Ready to run OO Gauge brass Irish Steam locos.

[Mayner]

I am currently looking at the viability at producing a ready to run OO gauge brass steam loco in conjunction with a Far Eastern OEM manufacturer of high quality brass locos and rolling stock for the American, European and British markets. 

I am considering the Midland "Cattle Engine" as a first batched produced model of an Irish steam locomotive as it fits in with my own personal interests and its a good example of a large modern (1920s) mixed traffic design in contrast to the smaller Midland and GSWR "standard" goods types.

The model would be produced as a limited edition with each model individually certified and are likely to be a sound investment.

 

I am open to considering some of the larger GNR express passenger classes if there is insufficient interest in a Cattle Engine

https://www.surveymonkey.com/r/HD3TB6Z

[murphaph]

First of all, fair play for even considering this John!

Survey done. I won't lie, the price mentioned is pretty juicy and of course I understand why it would be so, so that's not a criticism in the slightest. It would be a stretch for me personally but if I was presented with Merlin or Slieve Gullion in preserved condition I would be hard pressed not to buy.

I only buy models of 1990s prototypes or stuff I can repurpose for that era. It's a rule I've made for myself to avoid financial ruin lol! I would know that such a loco would genuinely be a one off so I'd almost certainly pull the trigger.

I personally would not be interested in anything that could not plausibly run in a 90s scene so it would have to be something that made it to preservation for me.

Wishing you the best of luck whatever way the project goes!

[Ironroad]

You are to be commended for this. However, I have to admit while I completely understand the price it is at the limit of where I might be tempted to go.  I would definitely go there (even plus a bit) for Maeve. 

I'm interested in virtually everything that ran in the period 1950 - 2000 but even in that I need to set some limits and accordingly basically ruled out Northern Steam but you are seriously tempting me to go there, for sure I would not be able to resist a model of No.4.

I'll complete the survey for you. 

Wishing you the very best of luck with this.

 

[mphoey]

survey done

is brass the cheapest option open to you 

after all looking at what oo works does might give you other options and maybe even make the price better for you to sell

 

[leslie10646]

Likewise - like Ironroad, I take an interest in most things on the Irish Railway modelling tracks.

So, as I've already told John, yes to everything except the S Class (of which I have three built from Terry McDermott's wonderful kits !).

Good luck JM.

Leslie

[DiveController]

Yes, absolutely!

[jhb171achill]

Depending on how many shekels I have left after a house move in two days' time, it is certainly something which would interest me. Having said that, it's worth remembering that our lovely friends in taxation will add €120 to it, for sending it here from Noo Zealand........

Maybe as a special treat, but I have indicated willingness in the survey. As John says, an investment.

[Rob]

Hope the new gaff has a decent space for the trains !!

[jhb171achill]

10 minutes ago, Rob said:

Hope the new gaff has a decent space for the trains !!

It will have, Rob - though in an attic..... There's about 15ft square to play with. But for how long can I manage the steps? Need to get it all done pronto pronto; the clock ticks onward!

[leslie10646]

Sure, JB, Stannah Lifts are great!

[LARNE CABIN]

Have completed your survey Mayner, and like a few replies above, although the price quoted would be at my absolute upper limit, I would be prepared to pay that as a one off for a top class model of a GNR(I) S Class. As Ironroad mentioned above, a WT Class 2-6-4T would be irresistible! I am just waiting on the first brave manufacturer to produce one (maybe IRM, hint, hint!). I know Bill Bedford did start down that road at one time, but it didn't seem to go anywhere!

Anyway, I have watched carefully your previous endeavours and wish you every success in this venture.

[jhb171achill]

2 hours ago, LARNE CABIN said:

Have completed your survey Mayner, and like a few replies above, although the price quoted would be at my absolute upper limit, I would be prepared to pay that as a one off for a top class model of a GNR(I) S Class. As Ironroad mentioned above, a WT Class 2-6-4T would be irresistible! I am just waiting on the first brave manufacturer to produce one (maybe IRM, hint, hint!). I know Bill Bedford did start down that road at one time, but it didn't seem to go anywhere!

Anyway, I have watched carefully your previous endeavours and wish you every success in this venture.

A UTA "Jeep" is essential! I would take two.........even though they're not my favourite locos by far, and my model world is deep south CIE!

[Mayner]

To clear a few points.

The tradition of commissioning highly detailed brass models of locos and rolling stock arose in the Far East during the late 1940s early 50s with American service men commissioning models from Japanese and Korean craftsmen, with some of the business shifting to Hong Kong & China. 

These models sell at a premium above plastic or die cast ready to run https://www.brasstrains.com/Classic/Trains/Builders/7/Ajin?showsold=True

There are a number of European manufacturers like Fulgurex Precision Models http://www.fulgurex.ch/en/index.html  like some shops its not polite to ask about the price if you are buying a model from Fulgurex or Aster.

I am considering brass as the likely level of demand even for an 800 or a GNR Compound is unlikely to support a plastic injection (1000+) or die cast model (5000+).

The big question is whether there is sufficient demand to sell the minimum order quantity of 500 locos.

The survey price range is inclusive of UK vat but is based on preliminary costings, an 800 or even a Compound  is likely to be considerably more expensive than a large inside cylinder 0-6-0 due to the greater number of individual parts requiring assembly and the complex liveries.

The results of the survey so far have been interesting with 35 respondents so far with just over 60% prepared to consider paying £4-500 for a brass rtr steam loco with over 50% prepared to consider buying a Cattle Engine.

Recent results has shown a shift in preference form an express passenger to a mixed traffic loco with just under 60% showing a preference for a mixed traffic loco while there was a slightly higher level of interest in an express passenger loco earlier in the survey.

Respondents have shown a consistently higher level of interest in a Compound  than in a Vs or S like 171. 

I selected the 3 GNR express locos both because both 85 and 171 are preserved and in active operation and their similarity in size to a Cattle Engine and because traditionally the GNR was considered to be a progressive and enterprising company which traditionally had a larger enthusiast base than CIE, I also convinced myself that I saw a big blue steam loco with smoke deflectors crossing Gormanstown Viaduct at speed when I was about 5 or 6 something which would be very hard to resist although my first loyalty lies with the Midland my Grandfathers railway.

 

Edited October 10, 2020 by Mayner

[murphaph]

I guess there's a lot more RTR stock (Cravens) that a preserved loco can haul on a layout right now. Perhaps as the market grows there will be stock from the late steam, early diesel age to haul. 

[DJ Dangerous]

I've filled out the survey, and would second a few members in a preserved loco being my preference.

Thank you for the time and effort that you've put into this!

[DiveController]

Survey done.

[Mike 84C]

Thank you for putting all the time and effort into this project John. As an older person! the price point you talk of is at my upper limit, its the fixed income thing and my   body is getting toooo old to generate much outside interest!

   To take numbers of sales and I have no real idea what 00works predict to sell but the way all their Irish locos have flown off the shelves must indicate a strong , for its small size, market.

Good luck with the project I hope it succeeds and as we spoke of before, the Cattle Engine does it for me.

[murphaph]

@Mayner would you be considering including an easy path to 21mm in the design?

[Mayner]

On 11/10/2020 at 6:46 PM, murphaph said:

@Mayner would you be considering including an easy path to 21mm in the design?

Incorporating 21mm compatibility into the design would add considerably to the cost of an already very expensive model with little or no added value to the majority of prospective customers.

The main object of the survey is to assess the potential level of demand for a rtr OO gauge brass steam loco to see if OEM manufacture is worth pursuing.

 

[murphaph]

Thx for clarifying. Quite understandable, given how much more difficult it is to regauge steam locos compared to diesel.