From the Catacombs

[leslie10646]

Enough for this Day.

But not without lighting a candle and raising a drop of "Bush" to the only railwayman in the family.

Great Uncle Gabriel (a locomotive fireman in Canada) fell during the great Canadian attack on Vimy Ridge in 1917 and died of his wounds 103 years ago today.

At least, unlike those poor NewYorkers seen on the News today, he has an individual marked grave.

RIP

[Mayner]

1 hour ago, leslie10646 said:

Enough for this Day.

But not without lighting a candle and raising a drop of "Bush" to the only railwayman in the family.

Great Uncle Gabriel (a locomotive fireman in Canada) fell during the great Canadian attack on Vimy Ridge in 1917 and died of his wounds 103 years ago today.

At least, unlike those poor NewYorkers seen on the News today, he has an individual marked grave.

RIP

Here here! I just found out today that a very close relative in Ireland ended up in intensive care after he and his wife caught the dreaded virus, fortunately they both safely made it home.

[jhb171achill]

5 hours ago, leslie10646 said:

Back to Albert Quay for a moment.

In the 1970s, I watched a load of slide evenings at the IRRS London by Lance King and the venerated gents known to us all as "The GLO". They always referred to the loco area as "Rocksavage" so, regardless of any evidence to the contrary, it'll always be Rocksavage to me.

 

I posted some random pages out of the 1935 GSR "Appendix" earlier....within these hallowed pages it is "Rocksavage" - yes, the railwaymen DID call it that. I do too, when I must; it just sounds odd!

[jhb171achill]

Another visit to Donegal. These are from 1947, probably, though the loco one could possibly be late ‘30s. 

1.   Strabane. 3’ left, 5’3” right.     

2.   Senior is back up on a carriage roof - some like climbing telegraph or signal posts - Stranorlar.  I’m not sure what’s going on here....

3.   Symphony in red: “Lydia” awaits her next duty.

4.   This one is about 1939 - a big view at Strsnorlar, with a very heavy westbound train.

Edited April 11, 2020 by jhb171achill

[airfixfan]

First photo is Strabane note GNR line to the right. All others are Stranrolar and second photo could have been taken from the footbridge?

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, airfixfan said:

First photo is Strabane note GNR line to the right. All others are Stranrolar and second photo could have been taken from the footbridge?

I've the captions in the wrong order - I'll correct them now!

There!

 

Regarding the footbridge, I think it's a good bit forward of that - and he didn't have a telephoto (few if any did then, of course...). 

Edited April 11, 2020 by jhb171achill

[Midland Man]

Great pics 

how was he a load of the carriage roof?

[jhb171achill]

18 minutes ago, Midland Man said:

Great pics 

how was he a load of the carriage roof?

Nobody worried about things like that in those days! Even in my time exploring in the 1970s, you could go in and out of most places except Inchicore Works, although if you knew someone in there, it was do-able under certain circumstamces. I was there in 1972 or 3, because my father called in to see someone, so I was just let loose to wander. Didn't have a camera that day, though! I remember seeing two "G" class sitting on a siding and any amount of black'n'tan stuff.....and K801.

[jhb171achill]

Narrow gauge locomotives, c.1938.

In the first picture, it’s an extremely dull day, so it’s mite like a silhouette. But an interesting one.

One of the Cavan & Leitrim 4.4.0Ts is going to Inchicore for a heavy repair, and is seen here being loaded onto a transporter wagon at Dromod. A rare shot.

In the other, 9C is out and about on its home turf in Wisht Clare. I haven’t Senior’s notes to hand (he did record date and location) but I think it’s Milltown Malbay.

He did several trips over the line in the 1930s and early 40s, on one of which he only went as far as Milltown, where the down train crossed an up working. This return train could have been passenger or goods, as he went back in the cab. 

NOTE:  

@irishrail201

FAO C & L folks who read here, PM me about this C & L pic.

Edited April 12, 2020 by jhb171achill

[jhb171achill]

On 4/5/2020 at 8:22 PM, Midland Man said:

That livery is lovely I seen a model of the engine in that livery and it looks lovely as well. Is  the green GSR green?

Re No. 90 in Fermoy & Mallow, and Inchicore Open Day, 1996.

Only seeing this now, Midland Man.

No, that Isle of Man type light green was totally fictitious, probably copied from the equally “bright” light green colour then in No. 36 in Cork.

The correct (and verified) GSWR green was the very dark olive shade now seen on Downpatrick’s GSWR No. 90.

The livery on 90 has been verified from original samples seen on an Inchicore-made model held in the Institute of Mechanical Engineers’ offices in London.
 

Downpatrick also have the correct dark brownish-maroon on coach 836, and presumably eventually 69 and 1097 too.

 

[jhb171achill]

Grain wagon, Rock St., Tralee; ex-GNR goods van built 1954 for Drogheda cement traffic, also at Rock St. You can clearly see the “N” of “G  N” on its side, showing through the CIE brown paint, and CIE grey paint under that.

Both 1976.

And reservation labels 85 years apart.

[minister_for_hardship]

3 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

Re No. 90 in Fermoy & Mallow, and Inchicore Open Day, 1996.

Only seeing this now, Midland Man.

No, that Isle of Man type light green was totally fictitious, probably copied from the equally “bright” light green colour then in No. 36 in Cork.

The correct (and verified) GSWR green was the very dark olive shade now seen on Downpatrick’s GSWR No. 90.

The livery on 90 has been verified from original samples seen on an Inchicore-made model held in the Institute of Mechanical Engineers’ offices in London.
 

Downpatrick also have the correct dark brownish-maroon on coach 836, and presumably eventually 69 and 1097 too.

 

90, at Fermoy/Mallow carried a similar shade as carried by 184, perhaps both were painted in or around the same time? The numberplate was not likely to be its GSWR original.

90 in Westrail service carried a blindingly bright Henry the Green Engine green with coat of arms on the side tanks which GSWR locos never carried.

[jhb171achill]

1 minute ago, minister_for_hardship said:

90, at Fermoy/Mallow carried a similar shade as carried by 184, perhaps both were painted in or around the same time? The numberplate was not likely to be its GSWR original.

90 in Westrail service carried a blindingly bright Henry the Green Engine green with coat of arms on the side tanks which GSWR locos never carried.

Correct. 184, at the 1996 open day, was painted like a fairground attraction. Looked quite nice, but historically about as accurate as painting it in NIR blue and silver with a translink logo on it.................

[Midland Man]

Is that the same livery it carried in 1961?(184)

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, Midland Man said:

Is that the same livery it carried in 1961?(184)

It seems to have had some sort of beige-y buff colour then - again, not authentic at all, but painted up for an Inchicore Open Day - admittedly be CIE! So you might argue it was a "real" livery in that sense only - but again, no more like anything either it or anything else ever carried before.

[Galteemore]

That beige livery was applied for the movie,  ‘Darling Lili’, starring Julie Andrews, Rock Hudson, and 184, which limped asthmatically among in its cameo role, shoved by A16 disguised as a luggage van!  184 still wore remains of that livery when it was first overhauled in 1977/8 for RPSI service : the hasty overhaul was occasioned by a much more famous role for 184 in the First Great Train Robbery - also famously starring Moate station - hard to imagine now. Rather like the Quiet Man, it’s a lovely example of really professional film-making capturing the Irish railway scene. Cruelly cosmetically mutilated 184 might have been but those aerial shots of her thumping along are still thrilling! 

Edited April 12, 2020 by Galteemore

[jhb171achill]

Draperstown, I believe, but possibly Dungiven; can anyone advise? Again, I haven’t the notes. Some day I’ll dig them out. I might do a talk to the record society on this stuff if I EVER get time to properly put it together.

So, today a few station views emerge from the mysterious depths:

1.  This is on the Derry Central, but I’m not sure where. 1944, I believe. One of the NCC railcars is parked next to the line of wagons. Senior is out on a line inspection, and this is his chariot for the day. 

2.  Dungiven, I think, but see above. Same inspection trip; railcar at buffer stop. I think this was the car which was also used some years later for an IRRS trip, but I doubt if it got to here, though I am not sure; any clarification on this point welcome.

3.  Banbridge, 1956. Line about to close from Lisburn, the service now ending here after a short time ago they truncated the service on to Newcastle. Newcastle and the main station are straight ahead. Lawrencetown and Scarva are behind. The line to Dromore, Knockmore Junction, Lisburn and Belfast, curves sharply away to the left. All around are track materials recovered from the Scarva branch.

4.  Bantry, Co. Cork. The passenger set sits at the platform, and consists of a van along with a beauty of an old GSWR clerestory-roofed vehicle, evidently still in the early very dark brownish nation of the GSR. This picture dates from about 1937-9.

Edited April 13, 2020 by jhb171achill

[jhb171achill]

Found this, summer 1938. Relating to senior’s trip on the West Clare when he took the pic of the loco above, this was his guide for the day:

I suspect he went down on the 7.15 goods and came back on the 11.40 passenger from Kilrush.

Edited April 13, 2020 by jhb171achill

[Patrick Davey]

Definitely Dungiven - at Draperstown the platform and building were on the down (left) side of the line.

These are exceptional photos JB, thank you for sharing, again, am checking this thread each morning for your latest gems!

[airfixfan]

Agree with Patrick that 2 is Dungiven. Picture 1 might be Draperstown?

Edited April 13, 2020 by airfixfan

[jhb171achill]

I’m having fun going through them..... many I haven’t  even looked at in 10 or 15 years.....

I will have to get the colour stuff scanned. There’s not much of it, and little is “groundbreaking”, but if anyone knows someone who knows someone....

Same with the black’n’whites. Judging by (MANY more) family photographs, as well as these, he only got the colour camera about 1961 or so. Given the memories he had of what you’ve been seeing, it’s easy to appreciate that an A class, silver or not, on an Enterprise of mixed GNR and CIE laminate stock - interesting as it is to us - just didn’t even begin to float his boat!

And with four young children, a wife and a resident mother-in-law to provide for, he hadn’t time to go gricing!

I do remember going to Dungannon with him one day - no photos. And standing on the footbridge at Stranorlar just after they’d lifted the track on another. No photos. That day, we also visited Strabane (up on the footbridge again) and Foyle Road station in Derry, where he showed me the crack in the platform from when the runaway train in the 1950s had walloped the buffers - and continued! Noooo photos.....!

Edited April 13, 2020 by jhb171achill

[Midland Man]

Carriage at banter look like a vintage GWR coach.  I have one I modified for a train formations. Did he do any modeling or was in contact with any modeler. Try and get a pic later.

MM

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, Midland Man said:

Carriage at Bantry looks like a vintage GWR coach.  I have one I modified for a train formations. Did he do any modeling or was in contact with any modeller. Try and get a pic later.

MM

It’s a GSWR bogie, originally built for main line use Dublin - Cork. In modelling terms, there quite a few differences in design with the English GWR - most particularly the latter having bowed-in ends, a feature the GSWR never used.

Your comment got me curious about it, so I did a bit of delving. The clerestory roof is the key; Ireland had very few of these, though they were common in Britain, especially on the MR and the GWR. This is a third class coach, either one of three open but non-gangwayed examples built in 1901, or one of 12 of the exact same design but with gangways, built 1901/2. Initially, my searches concentrated on composites, because I would have considered it much more likely it contained first and third class accommodation. It probably did normally, but why a coach like this was on it on this day, I don't know. It is not a composite coach.

It is not possible to make out (certainly with my eyesight) whether it is one of the ones with corridor connection (not that they'd be any use on a one-coach train!) or not.

The van with it is very hard to make out, but looks like a particular CBSCR brake six-wheeler that I’ve seen pics of.

Senior did indeed do modelling - he had a massive coarse scale 0 gauge layout. Like most modellers, he never got it finished - and he lasted until almost 98!

Edited April 13, 2020 by jhb171achill

[Midland Man]

Her it is was one of my first models and painted it when I was about 9 years old that is why it has the sh$t paint job. Looks well with one or two wagons and a small engine in my case Brain Boru but that was bought faulty and does not run anymore so I am thinking o putting in a new chassis with a sur gearbox. By the way I saw Durgort Barbour at model rail Basebord HQ and it looks the peice.

[Lambeg man]

9 hours ago, jhb171achill said:

I think this was the car which was also used some years later for an IRRS trip, but I doubt if it got to here, though I am not sure; any clarification on this point welcome.

The IRRS visit to the Derry Central line using Railcar No. 4 was in 1959. Both Draperstown (picture 1) and Dungiven (picture 2) were long gone by then. I believe they ran from York Road to Kilrea just before that last remnant was finally closed.  

[jhb171achill]

8 hours ago, airfixfan said:

Agree with Patrick that 2 is Dungiven. Picture 1 might be Draperstown?

Very possibly. He inspected both, but I have a notion he did the other in the cab of a light engine or an empty wagon special, cattle or PW working or something.

[jhb171achill]

A once common sight all over Ireland, loading mailbags are rural stations. This is Claremorris, 1976. Any thoughts, anyone, on the mailvan?

Edited April 14, 2020 by jhb171achill

[jhb171achill]

Back to the 1940s in NCC land today.

Firstly, a few years before CIE’s 1100 or D class shunters saw the light of day, York Road (and, the BCDR) had a small but interesting collection of early diesel shunters. To a GSR man, this must have looked odd.....

As indeed the railcar did. Same car he used to tour much of the NCC on an inspection trip.

Not sure of the location but possibly along the Derry Central, or else Larne line.

(Copyright H C A Beaumont collection)

Edited April 14, 2020 by jhb171achill

[airfixfan]

Looks like NNC Railcar 3 which was virtually identical to Railcar 4. Shunter is NCC 22 which was originally LMS 7057. One of only 3 NCC locos to run on the narrow gauge in Britian as well as Ireland. Will.come back to a location later but it is not the Larne line.

Edited April 14, 2020 by airfixfan

[jhb171achill]

Yes, it is No. 3, and 22.

I suspect the railcar is up the DCR section somewhere.

[bufferstop]

That's actually Claremorris, not Castlebar, but the interesting part is what is a bubble doing parked in Claremorris in 1976?

I've never seen one parked there before, and I thought itcould only handle bagged cement?

Was it common to discharge straight to a truck/mixer so that a customer could order cement in bulk via single wagon loads?

I know the occasional one worked through on the Burma Road goods.

[mfjoc]

1 hour ago, bufferstop said:

That's actually Claremorris, not Castlebar, but the interesting part is what is a bubble doing parked in Claremorris in 1976?

I've never seen one parked there before, and I thought itcould only handle bagged cement?

Was it common to discharge straight to a truck/mixer so that a customer could order cement in bulk via single wagon loads?

I know the occasional one worked through on the Burma Road goods.

Yes bubbles could be discharged anywhere using the compressor mounted on the back of a cement lorry to fluidise the cement and pump it directly into the bulk road tanker. This was not ideal as the wagons spent a lot of time sitting in sidings and not earning revenue.

This changed when bulk cement silos were built in Cork, Waterford Athenry Tullamore and Sligo. All were up and running by 1980 and from then on all cement was dispatched in block trains either from Limerick or Platin. In the early days the bogie bulk cement wagons only ran Platin to Cork as they were too heavy for the branches. All the others were supplied by bubbles.

The only exception that I remember was Tegral in Athy who at the time were owned by Irish cement. Wagons were shunted down the siding and left until they were unloaded. They built a storage silo sufficient to take a full trainload in the mid 80's.

During this period Cabra cement depot was closed for several years due to a strike by operatives, but when it reopened it never got back its market share as most Dublin customers had got used to driving direct to Platin to load

 

[Patrick Davey]

The railcar photo is suggesting Desertmartin on the Draperstown line.......

[jhb171achill]

1 hour ago, bufferstop said:

That's actually Claremorris, not Castlebar, but the interesting part is what is a bubble doing parked in Claremorris in 1976?

I've never seen one parked there before, and I thought itcould only handle bagged cement?

Was it common to discharge straight to a truck/mixer so that a customer could order cement in bulk via single wagon loads?

I know the occasional one worked through on the Burma Road goods.

Yes, you’re right - it IS indeed Claremorris - I didn’t mean to write Castlebar! Me being stupid. 

.....caption corrected accordingly, thanks for pointing it out! I had arrived there from Ballina (a 141 + one laminate + one Park Royal + Tin Van) to change into the up Westport.....

I seem to recall CIE cement lorries there. I think I may have a pic to back this up, so I will check.

I remember the original grey bubbles on the GN main line heading for Grosvenor Road in the 1969-72 period. I wonder how they were unloaded there too?

By 1976 when I took that pic, the Burma Road was still fully connected and signalled at Claremorris (and the other end, I believe), but nothing had been along it for the previous nine months since closure.

13 minutes ago, Patrick Davey said:

The railcar photo is suggesting Desertmartin on the Draperstown line.......

Could well be....

Edited April 14, 2020 by jhb171achill

[bufferstop]

Thanks for that  mfjoc and jhb, very interesting