RobertRoche Posted February 6, 2018 Posted February 6, 2018 So SpaceX just launched a Tesla Roadster into space and live streamed it. What was more amazing was landing two of the boosters vertically back at the launch site at Cape Canaveral. The end of this video from a youtuber shows the boosters landing - recommended watching: 1 Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 Yes pretty cool technology, it is a great development for getting into space and keeping costs down- such a pity that their first test lift flight was a car, something that's totally useless in space! Would have been far better to have programmed the test lift with a necessary space exploration probe- many are been worked on and need to get into space, but hay that's American Candy Shop Corporation buzz! At least SpaceX have changed their idea about sending people to Mars and leaving them totally stranded with no escape, they are now talking about bringing them back- this may be to do with NASA refusing to hire out the launch facility to send people to their doom... Mr Musk gave a number of talks last year about their plans for the Mars missions, its like a Fantasy Film- I read in the Geographic last year SpaceX had 25,000 applications to go to Mars after the release of 'The Martian' He claims that their system will move 1 million people 100 at a time every two years to Mars in about 40 to 100 years, and Mars would be terra-formed by the time the 1 million are there! He doesn't seem to be able to do the maths- one spaceship will move 5,000 people in 100 years!, he will need 200 spaceships in the proposed time scale. Also previous estimates in terra-forming Mars are 500 to anywhere near 1,000 years and there is a big doubt that it can be done- one theory on the Mars atmosphere is that it was once like Earth and the atmosphere leaked out- whats to stop that happening while terra-forming it again, its all guess work at the moment. He also talks about building a city on Mars for the 1 million Martians, a surface city, but says absolutely nothing about the radiation problem that exists outside our severely protected Earth. A large solar flare without Earth protection is instant death- one of the main reasons astronomers/cosmologists believe Mars is dead. The people working on the radiation problem while going to, and staying on Mars, recommend living 20m under the surface, under solid rock- cant do that in a spaceship. They could bring a radiation protection vessel on board the ship, but that would take up all the flight payload- though they could use it on the surface to live in until they dig the mine..... Mr Musk mentions none of this! He also says that an initial flight ticket will cost 250,000 dollars and may reduce to less than 100,000 later on. When he was asked about who they would choose to go on the first human flight, his first words were 'if your prepared to die you can go'... 'it's going to be pretty risky at first'.... 'but hay you got to live it up'.... He also said that the first flight would be in 2022! In the same Geographic article mentioned above it said;- after SpaceX achieved the first booster return and landing in 2016 Mr Musk announced that they would be sending people to Mars in the next couple of years- NASA said 'Not from here mate' Its interesting stuff but....... Eoin 1 Quote
Noel Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 The recovery of the two boosters was the most impressive aspect of that launch. Yes sending humans to Mars to get 'data' seems daft when a small device can achieve the same. No magnetic field = not habitable by humans. Space is rather large so Mars is effectively local. Traveling around inside our own solar system is like island hopping on Lough Erne, not going very far, tipping our toes into the sea at the beach, hardly like Columbus crossing an ocean to get to the new world. Hawkins is right though, our solar system is vulnerable, has a natural life span and will cease, so if this species of homo sapiens is to survive beyond that we need to establish viable human colonies on habitable 'goldilocks' planets that exist around other suitable stars, but we are nowhere remotely near the technology to travel such vast distances. A more realistic option is to send genetic material of many earth species on millions of probes into deep space in the hope one day in many millions of years having survived radiation they by chance strike a suitable planet and evolve over millions of years into new life forms, just "not life as we know it Jim". Piggybacking a ride on a comet is perhaps one way of sending genetic material out of the solar system. Travel between galaxies is another level of impossible mathematical distance for life to hop even at the speed of light. In the short term the moon offers more viable options than Mars for acting as a sort of stage II launch facility for various exploratory and data gathering missions but not until new technology has been invented. In the mean time there are bigger and more pressing problems to solve here and now on our fragile blue planet. Quote
Georgeconna Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 "establish viable human colonies", We done such a good job here in the last 100 years I pity any Planet we visit and will call home. Remarkable tech to do this though. 1 Quote
minister_for_hardship Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 What was the point of the car as payload? Resembles a student rag week stunt (albeit an expensive one) Quote
Railer Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 12 minutes ago, minister_for_hardship said: What was the point of the car as payload? Resembles a student rag week stunt (albeit an expensive one) I think it's supposed to be a symbol of his confidence in his product. It's an item of sentimental value to him, apparently. Quote
Warbonnet Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 10 minutes ago, minister_for_hardship said: What was the point of the car as payload? Resembles a student rag week stunt (albeit an expensive one) Marketing. Quote
Noel Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 22 minutes ago, Warbonnet said: Marketing. Yip, good PR and it worked because we are posting about it here in a model train forum Mind you using large rockets sort of goes against his 'green' credentials. Quote
Warbonnet Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 12 minutes ago, Noel said: Yip, good PR and it worked because we are posting about it here in a model train forum Mind you using large rockets sort of goes against his 'green' credentials. Must see if I can get a pack of bubbles on board the next one... Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 33 minutes ago, Warbonnet said: Marketing. Hi IRM Very disappointed with you guys that Mr musk got there before you! I know he has loads more money then you but your rocket would not be as big as his and it could be made out of lightweight materials- though I do recommend using metal near the engines just in case - plastic might melt with the heat.... 'Space Bubble' Eoin 5 Quote
Warbonnet Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 1 minute ago, murrayec said: Hi IRM Very disappointed with you guys that Mr musk got there before you! I know he has loads more money then you but your rocket would not be as big as his and it could be made out of lightweight materials- though I do recommend using metal near the engines just in case - plastic might melt with the heat.... 'Space Bubble' Eoin Well, that's project 4 out of the bag... 1 2 Quote
Noel Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 4 minutes ago, Warbonnet said: Well, that's project 4 out of the bag... Oh no, I'm a learner - I don't know how to weather rockets!!! And where in the world does one get the correct DCC sound chip for one? 1 Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 1 minute ago, Noel said: Oh no, I'm a learner - I don't know how to weather rockets!!! And where in the world does one get the correct DCC sound chip for one? Noel Sure its all there for you curtsy of Mr Musk- stick the rocket together and then throw it into the microwave until slightly brown on the edges...... Eoin 1 Quote
Warbonnet Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 7 minutes ago, Noel said: Oh no, I'm a learner - I don't know how to weather rockets!!! And where in the world does one get the correct DCC sound chip for one? Luckily I've been to Kennedy space centre, have sent the files to ESU. All good! Quote
Noel Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 16 minutes ago, Warbonnet said: Luckily I've been to Kennedy space centre, have sent the files to ESU. All good! Phew, have you the five F-1s? PS: Btw, are you planning Crossley 2-stroke or EMD 645E DCC sound on board for the A class? Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 1 hour ago, Noel said: Yip, good PR and it worked because we are posting about it here in a model train forum Mind you using large rockets sort of goes against his 'green' credentials. Noel Forget 'green credentials' relating to launching rockets! sending people out into space to their doom is a far worse crime, on earth we put people away for this.... Eoin Quote
Broithe Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 8 minutes ago, murrayec said: Noel Forget 'green credentials' relating to launching rockets! sending people out into space to their doom is a far worse crime, on earth we put people away for this.... Eoin We have no shortage of doom here, no need to go off looking for it. 1 Quote
WRENNEIRE Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 A few candidates on here for that first flight to Mars..... Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 3 minutes ago, WRENNEIRE said: A few candidates on here for that first flight to Mars..... I believe their looking for candidates who can handle high speed vehicles, and on/off switches for blue flashing lights Eoin 1 1 Quote
Broithe Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 19 minutes ago, murrayec said: I believe their looking for candidates who can handle high speed vehicles, and on/off switches for blue flashing lights Eoin Perhaps those that have been issued with these small personal rocket launchers might be first in the queue? Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 Spot on Broithe, I reckon that would be very handy, I see also it comes with pens- a bit of cost saving there! Eoin Quote
Broithe Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 7 minutes ago, murrayec said: Spot on Broithe, I reckon that would be very handy, I see also it comes with pens- a bit of cost saving there! Eoin Oh, I thought they were tranquilliser darts. Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 Just now, Broithe said: Oh, I thought they were tranquilliser darts. even handier, one could sleep all the way to Mars.... We better stop this, we're a bit off thread.... Eoin Quote
Broithe Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 2 minutes ago, murrayec said: even handier, one could sleep all the way to Mars.... We better stop this, we're a bit off thread.... Eoin I understand the car is slightly off-course, too.. 1 Quote
WRENNEIRE Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 First 2 candidates just been selected 1 1 Quote
Garfield Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/07/elon-musk-space-car-overshoot-mars-asteroid-belt?CMP=fb_gu Oops... Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 Well now, Thats a bit embarrassing! Lucky he chose a Mars Test Dummy to send, and its only a car and not a space probe as I was suggesting above- phew! Tell Fran that it might be best to hold off on that pack of bubbles until Mr Musk takes a few more swings at it- sure if he does it enough times one will land on the putting green!! I'll bring me soda rocket to the Stillorgan car park on Sunday, if Fran brings the pack, we can see what we can do! Eoin 2 Quote
Noel Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 1 hour ago, Garfield said: https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/07/elon-musk-space-car-overshoot-mars-asteroid-belt?CMP=fb_gu Oops... Yip and the central stage ran out of 'propellant' and crashed into the sea at 300mph missing its landing on the barge (range anxiety huh). A bit like BEVs, a lot of promises but not quite there yet. But boy the synchronised landing of the two outer stages was mega impressive, the most impressive 'space' thing I've seen since Armstrong stepped of the LM onto the surface of the moon in 1969. Not much has happened since then in terms of space technology. We've gone backwards, space shuttle gone, supersonic concord gone, HSS ferry gone, SR-71 gone, harcourt street line closed, mk3s replaced by yoyo roller-skate luas'y things. 1 2 Quote
murrayec Posted February 7, 2018 Posted February 7, 2018 Noel An incredible amount has happened since the Giant Leap For Mankind! the Hubble telescope, Huygens, Cassini, James Web telescope, the comet lander, all the Mars Landers, the gravitational wave telescopes, and all the other land based visual & IR telescopes, the Space Station, the satellite systems, the China moon lander last year - the list is endless....man! Eoin 2 Quote
Broithe Posted February 8, 2018 Posted February 8, 2018 38 minutes ago, murrayec said: Noel An incredible amount has happened since the Giant Leap For Mankind! the Hubble telescope, Huygens, Cassini, James Web telescope, the comet lander, all the Mars Landers, the gravitational wave telescopes, and all the other land based visual & IR telescopes, the Space Station, the satellite systems, the China moon lander last year - the list is endless....man! Eoin Simply having half a dozen people in space almost continuously for almost the whole of this century to the point where hardly anybody takes any notice any more, or would be able to name even one of them, is a massive change from the excitement of the "old days". It's an interesting task to find out when there was last nobody off the planet... 1 Quote
Noel Posted February 8, 2018 Posted February 8, 2018 I grant you there have been some incremental progress steps, but nothing remotely as big as that period from 1957 to 1969 after which the cold war space race funding dried up. All the significant recent 'human' stuff has been in orbit which is effectively still Earth based. A relative analogy might be we went down to the beach in 1969, stuck our toe in the water, and managed to stand on a stepping stone in the water as we looked across the Atlantic ocean wondering if one day we could cross it to a new habitable world. The last time we made 'first contact' was in 1492 when Columbus crossed the Atlantic to discover a habitable new world with 'alien' human civilisations We haven't yet understood, discovered nor yet invented the technology required for the next big step which is travelling a distance of more than one light year, wither that involves actually moving mass through what we understand as space or by other means we do not yet comprehend! Getting a probe inside another planetary star system won't happen in our life time, and by the time its data is transmitted back it won't even be in the life time of those who built in. Like 1492, since 1969 (or even Einstein) we have technologically plateaued for now. The 1977 launched Voyager with its Commodore 64 computing power will pass close to a star in 40,000 years time. Quote
murrayec Posted February 8, 2018 Posted February 8, 2018 (edited) Hi Noel I'm sorry but I believe you are in the same fantasy movie Mr Musk is in! there is a purpose to all the low orbit space tech going on, building up the foundation work for doing the 'harder things'. Its small steps over time that lead to Giant Leaps, based on sound research tech, tried n tested over again which leads to big and hopefully safe success- not blasting a car into space and being unable to control where its going. NASA and some of their buddies have a relatively good track record, although they have killed in the region of 300 people in the process, they are building on previous experience and hopefully will do better... NASA's program for a manned mission to Mars seems to be structured well, they are developing their system over a long time- a more experienced base structured system (Mr Musk would not be in position today without all that has gone before) and believe their manned launch time is 2050 or thereabouts. Their not planning space tourism or a commune on Mars, its R&D on the path of 'harder things', they plan to send them up do the work and bring them back, if successfully they move to the next step..... No one is planning a probe to another planetary star system, some are developing propulsion systems for the future- ion drive, partial drive, solar sail... etc and they are the future, also for fantasy movies and Nova TV. Its our planetary system their interested in and they know the limitations..... Eoin Edited February 8, 2018 by murrayec 1 1 Quote
Broithe Posted February 8, 2018 Posted February 8, 2018 As daft as flinging the car up is, I suppose the idea is to get people 'interested'. It was a test of a vehicle that you can't really try out gently round an empty car park and maybe a 'serious' payload wasn't worth the risk? We have come to rely on earth-orbit satellites for a lot of daily life, not just GPS and re-runs of old TV programmes. The fact that stuff has become commonplace and a bit boring is often a sign of great progress. Airliners still fly at much the same speeds as they did fifty/sixty years ago, but they don't kill us as often and they're a lot cheaper to use. Landing a thing on a comet has to be counted as impressive, surely? The current Russian system for travel to the ISS hasn't killed anybody for a very long time. Having said that, I would have been impressed if we had stuck a radio telescope on the far side of the Moon, shielded from all the fizz down here. 1 Quote
murrayec Posted February 8, 2018 Posted February 8, 2018 Landing a probe on Titan, sending images and data back also? Quote
Noel Posted February 8, 2018 Posted February 8, 2018 51 minutes ago, murrayec said: Its our planetary system their interested in and they know the limitations..... Fair comment Eoin. 'To infinity and beyond' is a while down the road yet. 1 Quote
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