Kingsbridge - workbench

[Noel]

34 minutes ago, Barl said:

Great job on the GSV so far Noel! I found the roof vents, fuel tank details and fuel filler points to be among the most awkward parts to get right. 

 

Looking forward to seeing the finished article

Hi Barl.  Thanks.  I'd like to get the roof detail right rather than just copy from photos of other models like the Silverfox GSV, I'd prefer if possible to look at roof photos of actual GSVs like 3185, but so far I haven't found any decent or close enough photos on the internet.  Most photos seem to be from ground level or side on at distance.  Cheers.  Noel

[Weshty]

I did a GSV this time 10 years ago (good god but time flies).  I used the Bachmann BSK as a donor.  it is a lovely kit to use as it had the correct bogies.  More importantly, the sides click off and allows you to cut them and swap them around and recycle all of the kit with a minimum of filler.  I took a photo of the cuts to be done so I'll see if I can root it out and post it up.

 

Mayner's comment has reminded me that I need to send my irish commonwealth bogies off to the moulders, and get the brass etches for them out and available.

[Glenderg]

There's a list as long as yourself to be done when making the GSV's, or any of the variants. My reply was for the benefit of the community, not just for this thread.

I believe the photo below is from RedRich, and should be of use. R. 

[Noel]

58 minutes ago, Glenderg said:

There's a list as long as yourself to be done when making the GSV's, or any of the variants. My reply was for the benefit of the community, not just for this thread.

I believe the photo below is from RedRich, and should be of use. R. 

Thanks Richie.  That photo is exactly what I was looking for.  Noel

PS: Thanks also to original photographer @RedRich (or whoever took it).  Great shot.

Edited November 1, 2017 by Noel
attempt to reference member id in post

[jhb171achill]

Superb work so far. I would agree with Mayner, however, regarding the full van. With your skills at adapting old plastic carriages as above, I'd say a new-build would be well within your skills and a much better outcome.

On the subject of finish, and you'll get a clue from the photo above, bogie passenger vans such as this tended to almost inevitably be very, very weathered, compared to the generally very clean finish of passenger-carrying vehicles.

[Noel]

Back to the GSV.  Ok how to make the louvered side vents for these.  Two options so going to try both just for the heck of it because I plan to do another GSV 3173 in the future, so may as well figure it out now.

• Make from scratch using strips of styrene
• Use the sides of plastic CD cases

Cut strips the same way I used to cut balsa strips and assemble them on sticky masking tape before gluing from the back

 

Glad to see my old balsa strip cutter still works

 

OR, use the ribbed sides of plastic CD case.  When painted up these may more than pass the duck test.  Will see what the styrene versions look like tomorrow.

 

Next up start the roof details and under frame mods

[Noel]

Tried two sample variants of louvered side vents for the GSV.  Not entirely happy with either.  First on left a) is scratch made from overlapping styrene strips glued together, the second on right b) uses off cuts from CD jewel case. Obviously both options will need a thin frame around them.  Any visual preferences for either or suggestions?

[Dhu Varren]

Noel, I too have used the plastic strip method, but with a better result than you have ended up with. I built up the grille on a piece of plasticard, using a solvent like Mek-Pak or similar to glue each strip to it, ensuring that each strip was positioned exactly before applying the solvent.

The other method I have used successfully, is to scribe a piece of plasticard with a Junior hacksaw blade, over and over again. This gives an even sppearance to the grille, and if you look closely, each slat is slightly angled, as are the teeth on the blade. The grille on the picture below was made using this method twenty eight years ago.

 

[Noel]

Thanks @Dhu Varren That's really useful.  I may try another tack.

[Weshty]

Can I suggest overlapping  2mm lining strip (which is sticky on one side), and cutting to size?  If you make it 2-3 " long then it enables better alignment.

[Weshty]

Might have to consider a set of brass sides and all the peripherals gubbins...

[flange lubricator]

That sounds like a great idea for kit Weshty , a fret with the vents (or complete sides) , the roof covers , the filler pipe casing and the fuel tanks.

[Noel]

1 hour ago, Weshty said:

Can I suggest overlapping  2mm lining strip (which is sticky on one side), and cutting to size?  If you make it 2-3 " long then it enables better alignment.

Thanks for the useful tip Des.  What is 2mm lining strip?  Is it styrene strips and what thickness are they?  I tried to use masking tape upside down to hold the styrene strips in place, but it just didn't stick well enough due to the narrow angle of contact the sides of the strips came into contact with the tape. 

1 hour ago, Weshty said:

Might have to consider a set of brass sides and all the peripherals gubbins...

Now that sounds like an interesting proposition.  You may have to decide which donor to target them for, as I understand Bachmann, Hornby, Triang, Lima and Replica BR Mk1 coach sides are not all the same length.  Presume you'd be doing the more popular BSK 3185 variant rather than the rarer BCK variant like RPSI 3173.

[Weshty]

1 hour ago, flange lubricator said:

That sounds like a great idea for kit Weshty , a fret with the vents (or complete sides) , the roof covers , the filler pipe casing and the fuel tanks.

Oh, it would be the complete sides, to make things easier.  and all periperals.  Not worth doing otherwise 

[Junctionmad]

I have a nice method for generating these grills , using a scriber and a x-y table , I think I posted it on my workbench somewhere 

[Weshty]

Noel,

 

The strip I use is Model Technics Trimline  self adhesive coach lining

 

regads

Des

[Noel]

Was distracted running trains a few evenings ago when coupling let fly as B181 was hauling mixed goods traffic on the lower level, half the train left behind, me distracted B181 ran around the layout and ran into the back of the other half of its train knocking the 20ft Bells off their skeletal flats.  

I'd always intended to put some sort of studs or mounts to stop containers moving around. I don't like the idea of gluing them on or double sided tape as I wanted the ability to run the flats empty or with different loads.  Normally gravity kept the 20ft containers on top of the flats, but the little mishap forced me to act and add studs to the skeletal flats and holes in the underside of the 20ft Bell containers.  Used painted cocktail sausage sticks cut to size with a jig for the four holes.  In the end I only put two studs on each wagon as that was enough to stop them moving around.

Anyway a brief distraction from the GSV and weathering the rest of my IRM Cement Bubbles 

[Noel]

Beet production.  In the middle of other concurrent projects I've started on the first half of a rake of single beet wagons. Primed today prior to tweaking, painting and fitting to chassis. Having a few small projects on the go at the same time can be very productive because while you are waiting for bits, or glue, paints to cure, etc, you can swap between projects and keep things moving along.  

 

I understand CIE had over 2000 of these wagons in their 'heyday' when they were used as both general purpose open goods wagons as well as for beat traffic. They were also used instead of flats to transport CIE containers as well as transport agri machinery, tractors, cars, cable drums, etc.

Edited February 15, 2019 by Noel
beet v beat

[burnthebox]

On 8 November 2017 at 9:55 PM, Noel said:

Was distracted running trains a few evenings ago when coupling let fly as B181 was hauling mixed goods traffic on the lower level, half the train left behind, me distracted B181 ran around the layout and ran into the back of the other half of its train knocking the 20ft Bells off their skeletal flats.  

I'd always intended to put some sort of studs or mounts to stop containers moving around. I don't like the idea of gluing them on or double sided tape as I wanted the ability to run the flats empty or with different loads.  Normally gravity kept the 20ft containers on top of the flats, but the little mishap forced me to act and add studs to the skeletal flats and holes in the underside of the 20ft Bell containers.  Used painted cocktail sausage sticks cut to size with a jig for the four holes.  In the end I only put two studs on each wagon as that was enough to stop them moving around.

Anyway a brief distraction from the GSV and weathering the rest of my IRM Cement Bubbles 

 

Hi Noel, only seeing this now, for what's it's worth, if it's  possible, if the doors open you might be able to  put something inside to render some weight which might help in weighing the wagon for movement ,, 

btb

 

[Noel]

14 minutes ago, burnthebox said:

 

Hi Noel, only seeing this now, for what's it's worth, if it's  possible, if the doors open you might be able to  put something inside to render some weight which might help in weighing the wagon for movement ,, 

btb

 

Hi Paul.  Weight isn't a problem, the skeletal wagons run really well and never derail, even when running just the wagons without the containers on board.  But your right I may add weight to the containers to make the rake heavier and run with less coupler snatching.  The C-Rail container floors are snap fit and pop off easily, so adding a bit of weight is easy.  The reason for my original post was to explain how I stopped the containers falling off the flats. Noel

C-Rail container floors are snap-fit and come off easily.

Edited November 16, 2017 by Noel
Lexdysia

[Jimbo325ci]

Nice work Noel! I’m working on the maroon gsv myself - lots of cut and shut! I’m starting to resent  the fill, sand, fill sand, prime, fill sand routine lol

[JasonB]

Nice work on the skeletal flats Noel,the Bell's will look great sitting on them.You've the right idea working on a few projects at the same time,its good to have the option to go back and forth,working on the same thing for long periods becomes repetitive and you can end up loosing interest.

[Noel]

13 hours ago, Jimbo325ci said:

Nice work Noel! I’m working on the maroon gsv myself - lots of cut and shut! I’m starting to resent  the fill, sand, fill sand, prime, fill sand routine lol

Resent? - Me too Jim.  Thanks to Eoin's powers of persuasion @murrayec I have removed the ugly moulded plastic door grab rails, and drilled holes for proper wire ones.  Fiddle, faddle, file'n'cut, fettle, fattle, cut'n'file, sand'n'paint, go back to go, do not pass go, be traped here for eternity.  

Or as Spook once said: "It's life, Jim, but not as we know it"

Back working on the roof and under frame tweaks.

[Noel]

Progress on GSV conversion is slow but on going.  A bit of work on battery box, diesel tank and steps.  Got the B5 bogie kits made up and new bogie swivel mounts made at the correct ride height.  Finding this chipping away with plastic quite therapeutic.

 

Holes drilled for wire hand rails at guards door.

 

The lima bogie mount had to be drilled out and new swivel mounts added so the B5 bogies can easily snap fit in place for easy removal.

Edited November 18, 2017 by Noel
OCD

[Noel]

Started on the other side.  Some bits to add, surrounds, then more filling and sanding.  Still to fit buffers and gangways.

 

 

[Noel]

One of the down sides to converting a Lima mk1 is the roof is made of plastic glazing and its a pig to cut compared to plastic.  The photo is self explanatory.  Taking a break, had enough of GSV, going to watch a movie.  Lots more to do but there's no grass to cut this time of year.

[flange lubricator]

very interesting work well done

 

[JasonB]

Very impressive work Noel, really enjoying watching this progress.Can't wait to see this when it's finally finished.

[Noel]

Roof primed for first sand'n'fill.  Trying to get the roof 'gubbins' looking vaguely similar to pics I have of actual GSV roofs.  

 

First prime coat before the vent and other roof bits are added

 

New diesel tank, battery box, and louvers primed.  Holes drilled for door grab rails.  Every time I think I getting closer to the finish line I see more that needs to be done.   At some stage I'll have to call a halt and be content with the Lima conversion.  Louvers and water fillers need framing, and the twiddley bits for the roof need adding (air intake, exhaust, boiler overflow vent, etc).

[Noel]

2nd hand Bachmann BCK for £16 arrived from Hattons today as a donor for another GSV conversion, this time RPSI 3173 in maroon.  I am tempted to spray the current Lima BSK GSV conversion in the RPSI blue livery planned for 3185 when its overhauled is completed.

Current Lima BSK project on top.  Planned Bachmann BSK below, with option for cut'n'shut plastic mods or optionally brass sides from Bill Bedford (Mousa Models) seen below.  The brass sides looks rather flat, whereas the Bachmann plastic has a lot of relief detail as well as flush glaze windows.  

[Jimbo325ci]

It’s coming along nicely Noel. I am using the same donor for 3173. Im sure you are aware but those brass sides have an additional set of double doors which aren’t on the RPSI coach. Maybe you could liberate the brass grills for use with the Bachman  though?!

[Noel]

17 minutes ago, Jimbo325ci said:

It’s coming along nicely Noel. I am using the same donor for 3173. Im sure you are aware but those brass sides have an additional set of double doors which aren’t on the RPSI coach. Maybe you could liberate the brass grills for use with the Bachman  though?!

Hi Jim.  Thanks, yes on the brass sides I had noticed the extra double doors to the right of the guards door on the lower etch which should be just a single door. As I have two BCK donors I may try plastic cut'n'glue using the sides from both for the first 3173, and then use the brass sides with the 2nd Bachmann chassis and roof. Or alternatively if Des has his brass sides available in the near future I could try those instead, especially if they have relief features such as window frames, door hinges and handles, etc. Then find an eBay home for the spare as I won't need more that one 3173. I'm just loving this learning curve and all the experimentation. Takes lots of time but that's half the leisure and relaxation benefit. Noel

[StevieB]

I’m assuming that the brass sides are Bill Bedford etches, in which case they represent the BGSV as originally constructed, although photos of the prototype have the double doors closer to the guards door than on the etches.

Stephen

[Jimbo325ci]

Agreed about the experimenting and learning - as long as you have patience it is very enjoyable. I don’t have the room for a layout so building is the part I enjoy for now, and I’ve recently discovered audiobooks which I play in the background! 

What filler are you using? I’d be inclined to get some perfect plastic putty to the sides where you’ve already filled just to give a smooth finish. Once you get the paint on there that bit of roughness will stand out I think.

I’ve borrowed the double doors from a Bachman BSK which I was planning on using for 3185 to ease the process much like you are suggesting! Will either find another donor or scratch the replacements for 3185. 

Looking forward to seeing the rest of the build! 

[Noel]

6 hours ago, Jimbo325ci said:

What filler are you using? I’d be inclined to get some perfect plastic putty to the sides where you’ve already filled just to give a smooth finish. Once you get the paint on there that bit of roughness will stand out I think.

Hi Jim.  I've been using Humbrol model filler, but it dries far too fast during application.  By chance I gave it a second treatment last night.  I need to thin it with some poly liquid so I can spread thiner quantities slowly with precision before it starts to get sticky.

6 hours ago, Jimbo325ci said:

I’ve borrowed the double doors from a Bachman BSK which I was planning on using for 3185 to ease the process much like you are suggesting! Will either find another donor or scratch the replacements for 3185. 

That's the plan, use the plastic sides from both BCK donors to make up one plastic GSV (BCK derivative like 3173), and use either Mousa or SSMs brass sides with the other donor (i.e. which had its sides robbed), but still has chassis, ends and roof.

Does anybody have an interior layout diagram or drawing of either GSV derivative?