line...........

 

[hurricanemk1c]

9 hours ago, DERAILED said:

The 2200s are a horrible experience to travel on - airless, noisy internally from underfloor engines, noisy from lack of any internal partitions, tiny toilets apart from the wheelchair ones, no buffet car and no catering at all.. Having got rid of loco haulage and the associated vans they are now reinventing the wheel. Train travel is now an endurance which I partake of as infrequently as possible.

Have over 150,000 miles on them, if I need to do any kind of work I aim for them and deliberately avoid the bone shaking, dull and considerably more unreliable Mark 4s. The latter I'm sure actually caused bits of my laptop to fail from vibration. Everyone has their own opinion though, but the concept of the new B2 cars is not nonsense just because you don't personally like travelling on them

[minister_for_hardship]

At first glance I thought (Eamon) Von Ryan's Express, but capacity on the existing units for bikes etc was sorely lacking and like it or not, growing numbers of people will want to travel with bikes.

Now, there is a certain looking at the so-called Good Old Days through rose tinted specs for the folks who dislike "modhern" things simply because they're "modhern", but remember the Cravens when one was a sauna you couldn't see out through the windows in and the next one was Siberia? Broken windows flopping down leaving in wind and rain? Leaking roofs? Stinky smoking coaches? 

Would the same people whinge about air travel because the toilet is tiny and they can't open the windows??

Edited February 23 by minister_for_hardship

[Brack]

21 hours ago, DoctorPan said:

What makes it nonsense? 

Only 2 rows of standing in all that space?

Even accounting for rising obesity rates, anyone who's been to London knows full well you could get another couple of rows in that gap in the middle.

[jhb171achill]

I want 1880s six wheelers….. and 4.4.0s in front…..  guess I’m an oul relic!

[DiveController]

On 20/2/2024 at 3:35 PM, DERAILED said:

Where is the dedicated provision for bicycles other than a bicycle on the floor which is where they’ll all end up?

standing on IC services? Lawsuit waiting to happen….

[Mayner]

On 23/2/2024 at 12:56 PM, jhb171achill said:

I have to say I don't mind ICRs.... they're less noisy than 29s or 26s, though I agree with them being airless, which always leads to the toilets being less than pleasant. We can't blame the ICR itself for the lack of catering....

In terms of comfort, the AECs back in the day (before the survivors got plastic seats) were by FAR the most comfortable railcrs ever to run here - but they were noisy too - like a 29 full of marbles in an echo chamber, going down a tin staircase......

AEC railcar seats in the 1950s, with yours truly in it, on the Harkitstreet Line...........

 

Maybe its that I am getting older but I have gone from a strongly pro-rail to a sceptic stance during the past 20 odd years.

Back in the day the AEC railcars were introduced both CIE and the GNR were expected to at least make an operating profit and fund their capital investment. 

In the heyday of 4-4-0s and 6 wheel coaches the GSWR and GSR shareholders expected to receive a dividend on their share holdings.

In 2002 IE received a €166.3m Operating Subsidy and €241m in Capital Grants, while the Government literally pay Season Ticket holders to travel by rail in the form of tax breaks, while the ordinary tax payer pays who largely self fund their own travel through the nose in the form of Excise Duty on Fuel, VRT on new vehicles, Road Tax and fees on Toll Roads.

In these changing times its difficult to see justification for further investment in improving rail or road links to city centres which may empty out as a result of de-centralisation and remote working. 

Over twenty years ago in the days before fibre myself and others successfully worked remotely (from our homes) for an Irish Government agency using dial up internet visiting Head Office in Dublin for weekly/fortnightly meetings, our Regional Offices communicating with Head Office by teleconference. Other agencies were successfully de-centralised to the Regions even to Cahirciveen, until the policy was reversed and re-centralised contributing to increasing congestion and overcrowding in our cities which fueled the Irish Property Bubble and financial collapse through inflated property prices as a result of developers competing for land.

Ironically I found myself mired in bureaucracy unbelievable by Irish standards when I joined the NZ public sector in 2008 despite several re-organisations the level of bureaucracy continued to increase until I jumped ship 10 years later.

[226 Abhann na Suire]

5 hours ago, DiveController said:

Where is the dedicated provision for bicycles other than a bicycle on the floor which is where they’ll all end up?

standing on IC services? Lawsuit waiting to happen….

I see what you mean about the bikes, and I’m not quite sure myself where they go… The problem with standing though is that there are already plenty of people standing on Irish Rail services, beside the toilets, between the carriages, at the doors, regularly the Waterford to Dublin service is standing from Carlow, for the remaining uncomfortable hour and a bit of the journey, so surely adding another 2/3rds of a carriage worth of seating and a dedicated standing area is definitely worth it.

 

The extra carriages will also free up more driving cars by allowing the increase of railcar set lengths which will hopefully mean getting closer towards hourly intercity services and a big increase on the frequency of services on branchline routes so while I understand why some of you are sceptical as to their use or worth, but I do think that any investment in this railway network, after a period of so long without it, is good investment 

[hurricanemk1c]

12 hours ago, DiveController said:

Where is the dedicated provision for bicycles other than a bicycle on the floor which is where they’ll all end up?

standing on IC services? Lawsuit waiting to happen….

There's still the two slots in the A3 car, and there's effectively seat belts in between the tip up seats that strap it a bike in, exactly like a NIR CAF

[Noel]

On 20/2/2024 at 9:35 PM, DERAILED said:

According to IE's latest Facebook post: https://www.facebook.com/iarnrodeireann

Inter-city trains are to become even ridiculous - see image. Hot on the heels of this comes more speculation about terminating Rosslare trains at Wicklow or Greystones....and it's not even April 1st.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/wexford/news/works-to-help-improve-rosslare-to-dublin-railway-service-are-ongoing/a2134218808.html

 

Yes looks like Ryanair's floated plans for standing room on future 737 Max aircraft    

[Noel]

On 22/2/2024 at 11:40 PM, DERAILED said:

The 2200s are a horrible experience to travel on - airless, noisy internally from underfloor engines, noisy from lack of any internal partitions, tiny toilets apart from the wheelchair ones, no buffet car and no catering at all.. Having got rid of loco haulage and the associated vans they are now reinventing the wheel. Train travel is now an endurance which I partake of as infrequently as possible.

Agree 100%. So uncomfortable, not suitable for 2-3hr intercity trips. Sponsored perhaps by Osteopaths and Chiropractors. Not great for ones back after hours. Mk3 were more comfy and quieter, as are mk4 nowadays. Tralee to Heuston direct on a 22k tram is something to be endured. The day they replace the CAF mk4 sets on the cork route is the day we stop taking the train.

[jhb171achill]

The Enterprise is probably the most comfortable of all these days.

[jhb171achill]

On 20/2/2024 at 9:35 PM, DERAILED said:

According to IE's latest Facebook post: https://www.facebook.com/iarnrodeireann

Inter-city trains are to become even ridiculous - see image. Hot on the heels of this comes more speculation about terminating Rosslare trains at Wicklow or Greystones....and it's not even April 1st.

https://m.independent.ie/regionals/wexford/news/works-to-help-improve-rosslare-to-dublin-railway-service-are-ongoing/a2134218808.html

 

Even by the NTA’s standards, this is a several light years beyond stupid, as are the Cavan & Leitrim style speeds over the entire route.

[DiveController]

On 24/2/2024 at 10:47 AM, hurricanemk1c said:

There's still the two slots in the A3 car, and there's effectively seat belts in between the tip up seats that strap it a bike in, exactly like a NIR CAF

ok, I get it.  I didn't notice the spaces between seats. Have been on these once or twice in my life only.