If you could save one loco..

[Branchline121]

If you could save one steam locomotive from being scrapped in the past and have it preserved, which would it be? Personally the biggest contenders for me would be a K1 (preferably one of the Broadstone examples) or a J26 for MGW representation. I would’ve also liked to see a VS preserved, namely 207 (because it’s named after the Boyne) or maybe Bulleid’s CC1, purely because of how unusual it was.

I suppose we’re lucky that any were saved, if it weren’t for the preservation efforts of the ‘60s there mightn’t have been any left at all.

[Mol_PMB]

I think you've covered the best ideas already in your first post.

CC1 would be truly unique with no similar survivors worldwide. Probably the most interesting option for a static exhibit.

This may be heresy but I'm not so excited about another big GNR 4-4-0 as we have a nice set of 3 already.

I like your ideas of an MGWR loco to fill that gap, and for mainline service the Woolwich would indeed be the obvious one, however a J26 / E would be more practical at Downpatrick. But for true MGWR style I'd pick a 2-4-0 tender loco with the distinctive Atock 'fly away' cab. Not actually too much bigger and heavier than a J26 but much more style, and preserved 2-4-0s are scarce.

 

[Flying Snail]

In addition to those listed above, a GSWR 4-4-0 like a class 52 would be one I'd like to see saved. 

[GSR 800]

19 minutes ago, Mol_PMB said:

I think you've covered the best ideas already in your first post.

CC1 would be truly unique with no similar survivors worldwide. Probably the most interesting option for a static exhibit.

This may be heresy but I'm not so excited about another big GNR 4-4-0 as we have a nice set of 3 already.

I like your ideas of an MGWR loco to fill that gap, and for mainline service the Woolwich would indeed be the obvious one, however a J26 / E would be more practical at Downpatrick. But for true MGWR style I'd pick a 2-4-0 tender loco with the distinctive Atock 'fly away' cab. Not actually too much bigger and heavier than a J26 but much more style, and preserved 2-4-0s are scarce.

 

I'd be inclined to align quite closely, Mol! Midland represent!

I think I'd go with a G2 myself, though as rebuilt. I think the crews would thank me!

Regarded as the 'best' MGWR locomotives, they are surely the most fit to represent the company in preservation.

 

 

 

[leslie10646]

@Branchline121 hit the nail on the head with No.207. A Woolwich mogul would have been very useful, but I understand they were rough to ride on which wouldn't sit well with modern crews.

@GSR 800 makes a good point regarding the Midland 2-4-0s, but if we had one, it wouldn't be on the main line any more as she could not pull enough fast enough - like our two J15s. But she'd be perfect for Maam Cross. Jim - you could build a glass fibre "Flyaway Cab" lookalike and put an electric motor in it (with a smoke unit of course)..........

Back to Boyne which is my "Win the Euromillions Jackpot" engine. Lord O'Neill would have bought her but was advised that she would be very restricted on route availability - which was true at the time. BUT with more modern track and heavier diesels the Game changed - No.85 with the same axle-loading has been almost everywhere! The saddest decision in Irish preservation history.

Like everything else in the 1960s, we had no money to preserve anything.

No.171 was RENTED for a decade or so.

No.186 was a gift (Thank-you CIE).

So was the Guinness engine - keep drinking the beer to say Thanks.

No.4 was the Bargain of Bargains when we bought her - oh that we'd had the money to buy TWO!

[Westcorkrailway]

I’ll still beat the Bandon Tank Drum for as long as I live. Problem is that it would only be useful for maynooth runs in the modern day preservation scene. A bit too hungry for Downpatrick. Even if the CRRS had preserved it in the mid 1960s, it’s hard to imagine how 464 would have survived to now unless treated like similar size loco lough Erne

 

That’s thinking with my heart, but with my brain I think by far the biggest gap would be for the MGWR E Class / J26. Not only would it give the Midland a deserved representation in preservation aside from coaches. it would also be practical, being perfect for Downpatrick’s Demands and not as hungry as some other monsters! Helpings it’s case for a new build is it’s also one of the best proportioned locos on this island. The class was also extremely well traveled, traveling to virtually every corner of the country, working alongside No. 90 in Cork ending up replacing it on the T&C section! 

  

[Mike 84C]

I would go for MGWR J5 Cattle engine. Somehow very Irish but, I'm also in the Bandon tank brigade.

[Metrovik]

Id go for something rather antiquated. The GSR N1. Possibly better recognised as the Waterford and Tramore 2-2-2. This engine lasted well into the 1930s becoming the last single wheeler in the UK or Ireland to see regular service. And I daresay, had it not rolled down an embankment and been damaged beyond repair, it would have lasted just long enough to have stood a decent chance of being preserved by Cie itself given its age.

[LNERW1]

The CC1 would obviously never run in preservation- no crews would even go near it if it wasn't their job- but to have it in a museum would be nice. On the operational side, the more EMD 645s I hear the better, so anything with that please!

[Killian Keane]

If I could go back in time? It would probably be the Hibernia, an unusual design even for the time and obviously significant in being the first loco in Ireland, then theres the Princess, the first loco built here 

In terms of something that stood a realistic chance of survival I would agree about the Waterford and Tramore 2-2-2 tank, or indeed a main line 2-4-0 such as the WLWR G3 or MGWR G2, the latter of course not only being the last main line 2-4-0 in Ireland but Europe in general

Edited August 28 by Killian Keane

[Horsetan]

My ideal list would be:

- one of the Caprotti 400s

- one of the 500s

- one K1

- one K1a

- the sole P1 2-6-2T

- a J26

- possibly the VS

...and obviously CC1. How could you not have that? CC1 would be a massive study aid for alternative fuels.

Edited August 28 by Horsetan

[Galteemore]

Biggest hole in preservation is probably a 4-4-0 from one of the Southern companies. The most gorgeous of all a WLWR Robinson in original livery ….other worthy nominees are an NCC 3’ gauge compound, a PP class or U, BCDR 2-4-0. In terms of what would be useful in modern steam ops round Dublin, a Bandon tank or Glover tank would earn their keep. 

[Mayner]

12 hours ago, Galteemore said:

Biggest hole in preservation is probably a 4-4-0 from one of the Southern companies. The most gorgeous of all a WLWR Robinson in original livery ….other worthy nominees are an NCC 3’ gauge compound, a PP class or U, BCDR 2-4-0. In terms of what would be useful in modern steam ops round Dublin, a Bandon tank or Glover tank would earn their keep. 

Back in the day (early 1980s) I hoped that the GSRPS would convert Qs Class 131 into a facimilie of a GSWR Coey 4-4-0, strangely 131 would have been closer to ex DSER 4-4-0 No 454 apparrently the actual loco was based on the GNR Q Class design.

At the time the GSRPS really appeared to be making progress as a preservation society.  Establishing a base at Mallow, the loan of 131 to the Society and the successful move of the loco to Mallow, acquiring and restoring carriages suitable for an Excursion Train operation. 

[Mol_PMB]

I remember the GSRPS stock at Mallow and Tralee, even the Ruston which reached Fenit. A sadly missed opportunity but ultimately the infrastructure is one of the most expensive aspects and all CIE’s branch lines were completely life-expired. 
Given the tourism focus in the Killarney/Kerry area I think Tralee-Fenit could have worked, but a branch line nearer Dublin would have been better. 

[josh_]

Id have to go with either one the 501 class diesels that ran along west clare as its so unique and would of looked well in dromod doing services or displayed

I would of like to see the 801 class that came from germany as it would of been a nice thing to see on galas in ITG if one was preserved 

More recently the mk3 push/pull (i know gricerous and its in unimaginable wreck) as it would of been paired well with former hsts that cold of been imported like what IE did and ran with them and been unique set but the only places to store such a set if it would be made would be inchicore or mullingar personally as inchicore would be perfect with the right equipment and mullingar as it has a long siding that was a section of the branch that went to athlone as far as the road bridge would be perfect too and likely cost effective to restore 

Would of been adored by many enthusiasts if a B4 bandon likely 464 which did its infamous IRRS tour to baltimore would of been perserved would also be a favourite among enthusiasts especially in the rebels county

 

[GSR 800]

19 minutes ago, josh_ said:

Id have to go with either one the 501 class diesels that ran along west clare as its so unique and would of looked well in dromod doing services or displayed

I would of like to see the 801 class that came from germany as it would of been a nice thing to see on galas in ITG if one was preserved 

More recently the mk3 push/pull (i know gricerous and its in unimaginable wreck) as it would of been paired well with former hsts that cold of been imported like what IE did and ran with them and been unique set but the only places to store such a set if it would be made would be inchicore or mullingar personally as inchicore would be perfect with the right equipment and mullingar as it has a long siding that was a section of the branch that went to athlone as far as the road bridge would be perfect too and likely cost effective to restore 

Would of been adored by many enthusiasts if a B4 bandon likely 464 which did its infamous IRRS tour to baltimore would of been perserved would also be a favourite among enthusiasts especially in the rebels county

 

Anything outside in Mullingar has been vandalised. Many of the carriages in the shed (now at Maam) likewise, because the railway terrace is a ruin.

There's a hole in the fence right before the Newbrook Road bridge you reference.

A forlorn looking graffitied Palvan(?) at Mullingar. The Mk3 would be similarly graced rapido.

Inchicore would be the only place, this is where the RPSI craven set is stored.

[josh_]

Its a shame but theres meant to be bogies off park royals or laminates down there 

 

And theres holes in the shed roof and everything

[228RiverOwenboy]

On 28/8/2025 at 3:10 PM, Branchline121 said:

If you could save one steam locomotive from being scrapped in the past and have it preserved, which would it be? Personally the biggest contenders for me would be a K1 (preferably one of the Broadstone examples) or a J26 for MGW representation. I would’ve also liked to see a VS preserved, namely 207 (because it’s named after the Boyne) or maybe Bulleid’s CC1, purely because of how unusual it was.

I suppose we’re lucky that any were saved, if it weren’t for the preservation efforts of the ‘60s there mightn’t have been any left at all.

I'd say either 500... or something from the 372 Class, those moguls definitely stood out, methinks.

[TheAccountOfMine]

Bit of a random pick I know, but I’d have to go for one of McDonnell’s “double-bogie[s],” as they were known by Inchicore men.
There were only two of this type built - 33, 34 - the former in late 1869, with the second engine following a few months later in 1870. Aside from their absolutely gorgeous appearance, they were the first single Fairlies in the world - an innovation to which McDonnell doesn’t get due credit for.
Similar back-tanks followed after these two, however they were built as conventional locos rather than being articulated: this was a result of the colossal royalties demanded by Fairlie. Thus the later back-tanks, which were likely intended to be Fairlies but altered mid-construction to a non-articulated set up to avoid royalties, were more rigid by comparison. 
Shortly after 33’s completion, the first of Fairlie’s Ffestiniog locos made headlines in the engineering press, undoubtedly overshadowing McDonnell’s engines, leaving them to be observed as a mere footnote. Having either 33 or 34 with us today would fill a gap in the history of locomotive technology, and represent one of Ireland’s lesser known contributions to it. 

[Mol_PMB]

Well, there has already been one successful project to build a replica single Fairlie, and there's another one in progress.

There's not really much more work in a broad gauge one than narrow gauge - all the same parts just a bit bigger.

In my experience, a single Fairlie is a very pleasant loco to work, smooth riding, free running, great ergonomics. An ideal branch passenger loco.

The boiler on 33 isn't too big or hungry, and it would go round the DCDR's corners* better than a rigid wheelbase.

 

*with apologies to the DCDR track gang, they're laid smoothly but the DCDR trainset does seem to have more radius 1 curves than straights.

[TheAccountOfMine]

22 minutes ago, Mol_PMB said:

Well, there has already been one successful project to build a replica single Fairlie, and there's another one in progress.

There's not really much more work in a broad gauge one than narrow gauge - all the same parts just a bit bigger.

In my experience, a single Fairlie is a very pleasant loco to work, smooth riding, free running, great ergonomics. An ideal branch passenger loco.

The boiler on 33 isn't too big or hungry, and it would go round the DCDR's corners* better than a rigid wheelbase.

 

*with apologies to the DCDR track gang, they're laid smoothly but the DCDR trainset does seem to have more radius 1 curves than straights.

Indeed, the precedent has been set for Fairlie new builds. The single Fairlie “Talieson” on the Ffestiniog was built in 1999, as a sort of replica / successor to the original “Talieson” which was broken up in 1924. The new engine incorporates the original reverser lever - so whether that makes it a replica or a very very comprehensive rebuilt, is for you to decide . McDonnell’s Fairlies didn’t actually feature flexible steam joints, at least not in the way Fairlie’s did: the pipes of McDonnell’s engines simply had enough flex in them so as not to break whenever the driving bogie shifted - undoubtedly a more precarious arrangement, though saved the fitters from the headache of having to keep flexible joints steam tight. That unique McDonnell Fairlie layout is the main reason I’d love to see a replica, as it would serve an educational role and show a more unusual side to loco engineering - compared to some of the more “nice to have” engines, such as a J26, which I love don’t get me wrong, but wasn’t an engine that broke any moulds or set new boundaries, whereas the “double-bogie[s]” were true unsung pioneers! 

[Mol_PMB]

At one stage it was thought the handbrake column was an original part, but it turned out to be from Moel Tryfan rather than Taliesin. 
The original chimney also survives but wasn’t used as it looked out of proportion- the replica is actually slightly over-scale. 
 

The FR Fairlies no longer use the flexible elbow joints (Merddin was the last to have them in the 1990s) and instead use flexible straight hoses with rigid elbows.

Now there is another team working on a Gowrie replica. 
https://www.gowrielocomotivetrust.com/

 

[Killian Keane]

The ffestiniog enginemen were extremely fond of their single Fairlies, it was remarked that if there were railways in heaven that they must use single Fairlies! 33/4 would be one Id be very interested to see, not that we'd likely see one on the main line now due to the very small water capacity, but Downpatrick or Maam Cross!

Edited 5 hours ago by Killian Keane

[Mol_PMB]

Whilst it would be well out of period for my modelling interests, I couldn’t resist one in model form. I suspect fitting the power bogie wheels into those splashers with enough space for bogie rotation and 21mm gauge would be a real challenge though, and there’s no space for over-size flanges!

The FR Fairlies have a maximum bogie rotation angle of 4.25 degrees in yaw, so the doubles are prohibited from sharply-curved sidings. In pitch they are even more fussy, and so they do not go on low-loaders. They are impossible to lift in one piece by crane too. So they don’t leave home.
Merddin has travelled over a million miles in nearly 150 years without ever going more than 25 miles from where it was built! There are still a few original bits - the nameplates have been polished so many times that their thickness is half what it once was.