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mm121 Sound decoder

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I have two 121 locos on order, black with white stripes. Which sound decoders do I need for these locos, EDM645 or EDM567?,or is there any difference?.

Thanks,

Controller.

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From a post on page 15 of the Murphys Models 121 Class thread:

MM0567 Class 121 DCC sound chip  SRP €125.00   EMD 8-567CR NT (Sound Decoder representing the Sound for these Locomotives when delivered with their  *GM 567 CA 8-Cylinder, twin bank, blower scavenged, developing 950 hp gross at 835 rpm, 875 hp traction. - Prior to engine transplants) 

MM0645 Class 121 DCC sound chip  SRP €125.00   EMD 8-645E NT (Sound Decoder representing the Sound of these Locomotives from Transplanted Engines. Engines from from withdrawn C Class (201) Locomotives were installed in  Class 121 Class Locomotives as and when it became necessary to replace engine power packs. *GM B-645 E 8 cylinder. twin bank, blower scavenged, developing 1,100 hp gross at 900 rpm, 1,040 hp traction.

*Information taken from  Irish Locomotives and Rolling Stock of Coras Iompair Eireann and Northern Ireland Railways - O.Doyle ans S. Hirsch

I'd reckon the 567 sound chip would be applicable to the older livery you have ordered, but I stand to be corrected on that

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2 minutes ago, controller said:

I have two 121 locos on order, black with white stripes. Which sound decoders do I need for these locos, EDM645 or EDM567?,or is there any difference?.

Thanks,

Controller.

The difference in sound is negligible to many ears, but I guess the Black&Tan livery (ie black, white band, tan solebar) which ran from 1963 to about 1974-6 was powered by the original EMD567 engines, The other thought that occurred to me from experience is that running two locos in consist both with sound on can sound a bit dizzy and confused. Some sound decoder projects allow you to vary the engine note using a CV setting (ie so two locos do not sound identical). Personally when I run pairs of baby GMs in consist I only turn the sound on in the lead loco, because it just sounds better than two. But that's just me. Others might quite like both with sound on. WheelTappersDCCsound who did the decoders for all my baby GMs offered 3 engine pitch versions so that in consist a pair would not sound identical. I am making an assumption that the Murphy model commissioned chip may have a CV setting to facilitate something similar. There are subtle things when consisting sound locos, for instance you only want the horn to sound on the lead loco, but you want both to make braking noises at the same time, and only the tail loco to make uncoupling noises or buffer clash when commanded, etc. Then there's the whole area of running lights on a consist, set up for running as a pair hauling a train with brake lights at the end when travelling locos only (ie light engines) so brake lights on trailing loco, etc. All to look forward to exploring when the new models hit the rails.

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14 minutes ago, controller said:

I have two 121 locos on order, black with white stripes. Which sound decoders do I need for these locos, EDM645 or EDM567?,or is there any difference?.

Thanks,

Controller.

The 121's were fitted with the EMD567 at that time.

1 minute ago, Noel said:

The difference in sound is negligible to many ears, but I guess the Black&Tan livery (ie black, white band, tan solebar) which ran from 1963 to about 1974-6 was powered by the original EMD567 engines, The other thought that occurred to me from experience is that running two locos in consist both with sound on can sound a bit dizzy and confused. Some sound decoder projects allow you to vary the engine note using a CV setting (ie so two locos do not sound identical). Personally when I run pairs of baby GMs in consist I only turn the sound on in the lead loco, because it just sounds better than two. But that's just me. Others might quite like both with sound on. WheelTappersDCCsound who did the decoders for all my baby GMs offered 3 engine pitch versions so that in consist a pair would not sound identical. I am making an assumption that the Murphy model commissioned chip may have a CV setting to facilitate something similar. There are subtle things when consisting sound locos, for instance you only want the horn to sound on the lead loco, but you want both to make braking noises at the same time, and only the tail loco to make uncoupling noises or buffer clash when commanded, etc. Then there's the whole area of running lights on a consist, set up for running as a pair hauling a train with brake lights at the end when travelling locos only (ie light engines) so brake lights on trailing loco, etc. All to look forward to exploring when the new models hit the rails.

The pitch of the engine sound can be tweaked up or down on the Loksound decoders. I use the Lokprogrammer to do mine but it can be done with CV's easily enough. The same with the various sound functions, you can set up a loco so that only certain sounds will play while the loco is in consist. I do this with my own locos.

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Thank you gentlemen, EMD 567 are the ones I will order. Thank you for all that information. I think I will buy two and tinker around with the CVs and see what happens. Lots to look forward to. Thanks again gentlemen.

Controller.

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3 hours ago, controller said:

Thank you gentlemen, EMD 567 are the ones I will order. Thank you for all that information. I think I will buy two and tinker around with the CVs and see what happens. Lots to look forward to. Thanks again gentlemen.

Controller.

The sound of two decoders becoming slightly weird is easily sorted on the ESU Lokprogrammer. Just adjust the speed of the prime mover sound slot by as little as one percent and the problem is completely solved.
If you have a Lokprogrammer and this problem occurs when you get the two chips and you are unsure I will try and put together a few screenshots to help you out. 

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Thanks Lads, Thanks for all the info. Just a couple of questions, can the ESU Lokprogrammer adjust settings on all decoders, or just ESU decoders?. If so where is the best place to order them from, and around how much are they?.

Thanks,

Controller.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, controller said:

Thanks Lads, Thanks for all the info. Just a couple of questions, can the ESU Lokprogrammer adjust settings on all decoders, or just ESU decoders?. If so where is the best place to order them from, and around how much are they?.

Thanks,

Controller.

I got my LokProgrammer from https://www.modellbahnshop-lippe.com for €135 plus €3 postage.  I buy all my decoders from there also Lenz + ESU (ie for better price). LokProgrammer will only work with ESU decoders. However you may not need a LokProgrammer as you may be able to adjust some CV settings using your DCC controllers test track outputs. Blank LokSound V5 decoders are €95 from MBL. If you are prepared to go through the learning curve, you can make your own diesel loco DCC sound projects, or far quicker make small changes to existing projects. ESU publish a large range of sound projects including for Murphy Model 071 locos and 201 locos. I got baby GM LokSound decoders for my 141/181/121 locos from http://www.wheeltappersdccsounds.co.uk. Its relatively easy to do things like add Irish loco horns to a USA loco project. WheelTappers made up custom 121 decoders for me with additional features including 3 types of rail clank/flange squeal, distant horns, cascading buffer clash simulating a loose coupled train stopping, cascading coupling snatch simulating a loose coupled train starting off, etc. Personally what was really important was the driving characteristics such as coasting, braking over realistic distances, slow acceleration and notching/trashing simulating a heavy train starting off. No use having an ultra scale looking model if it behaves in an unprototypical manner like a scalextric toy accelerating faster than a Tesla Model S :) 

PS: If rolling your own, don't forget the added complexity of configuring lights and light mappings.

Edited by Noel
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Thanks Noel. I am glad I asked first before I went buying a LokProgammer. I have two 121 sound decoders ordered and payed for from Marks. I also have an A class ordered from IRM.I have two 071 and a 201 which are fitted with sound decoders. I have a couple of other small locos. Not a huge collection. I don't even have a permanent layout. When funds allow, I will look into wheeltappers for decoders for my two 141s. Like you say , I may be able to adjust some CV settings using my DCC controller. No doubt when all locos are delivered, I will be back to look for your help again.

Thanks,

Controller.

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