jhb171achill

I'm actually beginning (just about!) to prefer that all-grey to the black and silver! Probably mostly because there's less yellow....

From an old diary: Saturday: Cork with (brand new) 071. Sunday: Belfast with 060 (A60). Monday: Sligo with a pair of 121's (numbers not recorded), returning with 133 + 135 (cab run as far as Dromod in leading 133). Tuesday: Cork again with a pair; 121+ unidentified 141, out to Coph and back with 155, cab run. Wednesday: Limerick with unidentified A class, bus to Tralee, and return with 020 (A20) as far as Mallow, then an 071 back to Dublin. On another day, footplated 077 to Cork, came back with another 071, sat in laminate dining car 24xx series, had a well done steak, chips, dessert, tea (from a dribbly pot) on the 17:30 to Heuston, which loaded to 10 bogies and two four wheel "tin vans". Then A class 010 (before it was destroyed in the crash at Lisburn!) to Wexford, 008 back. And a run to Howth with 209 (C class) and a set of ricketty de-engined, plastic seated push-pulls. About a week later, a run from York Road to Coleraine in a 70 class; the driving trailer was leading and the train was trying to make up time. I have never, before or since, had such a lively run on a train anywhere in the world! Then a run along Lisburn - Antrim in a single car MPD - the line had just been re-opened. It was to be the only time I travelled in an MPD. It might have been No. 64 or 65 - not sure. I noted that it was some five years since my last journey in one, which had seen me taking an ex-GN railcar set in black'n'tan to Dundalk, changing there into a similar set, but in NIR livery.... The CIE ones had unusual circular neon light bulbs, while the NIR ones had straight ones! At Portadown, three drunk young men got on and spent the rest of the journey singing offensive sectarian songs.... Those were the days. Apart from the songs, wouldn;t it be great to have a little of it back!

Interesting! So that confirms it. Maybe the railways of Antarctica will adopt the MGWR coat of arms next! :-)

In relation to how common these were, they were more common probably than any other type! But CIE embarked on a programme of building their standard ones in the 50s, and as Mayner says, anything deemed non-standard by Inchicore was the first to go. One van, Timoleagure & Courtmacsherry No. 5, did make it to the closure of the West Cork system (and for those interested, in battered weathered all-grey; no stripes of course). The above type was to be seen on goods train into the late 60s on occasions, but I would not think after that.

That's in Head Hunters in Enniskillen. The paint on all those crests is original railway company stuff. I can vouch for the ancestry of the excellent collection in Head Hunters Railway Museum there, which is well worth a look. That particular "snail" was presented to the original owner by the DUT Co. Thus, the paint is one of the few genuine examples of the exact green used by the DUT - and CIE - until the lighter green came into use in 1955.

That would seem most likely. The story of how DUTC got it is widely quoted by reliable sources; thus it does indeed seem the Dutch copied it from either DUTC or early CIE. Done'n'dusted!

If they had it in the 1940s, I suppose either the Dutch could have copied it from the DUTC (rather than CIE), but equally the DUTC could have copied it from the Dutch. If the Dutch bus livery turns out to be pre-1941, then the DUTC have directly copied it from the Dutch - thus the original theory about the London Transport origin needs considerable amendment. Could the Dutch have based their design on London, followed by CIE copying it? Either is possible, but the London Transport theory has wide currency.

I wonder where they got it from, and when? CIE adopted it directly from the Dublin United Tramways Company, who had introduced it about 1941. The DUT based the design on the London Underground "bar and circle" device, still used today - possibly one of the longest running corporate identity logos in the world?

Maybe it would, Broithe - I was just guessing. Maybe HO would actually be a better base for Irish modelling!

I have to say I can't remember a change of logo, but when new they were painted white on the actual tank bit, with dark green below (bogies also, I think), and an orange stripe perhaps a foot thick along the waistband of the tank. The white weathered fairly quickly with brake dust to look creamy coloured or light brown.

I wonder has any scratch builder ever put together a layout using conventional 00 gauge track, but with models scaled down to maybe 3.5mm to the foot in order to make 00 gauge track accurately represent 5ft 3?

Indeed, Warbonnet! Sometimes it seems April 1st all the time! :-)

Excellent pics!

That brake van is of GSWR origin, probably 1910-ish era but I am not sure. In terms of livery, no brake vans were brown at that stage, nor were any striped. They were grey all over; roof and chassis included. The black paint on the preserved NCC one at Downpatrick and the "Ivan" one at Whitehead are not historically accurate. The livery on the plough van at Downpatrick is entirely fictitious; with GSWR lettering it should be dark grey or all over black. If lettered for GSR or CIE, grey - though post 1970-ish it would have been brown all over, chassis included, under CIE ownership. To go back to CIE vans and livery details, the grey began to be relieved by stripes in the mid 60s. From about 1970 or so (can't be certain of exact date), brown with stripes began to be used by CIE. No goods brake vans were ever all brown without stripes. Contrary to what you can see in the UFTM at Cultra, the stripes were always yellow and black, never white and black. In fact, most unfortunately, not one item in Cultra which has been painted by UFTM has an accurate livery - but that's for another day! As far as I can tell, CIE never painted stripes on any vans which were not of the "modern" standard CIE design, nor were any painted brown. Thus, any old steam era brake van is all grey, and probably also needs to be well weathered to look right!

There is indeed an arrangement for the DCDR to take a 2 car 80 at some stage; this should go ahead but cannot be said to be definite until nearer the time. DCDR will not be taking a Castle Class; it has neither been offered one nor, it has to be said, does the DCDR want one!

He's got Lough Swilly stuff, Cavan & Leitrim, Blessigton tram, you name it; not so much main line though - was probably too familiar! I confess never to having photographed a 201 or any of the modern railcars, north or south, in me life.... nor a LUAS... nor an 071 since they were brand new.... nor a Mk 2, Mk 3 or Mk 4 coach.... oul fuddy-duddy, me.

Yes, but it's not the same glue I normally use. I think it must have come from Inchicore instead of Broadstone.

If I ever get time, Heirflick; and with the May Tour starting in the morning, it ain't going to be soon! There actually is a point here. When I reflect on what I have been lucky enough to see, and what those now in their eighties onwards tell me that they have seen, it is just staggering how much the railway (or what's left of it) has changed. I am currently going through stuff of Senior's which includes such gems as a run on the footplate of one of the Lough Swilly tender engines in the 30s - I am currently getting his photos of it developed. Once I get several hundred of his stuff done, I will talk to him about what bits I don't recognise. Never mind my own experiences, people that age (94 in his case) have certainly some stories to tell. Another of his relates to encountering the Fintona tram for the first time, again about 1937, and of taking the train to Bessbrook, cycling to Newcastle, and footplating the BCDR to Belfast in time for the last GNR train back to Amiens Street...

I'll see you tomorrow, Snapper! Looking forward to it as ever. But Guinness won't be 40p, like on my first....

Aaaargh!! Even in my far off travels of which I write, ah never saw such a sight.

Guinness then...

Maroon in this case. Yellow flashes should be edged in white, too. And original "upright" NIR logo, edged in white. They looked fantastic in that livery.

Great mushrooms, these..... want some? :-)

There was to be a train on the North Kerry, hauled by 186. I had just started occasionally visiting Whitehead, where my first task had been to help digging out old sleepers with my father, a former PW engineer. "Can we go?" No. Exams. Why can't the RPSI run it in July? Fast forward a few years. There was to be a trip over the Burma Road, again with 186. Exams; albeit the last I would ever have to do. Whew! There was a song on the radio. "Aint Gonna Work No More", by Status Quo. "That's me", I thought. Some people make new year resolutions. I am proud to be able to say I've stuck to that one for over forty years now. Bualadh bos! But after being in employment for several years, when the South Wexford was advertised for 1978, I thought to meself, that'll do me. It was a spectacular trip. The weather was lovely, I had a good set of lenses for a decent camera (pity about the photographer though!), and life was good. The sun split the sky as we trundled along the quays in exford, and I tried to get a decent shot of the old South station out of the carriage window. I bought lots of railway books from the little shop in the end of coach 861, so many that I struggled with my luggage for the rest of the weekend. On the Sunday, 184, 186 and 4 were all in steam at Limerick Junction, and wandering all ov er the yard, the main running lines, and everywhere else, I got some noce shots of the steam trio with a light engine "A" which was sitting on the main line awaiting a signal. I went back to the book shop; think moths and light. The man in charge of it had become used to me by now and asked me if i could keep an eye on it while he went to the loo. I did so, and there began a long long relationship with book sales which will continue 24 hours after I write this. But I was not rostered, I was not crew; I was a paying passenger, so in due course off I went to discuss matters of importance at the bar with like minded barflies. "What do you think of the new engines?" "Haven't seen one yet, but they're just the same as the "B" class, only longer and six wheeled bogies" "Why do they call them 071s - you'd think there'd be a letter, y'know, power classification an all that" "Want a refill there?" "Yes... what's that just passed us?" "The Shelton, didn't see what was on it" "A27 transplant" "Oh. .. Cheers, gimme one of those bags of nuts too" "I'm heading out to take pictures of the Listowel goods next week, ye free?" "Nah... I've a lift arranged on the Kingscourt Goods. If that falls through... here, same again?" I am sure I will hear conversations like that as I go down the diesel trip to Sligo on Friday. Maybe without mention of Listowel, though. But I digress: Fast forward again, but just a few years. 09:30, Tour Saturday, onto the train, photos and pints. Pints, pints, pints. Life is good. Up to the bar, hair o'the'dog won't do any harm. Last night was just massssave, Stepaside were playing in the Baggot Inn. Oh me head. U2 werent supporting that night, haven't seen them in there for a while. Maybe they'll go places. But there was nobody behind the bar. Nobody in the kitchen, and the train was setting off. What I did not know was that at the last minute the catering crew had not been able to make it, and we were looking at the Marie Celeste. Another well known RPSI activist appeared - he too was just enjoying the weekend, off duty. (My role was still primarily carrige restoration at Whitehead ans book sales on day trips). "What's happening", sez he. "Dunno", sez I, but a pint would do no harm. Cue a deluge of Englishmen seeking multiple Guinnii. There was nothing for it. Joe and I got behind the counter and served at the bar all weekend; in my case the bar-serving weekend lasted 11 years. And, no, I never got my pint; my first one was probably 10 pm that night in whatever hotel we were overnighting in. Talk about a baptism of fire. In those days there were many large groups of younger enthusiasts from the UK on the May Tours, and some of these drunk the place dry; great for RPSI fund raising! I seem to remember one lot of gents from a railway society in Birmingham, who were also real ale fanatics. But with such strange stuff not existing in good holy Ireland back in the day, it was Guinness or nothing. So they decided not to opt for nothing. Fast forward again. I'm in charge of the dining car and bar in the early nineties, and we are to pick up the packed lunches at Kilkenny on the Sunday. They have been loaded onto the down Waterford, and once we pull in beside it, myself and three catering crew get down on the track between the Waterford genny van, and our dining car. I climb up to the genny van and open the doors, to the astonishment of the train guard, who is reading the Sunday World. Breathless, I say "Where's the packed lunches?" "Wha? What packed lunches? Ye can't get in here!" I looked about. The van was empty. The guard was not wrong. There were no mobile phones in those days, though one member of our train crew had a large black breeze block with a long aerial, from which calls could be made, reception and weather permitting. The dining car stock was down to a few kit-kats, and we had some 150 punters with tickets which said "Bring me to the dining car after Kilkenny and ye will get yer lunch, so ye will". And they were Q-ing. What to do? Quick thinking used to be a necessity on May Tours, just as Elfin Safety is now. Obligatory. To cut a long story short, Heuston catering had put our lunches on the down Galway, not the Waterford train, and they were speeding towards the bogs from which you must not remove turf right there and then. (Well, you were allowed then; Ming was but a mere youth). Punters were calmly told, "Sorry for the slight delay folks, we'll have the lunches ready at Bagenalstown". (After we've said our prayers). At Bagenalstown, the lunches were unloaded from a white van on the platform and distributed. How did we do this? High friends in low places, and a motor bike escort of said van from Tullamore or somewhere at speed, through the blooming lanes of spring gorse of Co Offally and Laois, on a May Sunday morning. And it's Tour Week. In 24 hours I'll be on it. There's nothing like it, nothing at all. The RPSI May Tour is a life force in itself, an institution, a pillar of the year, of years. In my case, something over 35 of them. Long may they last.

(dunno what happened: it posted half my post!) ..... said the driver, whose name I regrettably forget. I climbed aboard and he set off shortly, as I took a picture of him at the controls. "Where are you going?", I asked. "North Wall", came the answer. We pulled into the yard surrounded by four wheeled container flats, bubbles and fertiliser bogies, presumably for Belfast, and "H" vans by the dozen. At least one "A" was shunting along with a couple of 141s. "Thanks very much", sez I, as I dismounted. Some years later, mental note that this was my only ever cab run in a "C", putting it on a par with a "B101" ("Birmingham Sulzer") in my memory bank of life experiences. I walked around taking pictures of whatever took my fancy, including the last surviving MGWR bogie coach, then used as a departmental vehicle but in perfect condition. What a shame it never made it as far as Whitehead or Downpatrick. I had a good camera. It was my first good one and had cost me £120, or a month's wages. I was very proud of it and was keen to try it out. I finished taking photos and nipped out through a hole in the boundary fencing that a now-well-known railway enthusiast colleague had taught me about! I walked back up to Amiens Street along Sherriff Street. This whole area is now regenerated, as they say; new apartment blocks, new "Spencer Dock" area, looking very well. Back then, it was a run down part of the inner city, and not the place to be hovering about in daylight, never mind after dark. My thoughts were of which "A" would be on my train to Rosslare in the morning, and whether it would be repainted into the new orange and black "Supertrain" livery. A car slowed beside me, and the window wound down. Yes - wound. There were no electric windows then. Or iPads or ICRs. Life was good, and simple. Someone leaned out and beckoned me to go over to them, which I did without thinking twice. "Plees, we lost. We from la France, Pleese you can tell us the way to Doll Key?" I drew the route to Dalkey on their map and they gave me a lift back to Ballsbridge. You thought this story was going to end differently, didn't you!